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Jordan C wrote:After all whether your using pneumonics or NLP what you're doing is trying to elicit a pre-determined response.

What are "pneumonics"?

Ace of Spades wrote:

Jordan C wrote:After all whether your using pneumonics or NLP what you're doing is trying to elicit a pre-determined response.

What are "pneumonics"?

Mnemonics? Nice misspelling, though .

Has anyone read "Mind Control NLP & Hypnosis" from subliminalpersuasion.co.uk and if so.. is it any good. Does anyone know whether the hypnosis taught is the quick or slow kind (sorry.. don't know the real terms but hopefully you know what I mean)

I recently bought the Full Facts Cold Reading book and am (and always have been) really intrigued by these concepts.

When I was much younger I did delve into hynosis (I borrowed a book from my local library) and did manage to get people to stick to the floor (and miss buses because of it unfortunately) etc.. etc.. but this was using the long winded hypnosis methods used by clinic hypnotists and so I would really like to know how to do this quick/waking hypnotism.

So can anyone recommend this or are there better books etc..

Thanks

Slippery

I got the stuff from subliminalpersuasion and it was quite a good introduction to the subject. If you know nothing of this area, its a good place to start but I soon found I needed to get into more depth and that involves much more background reading than this provides.

I learnt some basic hypnosis and had my first sucess with a willing volunteer on Monday. It was my second attempt, we failed a week earlier. It took about 20 minutes to bring her under. He also describes fast methods but I wanted to take it slow at first. My subject has no ill effects apart from the fact she now thinks onions taste the same as apples

I also got the 'full facts' and I found it excellent. There are reviews and comments on other threads.

Roland

Thanks Roland..

Same as me.. used to take me about 20mins or so and this is what I want to get away from. So does this book actually teach the quick methods (like waking hypnosis) or just the long winded (20min) versions.

Thanks

Slippery

It teaches a variety of methods, fast and slow. I'm going to try a faster method next.

Some of the explanations aren't that long, so you need to work a few of the details out for yourself.

I have a problem with Hypnosis. Namely that my friends all think they are comedians so the few times I have tried Hypnosis it juus degenerates into a farce. Any tips for keeping said friends under test conditions???

Jordan C

As far as I can remember it's extremely difficult to hypnotise someone who either doesn't want to be or is taking it all as a joke.

The way I learnt to tell was to stand them up.. get them to close their eyse and relax. You then look for the wobble as they start to loose their sense of balance. If this happens straight way they are a good subject.. if it takes time they arn't so good.. if it never happens they are cheating and it will be really difficult.

Having chosen your victim (sorry.. subject) you then need to set them up in the right frame of mind and with the right atmosphere. In a noisy nightclub is far more difficult then in a quiet pub for instance. Most of all you need to make them feel relaxed.

Hope this helps.. It does take time to get the right technique, voice etc.. (I used to use falling alot.. but some people didn't like this sensation at all) and although I haven't actually done any hypnosis for years the techniques I learnt (or rather developed) will always be there when and if I need them. So keep trying..

Slippery.

Thanks Slippery

I'm going to have to start reading up again

NLP

http://www.trainingjournal.co.uk/abstra ... 010501.htm
http://www.trainingzone.co.uk/cgi-bin/i ... -%25h-%25y
http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~dylanwad/ ... rt_nlp.htm
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/eto/conte ... tearea=eto
http://www.geocities.com/pseudoscience_ ... s.html#nlp
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/skeptic/message/24006
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&l ... 6rnum%3D10
http://www.kinesic.com/interrogation_nlp.htm
http://www.appliednlp.com/Access/Access_Page_99.asp
http://www.workingpsychology.com/nlp.html
http://www.skepdic.com/neurolin.html
http://skepdic.com/comments/neurocom.html
http://www.skepdic.com/comments/neurocom.html
http://www.nlp.com/report/review4.htm
http://books.nap.edu/books/0309037921/h ... ml#pagetop
(Bottom of Page)
http://books.nap.edu/books/0309037921/h ... ml#pagetop
(Top of Page)
http://www2.hawaii.edu/~lady/archive/research.html
http://www2.hawaii.edu/~lady/archive/research-4.html
http://www.neurosemantics.com/Articles/ ... eOfNLP.htm
http://www.newtimesbpb.com/extra/hounds.html
http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRel ... tserv.html
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... t=Abstract
http://www.geocities.com/bandlertrial/index.html
http://www.geocities.com/pseudoscience_2000/others.html
http://www.mat.univie.ac.at/~neum/other/stever.html
http://ifets.ieee.org/past_archives/arc ... /0554.html
http://www.sociaalpanorama.nl/articles/Butterflies.htm
http://www.nlp.com/report/intro.htm
http://www.kevinhogan.com/NLPeyeaccess.htm
And here is the only lucid argument I have ever encountered which explores the problems of analysing NLP in any scientific sense - completely over looks the flaws in their own propositions but never the less interesting:
http://www3.mistral.co.uk/bradburyac/nlpfax9.htm

Garry - a few of those links don't work - how about editing your post and maybe labelling each one too? It's a bit of a challenge to get through them all!

Real helpful though, I must admit!

SlipperyPenguin wrote:Has anyone read "Mind Control NLP & Hypnosis" from subliminalpersuasion.co.uk and if so.. is it any good. Does anyone know whether the hypnosis taught is the quick or slow kind (sorry.. don't know the real terms but hopefully you know what I mean)

Hello there,

I've got this and the other PDFs from the site. I keep meaning to post a review. I'll try to get around to it this week.

Can anyone suggest a good intro to NLP? I've tried reading a couple of books but felt very cold by the experience as they have all been geared towards clinical work. How much does Derren Brown use NLP anyway? In order to achieve similar effects would one be better off studying hypnosis (it's clear he uses this as the pattern interrupts are quite obvious) . After watching and reading almost everything he's produced I'm convinced his claim of using NLP and phychological techniques are highly exaggerated and are really another level of misdirection. He often 'explained' how an effect was achieved using subliminal influence but if you look close enough you can see it's not that at all, but, because most people believe he is using psychological techniques they are left satisfied they know how the trick was done and don't analyse it any further.

If you want a (non-magic) good lead in, try the skill builder seriesfrom metamorphosis press.

These are the books that I used when I started my NLP Practictioner training and they were easy reading and useful material combined.

HTH,

Vic

Hi all -

I am new here. Actually found this forum looking for some answers myself... And this topic looking for another within it called does "hypnosis exist?" (still looking!)...


(WARNING: this is a long post .... I am excited!)

Anyways-
I read this and looked at the answers and responses. I loved it! I also wanted to put my 2 cents worth in. I finish my board certification as a Hypnotist in 2 weeks. I have had some NLP training over the years - never got certified though. The interesting wrinkle is I have used both skill sets most of my life because I have had some rather severe challenges to overcome ( I am dyslexic and have a dislocated and fused hip from birth). Both NLP and Hypnosis not only enhanced my life... but my early un-tuned skill in hypnosis probably saved my life.

The short story is that I broke my good leg's femur not in one but three different places, alone and far from help, doing something really really stupid. Having done a lot of stupid and painful things, I have to tell you a broken femur is quite an accomplishment! Anyways using hypnosis I managed to pull myself together and get myself to help... I did well enough with it, I actually had a difficult time convincing people I needed help. The ambulance drivers were professional and polite but because I didn't seem to be experiencing pain or shock were doubtful as to my prognosis. I went to sleep while they drilled through my lower leg my leg with a hand crank in preparation of 3 months traction, without drugs because I am highly reactant to all medications. The doc kept waking me up!

I rapidly learned NLP skills, and on a $20 bet doubled my pay every three months for a couple of years. It was pretty wild. To qualify that some, I was very much underpaid during my early career. That said, there seems to be a lot people in that same boat - and they still seem to be there!

Having experienced that you would think that I wouldn't doubt the power of hypnosis. Yet in my class - the thought in the back of all the student's minds, mine included seems to be at one time or another - is this for real?

My only explanation for it is that is part of the magic of our powerful minds! It is a paradox that we have this fantastic ability and yet we are constantly hindered by our very own doubts of it. My favorite description of the phenomenon is goes that if our brains were simple enough for us to easily comprehend it ... Our intellect would be such that, we couldn't.

NLP and Hypnosis are GREAT LIFE SKILLS that will enhance whatever it is you choose to do in life. You will hear arguments depending on what camp you are currently in - which is better... Or that both are complete bunk! Its all about belief... If you don't believe it, how are you going to convince others? Know and be very aware of your personal beliefs.

Ok. My question to you is which camp serves you best? If you think it is bunk you are probably closing the door on some pretty kewl experiences! And that is okay as long as you are aware of it and consciously making that choice. Denial is a valid choice just not a very useful on in my opinion.

One down, two to go! NLP was created largely by studying therapist who used HYPNOSIS as part of their regimen, notably Milton Erickson. As such they are closely related - In reality two different approaches to the same subject. NLP tends to be a more left brain exhaustive approach that explains the methods, and hypnosis a more right brain approach focusing on the intuitive means. The real secret is that both have their strengths and shortcomings - and by using one you can prop up the other. A great example of this is that both sides do have a tendency to do things by rote, without understanding why or how it works. When you ask and draw a blank in one camp, you can often go to the other to get an very satisfactory answer.

Finally - Both skill sets are really nothing more then manipulating thoughts. Primarily yours, AND THEN OTHERS as an further extension of that original thought, what ever it may be. Ok. I haven't reveled anything new there. Or have I? Hmmm... Most people think that the skills are best used for MANIPULATING OTHER PEOPLE! If I a take it a step further and tell you that true hypnosis is in essence all about an ACCEPTED ASSOCIATION be it pain or pleasure... like or dislike... blah blah blah. There is a attraction to it, that makes it easily intregratable into their already established thought patterns, good or bad. If your end goal is to manipulate people solely for your purposes alone - in the long run you are going to fail, because nobody is willingly going to accept that in the long run. If you are using people, know that they are letting you - because they are using you in turn. That is a sad and limited way to go through life.
Scarcity demands "serve me and me alone!".... Abundance asks "how can I be of serve to all?".... All action is equally awarded appropriately!

Thanks for the use of the soapbox. Hope it helped!

PS- I came to this site looking for a boost in confidence. My teachers tell me I am very skillful but timid. Writing this helped me put my thoughts together. Thanks. I want to use magic to have something to "hide behind" while I polish my presentation skills.

any suggestions along those lines, gratefully accepted!

-Misj