Bang On - Marc Oberon

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Postby pcwells » Apr 12th, '07, 20:50



Its magic wrote:I got mine today and the iwife was floored (her words).


iWife? Is that a Stepford spouse made by Apple?

:shock:

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Postby Brookish » Apr 12th, '07, 23:40

Wow, really have to save up for this effect, it is just mind-blowing! Off to bed now to imagine myself performing it and eventually fall asleep.......... good night...

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Postby gunnarkr » Apr 13th, '07, 00:46

Its magic wrote:...I dare not do it in the real world yet, to get it smooth is quite tricky can anyone assure me this comes with time...?

Yes! Definetely! I tried it out by myself again and again over and over to begin with. I had a deck and cut it over and over, to be sure I got different cards at random to get from my wallet. Then after a while I tried it out on my youngest son, then on the others... more family members... friends and then finally anybody anywhere. It's a thrill :)

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Postby Brookish » Apr 13th, '07, 14:47

Is it a bicycle card? Is the back shown? Can you use your own deck?

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Postby bananafish » Apr 13th, '07, 15:32

Is it a bicycle card? Is the back shown? Can you use your own deck?

Just out of interest, why exactly are yiou asking these questions? How is it going to help you decide whether or not to buy it?

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Postby pcwells » Apr 13th, '07, 16:00

Considering thatonly one card is ever seen by the audience, the question of using your own deck seems a bit pointless. As does the brand of card, considering you don't need that card to match any working decks used elsewhere in your act.

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Postby Carl Buck » Apr 13th, '07, 16:04

Brookish wrote:Is it a bicycle card? Is the back shown? Can you use your own deck?


It's irrelevant what brand of card it is, this is a stand alone effect where you don't use a deck. The spec merely thinks of a card, and that card alone is in your wallet. No need to show the back to 'prove' it's from your deck etc

Hope this helps :wink:

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Postby TheLondonI » Apr 13th, '07, 21:41

But I suppose if you were performing with a bicycle deck all your performance and for this effect you use a card with a different back, laymen are just going to put the trick down to trick cards.

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Postby seige » Apr 13th, '07, 21:51

A professional mentalist/magician would know NOT to mix this effect in amongst another card effect, as it is far too strong.

Using another card routine either side of it would be a self-induced trap.

Ergo, the relevance of what the cards look like, or how they are used is not an issue.

Fact of the matter: this is NOT a replacement for the ID. It is an effect which should be intelligently worked into your set, and not thrown in.

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Postby gunnarkr » Apr 13th, '07, 23:21

Neither would any amateur with a gramm of common sense!

If you say: Think of one card in a deck and name it. The spectator names the card, you take an envelope out of your wallet, open it and shake out the only card in it... why would you want to show the spectator the back of the card? Wouldn't the effect be stronger if you show him the face, the same face he thought of? Duh!

Actually, this would be a whole different approach. Think of one card and name it... and then you just show the spectator the back of any card and say: Dataamm!!! Here is the back of the card you thought of. And put it immediately in your pocket again. You don't have to buy the effect, you can use any odd card you have and need neither a wallet nor anything else!
:twisted:

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Postby Brookish » Apr 13th, '07, 23:52

No, I was just thinking about the other possiblities, if you get someone to choose a card out of a deck, then find it in your wallet... I was wondering if you could give them the card to keep for example. Or the effect where the one card they chose would be missing in the deck, because it's in your wallet... Just wanted to know...

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Postby gunnarkr » Apr 14th, '07, 01:05

Ehemm... there is no deck involved in this performance. :)

That is what makes the effect so strong. You ask the spectator to think of a card. You steal his thought and reveal the card he thought of. Much stronger than stealing a card from a deck and revealing from your wallet. There are plenty of magic tricks that have that effect.

Don't you think that that revealing a card that the spectator thought of, of the top of his mind, is stronger? Much stronger?

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Postby stevo4 » Apr 14th, '07, 08:27

2 quick questions:

1. Is it necessary to wear a jacket? Most of the illusions i perform are out in public/on the street in casual - jacket less environments.

2. I think this may have been asked before, but can Bang On (the wallet) be used with Heirloom?

Thanks,

steve

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Postby pcwells » Apr 14th, '07, 08:38

1. There are dress considerations. A jacket isn't essential, but it's very practical.

What else are you wearing when you perform?

This isn't a chat-up, you understand?

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Postby seige » Apr 14th, '07, 09:09

Gunnark is spot on here...

THERE IS NO DECK involved. That's the strength.

Thererefore, by nature of not even touching a deck, you're:

1. Not using a force card or duplicate card of any sort

2. Not creating a premise that a full deck is being used (i.e. there only ever IS one card involved)

3. Not using sleights, manipulations, counts, guesses or 'magic'

The bottom line here is that this effect simply is the strongest 'think of any card' routine I've seen, ever.

There isn't a need to show 'a deck with the card missing' or any other additional proof, because the proof is, you immediately take out your wallet, open it, remove the only envelope in there, and tip the only card in the envelope onto the table.

This is getting so much discussion now about intricacies, and there really is no need to dig any further than this. The point being... the thought-of card is the ONLY card in play. No other cards are used.

What I am about to say may sound a little pompous, but have any of you 'doubters' ever performed a live set? Have you ever been the centre of attention and performed to a bunch of total strangers?

I am guessing that the answer is no. Because, quite simply, managing your own act and interspersing your range of effects in a flow, and keeping control of the act at all times is totally paramount to your performance's effectiveness.

I also notice there's a lot of 'fishing' for the method going on. I won't go into details, but you're all on the wrong lines entirely. "Can the wallet be used with Heirloom?"... WHAT SORT OF QUESTION IS THAT?

One of the most amusing suggestions I've had via PM is that there's an ID in your pocket, which you use to get the right card and load in the envelope under guise of trying to find your wallet!!!!

Trust me, the actual method is much simpler, and your hand is in your pocket no longer than it takes to grab the wallet.

Discussing again the 'value' of this: I was actually with Costas from WMS in his workshops last weekend, and saw the effort which had gone into the production, including WMS's own ingenious manufacture of the props (courtesy of Jim Trainer, Costas's business partner).

The whole of Bang On is brainchilded by Marc Oberon, but it was the skill, resourcefulness and hard-work of the WMS team which over several months took Marc's own hand-made version into mass production.

As far as RRP goes, the actual props you get are worth the price alone, even if you take the routine out of the equation. And once you receive this, you'll be amazed at how quickly your cogs are whirring for devising new effects of your own. The Bang On effect is the sum of about five different magic principles, all wrapped together to give a great effect.

As for performing, something I'm hearing talked of is the way it's done to a spectator, and in my opinion, the effect should be described similarly to an ID routine. You can wrap as much mystery or ham into it, but the basics are:

1. Transmit, or recieve? Well... here's a misconception which is a dividing line in mentalism and magic, I think...
For example, if you ask the spectator to think of an object and you will draw it, you are seen to be 'receiving' from them an image, which you duplicate. That's mentalism.
If you, however, ask them to think of a card, and you 'receive' it, and produce it from your pocket, that's magic.
Why?
Because, you must have already known the card they were going to choose. So, no matter WHAT they transmitted, you always knew it was the card in the wallet. What's so amazing about that? You didn't read their mind after they'd thought of a card, because the outcome was already set in stone before you even met them. Mentalism no-no.

BUT...

Take this scenario... using Bang On near the end of your performance, you could ask a spectator 'Do you believe in thought transmission?'.
You would then proceed to ask them to have a blank canvas in their mind, onto which you were going to project a card. A single card which you chose before the show and placed in an envelope, which was then placed in your pocket. This was done without anyone seeing, and with no pre-show work.
Mentalists often drop in the line 'and we've never met before or discussed this effect or perfomance before the show?' type of thing.
So, under this scenario, it is seen that somehow you are transmitting the card value to the spectator. Of course, due to the nature of the effect, no matter what card they choose, it will be the one in the wallet.

This is a FAR MORE CREDIBLE way to perform this type of effect. And using the same method for, for example, the ID, you get a much stronger routine.

Of course, you can add as much drama and additional storytelling as you like, but Bang On demonstrates the 'thought transmission' from performer to spectator in a much more dramatic way.

I'm not a fan of the 'I KNEW you would choose that card' method. As you can tell. I believe that the projection method is much closer to ideal.

A sample script may be:

Performer:
"I'd like you to empty your mind, and imagine a blank canvas, just sitting there in space. Nod for me when you have this. Closing your eyes makes it easier.

"Now, I made a prediction (do NOT mention cards at this point) which I placed in an envelope, tucked in my wallet, which is then tucked in my pocket. This was done before the show, before I even met you. We haven't met before or discussed this show, have we?"

Spectator:
"No"

Performer:
"I want to take you on a journey, and I want you to follow my voice carefully, and see nothing but the blank canvas for now. As I speak, see nothing but the blank canvas.

"I want to try and paint on your blank canvas an image. An image which I will attempt to place inside your mind. I already have this image in my mind, and without using precise description of any sort, I will attempt to recreate that image in your own mind.

"You still have the blank canvas? Good. Now, I want you to imagine you are sat at small green table, at which are sat three people who are close to you, and one complete stranger. The blank canvas hovers above the table. The room is dimly lit by the glow of the canvas, and all you see are the faces of your friends, and the top of the table.

"The complete stranger begins to deal playing cards face-down. You each receive five cards, as in a game of draw poker. I don't want you to even think of cards at this point, just see the backs of the cards.

"Your friends now all pick up their cards, and hold the faces of the cards up in front of them—at eye level. All you see are the backs of the cards facing you. The complete stranger does the same, holding his cards up to his face.

"Now, I want you to see the complete stranger's face. As you peer into the dim light, you can see it is me. It is me who is the complete stranger, looking back at you with a gentle smile.

"Suddenly, the stranger's eyes catch the light. In the reflection of their eyes—of MY eyes—you see the faces of the cards they are holding—the cards I AM holding.

"The foremost card is easy to read, with the four behind it in the fan being more obscured. But the face of the foremost card that they are holding—that I AM holding—is clearly shown in the reflection in the eyes.

"As you see that card, paint it on the canvas above the table. As you visualise that card on the canvas, commit to it... do not deviate.

"As the card becomes clearer and clearer, everything else fades—the cards, the table, the friends, and the stranger—until only the canvas remains.

"See that card. You saw it in MY EYES whilst I was in YOUR MIND. See clearly now that card —open your eyes—and name it loud and clear..."

(as this happens, go towards your pockets, so that the instant the card is named, you can withdraw your wallet)

Spectator:
"Six of hearts"

(Immediately remove the wallet, open it on the table, remove the envelope, open it, and shake the card out, face-up)

That should be enough to end the effect with no further words.

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