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by **daleshrimpton** » Sep 11th, '09, 09:49

Todays news seems full of stories about the new C.R.B check comming out next month, and the way it could affect 1 in 4 people.

I find it all so confusing.

I know that this will re- open a huge can of worms, but doesnt it make sense to introduce the identity card?

this way everybody will, as a matter of course, be C.R.B tested, And the thing will be continualy updated.

No more having to get a new one, all the time..( and it's 64 quid a go)
..

Maybe i am being too sensible and logical here.

Guys...
argue away.

by **Mr_Grue** » Sep 11th, '09, 09:52

The sixty-four quid is a one shot, according to the chapess from the Government. ID cards will cost about £60 and last less than ten years.

More concerned here with the social damage caused by the scheme.

by **themagicwand** » Sep 11th, '09, 09:54

Not being a kids magician anymore, having a CRB is less of an issue for me.

I must be on so many databases anyway that one more to get an ID card won't make any difference. I think it's a little late to try and be anonymous. So I have no real qualms about having one, although I can't see myself volunteering for one. If and when they become compulsory I won't lose any sleep.

by **daleshrimpton** » Sep 11th, '09, 10:01

well, i do two nice santa gigs a year and up to now, ive not felt the need for one.
Mainly because i am never alone with them, ( two parents, and helpers all over the place, with me the centre of attention)

But now, Im not sure. Its a very confusing situation.

by **Mandrake** » Sep 11th, '09, 10:05

To obtain an ID card will require production of other forms of ID so why aren't those forms of ID adequate as they stand? No need for another piece of plastic at rip off prices!

CRB checks are a separate issue, the main news seemed to be that anyone working for/volunteering for help with Cubs, Guides, Scouts etc will need to be checked - but they already are. Anyone giving lifts to school or other places will also need to be CRB checked so that aspect might decline and the kids will have to use other methods of transport if the volunteers can't afford the checking fees.

Best policy with kids is to make sure you're never in a situation of being the only adult in the room, there should always be at least two, one of each sex, and if you can get more adults there so much the better.

by **Mr_Grue** » Sep 11th, '09, 10:16

Mandrake wrote:Best policy with kids is to make sure you're never in a situation of being the only adult in the room, there should always be at least two, one of each sex, and if you can get more adults there so much the better.

Under the current proposals that is apparently not enough. You now won't be able to visit a school and give a talk to a class without going through a CRB check, whether or not you're left alone with them. And unless I got the wrong end of the stick, you'll need a CRB check if you intend hosting a sleepover for your kids.

What angers me is this is based on the assumption that predatory paedophiles already have criminal records, that parent paedophiles will somehow be prevented from gaining access to children, and that this is the outcome of a knee-jerk reaction to the Soham murders, a case involving a school caretaker who, under the existing legislation, should have been checked, but wasn't.

This is a massive undertaking, a dreadful shift in the relationship between adults and children, based around something that is rare to begin with, and non-existent in most of the situations where a CRB check will soon be necessary. This will be about as useful at reducing paedophilia as insisting priests get CRB checks.

by **magicofthemind** » Sep 11th, '09, 10:33

As I understand it, the new registration is additional to CRB checks that would otherwise be required.

Also, it doesn't only apply to "work" with children; "vulnerable adults" are covered too.

Barry

by **daleshrimpton** » Sep 11th, '09, 10:42

that's good, because you hear of so many horror stories involving the mentaly handicapped, and elderly people in care homes.

by **dat8962** » Sep 11th, '09, 10:59

My own view is that much of the argument for having the proposed widening of checks is flawed as well as the arguments made by the supporters.

I also fail to see why one ngle siCRB check isn't sufficient for all circumstances instead of having to have a different check for each and every organisation that you volunteer for. After all, passport control deals with anti-terrorism issues these days and you don't need a new passport each time you travel abroad. The whole process, like many others is just bureaucratic and a good way of raising revenue. I would like to wager that the rest of Europe aren't doing this.

Ill thought of regulation such as this will do more harm to the masses than it will do good.

by **Mandrake** » Sep 11th, '09, 11:12

The story on ITV Teletext is:

Parents who regularly ferry groups of children on behalf of sports or social clubs such as the Cub Scouts will have to undergo criminal record checks - or face fines of up to £5,000, it has been disclosed.

They will fall under the scope of the Government's new Vetting and Barring Scheme, which is aimed at stopping paedophiles getting access to children.

Failure to register with the Independent Safeguarding Authority, the Home Office agency which administers the scheme, could lead to criminal prosecution and a court fine.

The clubs themselves face fines of £5,000 if they use volunteers who have not been cleared. Parents who host foreign pupils as part of school exchange trips will also have to be vetted.

A total of 11.3 million people in England, Wales and Northern Ireland are expected to register with the ISA.

All 300,000 school governors, as well as every doctor, nurse, teacher, dentist and prison officer will also have to register because they come into contact with children or "vulnerable" adults at work.

The scheme was recommended by the Bichard report into the Soham murders of Holly Wells and Jessica Chapman by the caretaker at their school, Ian Huntley.

Huntley was given the job despite allegations of sex with underage girls in his past, which were not passed on.

It will be the biggest of its kind anywhere in the world and involve unprecedented delving into the subject's personal and employment history.

Two hundred case workers based at the ISA in Darlington will collect information passed to them by the police, professional bodies and employers and rule on who is barred.

by **dat8962** » Sep 11th, '09, 11:29

Parents who host foreign pupils as part of school exchange trips will also have to be vetted.

Yet when our kids go abroad on their part of the exchange the foreign parents won't be doing the same!

As a parent myself I am not against protecting Children but this scheme is the wrong way to approach the matter.

The system should spend more time and resource in dealing directly with paedophiles. When you want to protect the sheep from the wolf, you go out and shoot the wolf, not put up more fences around the sheep and check the shepherds.

by **greedoniz** » Sep 11th, '09, 11:40

I understand why checks are made in certain circumstances to check that an adult convincted of a sexual crime isn't left in charge of kids but why is an all round check needed?

This child worship business is getting out of hand. Why not lock the kids up and keep them away from all adult males.

A friend of mine was called a nonce on the train a few months ago because he winked at a kid who waved at him through the window.

Paedo-paranoia

by **Robbie** » Sep 11th, '09, 12:16

I think it was just a few months ago that a popular children's author (Philip Pullman, I believe) was going to tour schools and give talks, discussing his books and generally encouraging creativity.

Although he was only going to stand on stage in front of whole-school assemblies, he was told he had to be fully CRB checked. He refused out of principle and cancelled the tour.

by **Tomo** » Sep 11th, '09, 13:08

According to the BBC, the new CRB checks will be needed by people who drive kids to school and social events.

by **Jobasha** » Sep 11th, '09, 13:30

No more series of monkey dust in this day and age

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaUkt59vY1Q

I've had five or six crb checks put through this year and now they're introducing another check purely for teachers, so even more red tape to cut through. You just get used to it.

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