talkmagic.co.uk

The problem with using stooges and the like is it is not magic, as anyone can do it. Magic is something that takes skill and practice (i.e. card tricks, coin etc) If everyone has plants and custom built gear than anyone could do it.

Pardon me if I sound rude, Flipback, but I find that to be not only a contradictory statement, but a naive one.

If everyone has plants and custom built gear than anyone could do it.

i can do a kids show and ever use a sleight the entire performance and i often use stooges thats the nature of the beast.

on a side note american audiences react differently to british audiences, they tend to be more animated and vocal in there disbalife.

so chriss angle uses camera trickery in his shows so does every magician who does street style magic on tv.
your basic audience dosn't want to see someone raise two inches of the floor to hearty cheers they want to see him saw into the air by several feet hence the need for a bit of camera editing.

its a bit like compareing star treck to dr who there both entertaining but if they make a mistake in editing there not vilafied as frawds its just tv if you don't like it turn it off.

Well said, discoman

Demitri, I totally concur.

So your telling me that If I have a group of people in on it, two sets of rather identical people and I cover the camera and have one set run off and the other pop out farther down the hall that I have not done what Criss has? My mother could do that trick, as there does not need to be any technical skill. Cover the camera and BOOM magically the trick is done. With all the custom made props everything is already set up for you to do. Look at Houdini going through the brick wall, anyone can do that ANYONE!! In reality it is all theatrics.

anyone can do that ANYONE!! In reality it is all theatrics.

absolutly anyone can do it all you need to do now is get on tv by showing the bosses your other magical talants to persuade them you are better than the average joe magician and warrant your own show.

that should be no problem for you.

I'm just not seeing the point of your argument.

For instance - let's look at an effect like Out of this World. In many circles, this is considered an incredibly powerful magic effect.

If your mother knew how to prepare for this effect, she could do it. She wouldn't need technical skill or any knowledge of sleight of hand. NONE - and yet, if she had the basic information, she could perform one of the most mind-boggling effects in card magic. There are thousands of effects that require no skill, many which proudly TELL you "no sleight of hand required" - and the effects are incredibly magical.

The question isn't whether or not you CAN do what Criss Angel or Houdini did - but if you could actually think of it on your own. Yes, we can all figure it out and duplicate it - but repeating isn't as good as the original.

Ok firstly to magicdiscoman; that is exactly my point. THe people will not simply put you on television because you can escape from some custom built enclosure. You need to demonstrate your magical talent with something else.

Alright Demitri I am not saying that I am so great simple becasue I can replicate the effects. I find it amazing that people are able to come up with such great effects. That takes tons of work. But again that is where the skill is. Thinking up how to build this enclosure in such a way that no one will see or figure out how you can get out is far more amazing than simply blocking the audiences view and stepping out the secret door.

Just out of curiosity - in reference to discoman - are you saying Criss Angel hasn't demonstrated his magical talent and is undeserving of his recognition?

If you're going to attack the strength of the effect, then I have no problem with that. But that wasn't your argument. Your argument was:

The use of stooges is not magic.

That's all you said.

You need to demonstrate your magical talent with something else.

all you need to do now is get on tv by showing the bosses your other magical talants to persuade them you are better than the average joe magician and warrant your own show.

so we agree chriss angle is a talanted magician as he has his own show i have no problem with that.

Thinking up how to build this enclosure in such a way that no one will see or figure out how you can get out is far more amazing than simply blocking the audiences view and stepping out the secret door.

fair point but thease are two different things done usualy by two different people.
firstly theres the designer of the effect who generaly isn't the performer most performers buy there effects same as we do or have a team of designers on staff to do the hard bits.
secondly the person in front of the camera dosn't need to know anything about designing or building a trick he dosn't need to even be that great at performing magic, what he is is a character has a certain style that apeals to the tv gurus its all about ratings.
thats why you get david blaine and derron brown on tv instead of michel armmar who could easily knock spots of both men but is as entertaining as steve interesting davis.

regard blocking the camera wile a move is performed how often do we as magicians use the same device of misdirection to steal or ditch a coin, card etc.
how many times does an assistant go in a box be coverd with a curtain, wile the magician prances around doing none of the actual magic, then vanishes its just the same as covering the camera.

don't judge a guys carrear on one trick take time to look at his repotoir before you make judgments.

I Just Learned It A While Back Here It Is I Am Putting It Here For Beginners In Magic:

Message from Mods (as predicted below!): Details removed, it's not safe to give out such secrets as they may very well belong to others.

Magic Josh

Sorry but you CANNOT make posts that reveal any secrets as it is not only magicians that read these boards. There are a lot of lay people reading who only spy so that they can learn for free, what we as magicians pay for.

They then make botched presentations that do nothing for the reputation of magic in general.

You cannot give away secrets of workings that you don't own the rights to / for.

Also, and perhaps more importantly, there is a technique to this and in my opinion it's not particularly well explained in your post. In the wrong hands this trick could be dangerous if the ropes are wrong around the neck and they are pulled fast and hard. As a rope worker I know these penetrations so speak from experience.

I know for a fact that your post will be removed tomorrow by a MOD because of its content but as it's the middle of the night here in the UK can you please edit your post now.


Thanks

and besides that whats it got to do with the origional post in this thread.

Firstly magicdiscoman I have never said anything like "Criss Angel suxs" or anything of the like. I quite like Criss, I own Mindfreak, and like the fact that it actually shows the consultants for the show and talks to them rather than never hearing about them while Copperfield makes 10 million. I know for a fact that Criss could out magic me any day.

On the blocking the camera bit you do have a point but there is one thing I want to mention. I still find that blocking the camera is different as it is set to show as little as possible and we have no way of seeing anything but what the camera shows. Whereras with misidrection it takes work and skill to make sure that people are not looking where you do not want them to. Whereas with the camera it is extremely easy as we have no choice, we cannot look around.