talkmagic.co.uk

Truth is most people dont go out looking for secrets. Well some people do, and if they want to reveal them to masses, then they are stupid and ruin it for themself and others.

Magic is an art an entertainment...

I signed the petition

If, whenever a talkmagic member were to see a "magic exposed" (or to look for them) video on youtube, why don't we press the "flag as innapropriate" button underneath? If we all did that, youtube might get the message? I'm posting this as an idea, and have not tried this yet. Hopefully I can get a response from you and the mods as to if we should try it or not. (I don't think that this has been posted before, but if it has then I'm sorry for re-posting it!)

I was thinking about that... but I think that would just get those jerks to post more videos to tick us off that much more. But worth a try I get

cymru1991 wrote:If, whenever a talkmagic member were to see a "magic exposed" (or to look for them) video on youtube, why don't we press the "flag as innapropriate" button underneath? If we all did that, youtube might get the message? I'm posting this as an idea, and have not tried this yet. Hopefully I can get a response from you and the mods as to if we should try it or not. (I don't think that this has been posted before, but if it has then I'm sorry for re-posting it!)

I've tried and have flagged about 50 videos. I then tried to log in to youtube a week later and it told me my account had been permenently disabled. Youtube must think that I was just spamming and what I was alerting them to was not copyrighted stuff.

Dear youtube,
I am contacting you with regard to your policy of allowing "magic exposed" videos to be broadcast on your site. I, and many others, believe that this is wrong. Such videos can damage the magic industry, and should be removed from your site before people are able to view them.
Yours sincerely,
james "cymru1991"

This is a copy of a short (I was not able to fit any more into the box) e-mail that I have sent to youtube. I doubt that it will make much difference, but I will notify you of any replies.

EDIT
Thank you for contacting YouTube!

This is just an automated message to let you know that we have received
your email. We appreciate you bringing this to our attention and we'll
investigate. We'll follow up with you only if we require more information
or have additional information for you.

Regards,
The YouTube Team

I recieved this automated email straight away

supermagictom wrote:Has anyone posted this link on the E forums??

That would be alot of signatures.

edit : yeah they have, I checked.

They also had one member who had a pretty good idea, he said when we legitimate magicians upload a clip to youtube we should give it a random name and random tags. So then when we upload a clip to youtube, people can only find it if we give them a direct link.
Might also be a good idea to upload lots of 'empty' clips with the tags 'magic', ''sinful/indecent'' and ''exposure''. Then it would make the real exposure vids very hard to find.

Also I've had an idea for wikipedia, rather than deleting the info all together, couldn't we just change it in very subtle ways. Like for example change 'right hand' to 'left hand'. And 'little finger' to 'forefinger'. This might sound silly, but it would have the effect of where whenever a layman reads it he gets confused and thinks ''too complex, i'll leave the magicians too it''. Could also stop people from noticing it so easily that the page has been edited.

I just feel that magicians have always been crafty and sneaky in protecting our techniques in the past, why stop now?
Or am I just too desperate to stop exposure?

I think I'll try that actually. Get ready for some random blank videos on my youtube page.

some people on here are geniuses. I really like that wikipedia idea. and the blank vids. Wow.

QUICK EDIT

Removed the above post & link. ignore this!

just signed it. ban youtube from exposure!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

supermagictom:

Also I've had an idea for wikipedia, rather than deleting the info all together, couldn't we just change it in very subtle ways. Like for example change 'right hand' to 'left hand'. And 'little finger' to 'forefinger'. This might sound silly, but it would have the effect of where whenever a layman reads it he gets confused and thinks ''too complex, I'll leave the magicians too it''. Could also stop people from noticing it so easily that the page has been edited.

Good idea. The only problem I could see is if two magicians edited the same page, and ended up putting the info back as it was before.

cymru1991, I'm not a mod or anything on the forum, but I think you might want to avoid trouble from others by posting a tutorial even if it is to make a point.

In regards to this: Same old argument . . . exposure is terrible . . . blah blah blah . . . hurts starving magicians . . . blah blah blah . . . it's just like stealing . . . blah blah blah.

Thanks for that. Removed the link and the post. Hope I didn't offend/annoy anyone. Sorry to all.

I posted this as well on the penguin forum its about exposure as well.

Exposure, the double edged sword. Before we go any further I'm not debating any of the thoughts or opinions this is simply my opinion an quite frankly it may ruffle some feathers. What I'm talking about is accountability here. First and foremost I agree with a quote from my friend Daniel, there should only be two Magic shops in the world, and you should have to go on a quest to get there, one would require a scuba tank because its at the bottom of the ocean, and the other would require alot of climbing gear because its on top of a mountain some where beyond the nether regions.

Now back to accountability. Its obvious that people enjoy magic, but maybe he way people are presenting it is in the challenge of anothers wits. Magic is an art form and it requires years of dedication. I was a genius in the six grade when I did my simple routine for the cups and balls for friends. I was also a jerk for exposing the effect, and I should have been kicked in the cups for that one. None the less though things like this happen, because as kids we don't realize the responsability and accountability we have to the magic community. Mostly everyone knows the cups and balls has seen it and yet it still endures as one of the greatest magic miracles ever to be handed to us as magicians. Why because of dedication to the ideas of imagination. Though I know how its done, and I watch like a hawk to make sure people are doing it beyond subpar. I appreciate more when a magician knows how to pace and work this effect correctlty its all about naturalness and subtlety. Two things I see so many people lacking in there performance "this includes myself".

So where am I going with this, well once again this is about accountabilty
here which means that we as magicians owe to the art to make ourselves worthy of performing the art, this requires, love obsession,dedication and even a sense of who we are as an artist. So I'm even pointing the finger at myself. The magic isn't in the effects presented its in the performance. So how do we make the performance what it needs to be, by working at it testing it performing it and even trying to perfect it.We are the scientists of imagination.

The people exposing magic aren't magicians. They are thrill seekers looking to gain something from exposing anothers art form. Heres the double edged sword though. When I feel like magic is being challenged as a whole, even magic dealers and suppliers are responsable, or for that matter or even irresponsable in this matter. Kids buying "tricks" equals revenue in there pockets, so you have to ask yourself, are they doing this for the love of an art or to make a quick few bucks to pay the bills. Any I repeat any secret you want in magic is out there it just depends on what your willing to sacrifce "money" integrity, exposure, but if you are an artist, this handling doesn't become a sacrifice it becomes a part of the required dedication for your art. Your here on this board because you are dedicated to your art, will all of you in the younger crowd last, odds are doubtfull, you will move on to other things in life bigger better, more normalacy, the what ever and where are yet to be determined. But your going to remember all those tricks, books, effects and watch them performed sometime some where and you will say to yourself, I know how he did that. But remember this so do I and a good magician never tells.

The other thoughts pertaining to this involve the evolution of magic, unfortunatley if it wasn't for exposure, there would be no reason for new devices, methods, handlings and props to even exist hence the double edged sword. So you can go on pretending that your upset about exposure but you hold as much if not more responsability to others to further the art of magic. How do you do this, well its time to try and reason with the people exposing magic. Bring you freind to the side and make it a point and tell him hey if you want to learn magic maybe we should start a club, and get together and practice but if all he wants is the secret then is this person really your friend? Seriously, I know thats harsh but where do the lines cross and was it your fault for performing something in front of an audience who only wanted the secret, or was the probelm with your performance, remember to some it will be a challenge of wits and who is smarter, to others you will touch there imagination. I can't stress this enough presentation is everything the secret is nothing
So do yourself and me a favor Practice anything you buy until you can do it in your sleep, you think I kidding, I have fallen asleep with a deck of cards in my hand. I know your excited to perform your new "trick" using this word belittles the idea of magic to begin with. It is an effect, I'm not trying to fool you, I'm trying to effect your mind so you suspend belief in what I just did as an effect. I'm trying to touch your imagination not trick your mind, there is a subtle yet discernable difference here.

Alright well I'm off the soap box for now, but please consider all of these ideas when your talking about exposure, not just pointing your finger at youtube junkies, which I would agree a exposing some great magic, in a really lame way.

Until later I'm am the enigma, I am the magi, I am a figment of your imagination

I kind of agree on some points. I'm a great fan of the T-Tip. I use it several times in my act.

Occasionally I get someone asking "do you ever use those little thumb things? ...You know, the thing you use to make a bit of silky cloth disappear?"

My reply is always "nah!!! those things are for kids ...here watch this, this is cool!" ...and use one right in front of them. They never know.

Exposure is bad, but in the world we live in today ...it happens!, we have to learn to live with it. But do the general public really understand the exposure they see or read? .....I don't believe so, not unless they are hard core enthusiasts, in which case, let them enjoy our rendition of that secret!

Dave Bonsall

What happened with this petition?
Was it submitted to Youtube?

I highly doubt youtube will take any notice. Youtube have a lot on their plate with illegal videos getting posted, we've all seen it on the news. Exposure of magic is probably pretty damn far down their list IMO.