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I've been reading a lot about cold reading lately, and I'm intrigued enough to want to give it a go.

That said, I'm very well aware of the amount of practice it needs. I can't really sit down with friends and family to practice, as I already know enough about them, and they're unlikely to take the exercise seriously enough anyway.

So... can anyone recommend any more straightforward magic or mental magic effects that give the performer scope to dabble with cold reading without actually making it the be-all-and-end-all of the routine, or affecting the effect's actual punchline?

I hope that's clear. I just want a safety net to practice with without looking like a prat.

Thanks again,

Pete

I understand Kioku from thegreat guys at Outlaw Effect is ideal for this very purpose!

Wow... you're lucky #3 on "the list" today...

Firstly, you don't ask a plumber to teach you how to be a carpenter, now do you?

If you want to learn what the magic community now calls "Cold Reading" you could go out and get the Ian Rowland book or TRADECRAFT and learn a hell of a lot of BS that will get you laughed at faster than just about anything else if you try it out in the "real" world of the shut-eye believer. None of the guys that have put those type of books out over the past decade have ever had to make their living as a tableside Psychic e.g. they're simply selling you a book based on analytical hype.

I'm not saying that they are worthless... only that anyone "New" to the topic needs to start at square one and actually learn how to do Readings for real first and then, a few years down the road, learn the psycho-babble side of it found in material such as I've mentioned. With that understood let's look at the "real" sources within magic that you've probably not yet heard of let alone read...

Start Here...http://www.mastermindreader.com/
Once you're in (you'll have to apply) check out the library and all of the FREE stuff first. Then check out the book list and order the following first;

1.) The Real Work of Cold Reading
2.) The Hidden Mysteries of Doctor Crow
3.) The Book of the Golden Tortoise

In truth, other than the first book on this list, you actually want to pick up the following books by this guy http://www.psychic.co.nz/

1.) Quick Readings w/Numerology (a.k.a. Chinese Numerology... one of the easiest and most lucrative systems in the biz)
2.) Quick & Effective Cold Reading
3.) Psychometry from A-Z

You will also want a copy of Ron Martin's TAROT READER'S NOTEBOOK which is available through Floraco Products I believe (http://www.floraco.com/)

Then IF you and track it down, you want a copy of the book KING OF THE COLD READERS by Bascom Jones & Herb Dewey. Though Herb has some other books out there, this one comes from a Reader's point of experience more than the others. Eventually you will want them for the sake of reference but they are more of a 3rd and 4th year resource.

Yes, I have a few books on this topic as well... you're not ready for them, nor are you ready for Brad Henderson's THE DANCE... you must learn the basics and you must learn how to actually do Readings before confusing and in many ways, limiting yourself by learning from all those biased magic books.

The one thing you will hear from anyone that actually does this kind of thing for a living is LEARN A REAL SYSTEM and use it for a while. You will hear this from people like Mark Strivings and Docc Hilford along side many, many others.

Cold Reading is both, an art & science that requires a life time to actually learn and even then, you will always find something "new". I have been researching and compiling material since the late 1980s on this topic so that I could create an Encyclopedic collection that addresses the issue step by step; volume one of the six volume set will be coming out this fall... it ain't cheap! Though it is for the novice, it's also the kind of seriously heavy weight study that one would expect to get into as a University Senior... that's one of the reasons I tell most folks that they don't want my books... not just yet. We're even pulling EASY READING off the market temporarily, so I can "fix" it and make it a bit easier than it is presently. Too, when it comes back out (we hope relatively soon) it will be in actual book form vs. eBook and BTW... for all those honest folk out there that have a boot leg copy of the existing book... what you have is inaccurate and will not be "complete"... I'm adding over 40 more pages plus tables and reference material not in the current tome.

Yes, if you have a real copy and your name is on our lists of original buyers, you will get a special purchase deal on the new version (can't say for certain, but probably around $15-$20 depending on where you live and postage costs.)

So... there you have it.

Thanks!

Craig Browning wrote:If you want to learn what the magic community now calls "Cold Reading" you could go out and get the Ian Rowland book or TRADECRAFT and learn a hell of a lot of BS that will get you laughed at faster than just about anything else if you try it out in the "real" world of the shut-eye believer.

Ah... Here we go again

Tomo wrote:

Craig Browning wrote:If you want to learn what the magic community now calls "Cold Reading" you could go out and get the Ian Rowland book or TRADECRAFT and learn a hell of a lot of BS that will get you laughed at faster than just about anything else if you try it out in the "real" world of the shut-eye believer.

Ah... Here we go again

Really!? Where are we going Tomo... please, tell me... I want to come!




Oh! You mean "that"... let's not go there, the other place is so much more fun

Thanks Ecko. I have Kioku, and see a lot of scope there. Any other suggestions would be appreciated.

To clarify matters for Craig though, I'm not trying to jump right in and do readings (professionally or otherwise). What I'm looking for is a context in which I can try different techniques without being dependent on them. Kioku is a good example, because it's designed to give the performer answers in other ways, so the cold reading element isn't essential for the effect's outcome - although it can add a lot to the spectator's perception of the performance.

This is like any skill - you can't become proficient just from reading books. A budding joiner can start off making spice racks and birdhouses for himself. A would-be cold reader, on the other hand, needs people to practice with - and ideally people that they don't already know. Tell that person you're going to read their tarot, read their palm or contact their dead uncle, and the novice stands to look like a colossal fool. Tell them you're practicing cold reading, and you're on a loser from the start, as they cease to take the process seriously. Include cold reading techniques in a magic-based routine, on the other hand, and you have a credible context for the reading and a mechanical get out if that side of things goes badly and you need to cut to the punchline (if the purpose of the routine is to reach a revelation that's already in the bag, then you can still be a success).

That's not to say that I don't appreciate the input and suggestions. I absolutely do. I just got the impression that you think I'm setting myself up as a dedicated psychic or reader after just a week of reading books (rather than people). That's not the case. I'm taking an interest in the subject and trying to find a safe platform and context in which to practice and learn skills first-hand.

Thanks again,

Pete

The problem is that if you're doing it as a magician you're already at a disadvantage. You could do a couple of Barnum statements with a card trick or something - but I think that people are generally more intelligent that we think they are and see through that kind of thing quite soon.

Yes - practicing this kind of stuff is difficult - but that is dealt with in a lot of the stuff that Craig mentions. While I agree that one doesn't just learn from reading books - the more you read this kind of thing, the more you immerse yourself in how it works. The material that Craig has mentioned works. It's not a quick and easy 'routine' you can learn - it will take a good while, but it will be worthwhile.

...maybe a simple approach would be to perform a small design duplication effect - then you could add just a brief "reading" along with the reveal...as to "why" the drew what they did...

may i recommend a book without being shouted at please
http://www.amazon.co.uk/How-Psychic-Rea ... F8&s=books

it's a guy who does this for real (and written many books on various subjects related to psychic behaviour)...it wont help you cold read as such, but will give you a look into how someone does this for real (however you define that)...and its cheap!

yeah, come on now...there's room for everyone on this planet and other realms...we don't have to have yet another argument do we?

why not take a look on both sides and just experiment...as long as you apply common sense and morals you'll be fine...no, I'm not an expert, just offering my point of view as this is an open forum...

EDIT: gettin' pig sick of having to add a caveat to these kinda posts though

Thanks for that - it's at the top of my Amazon wish list, to be bought when my next paycheque arrives.

And for the record, I don't believe that there's such a thing as bad information - just a tragic restriction to the amount of time available to assimilate it all.

On the magic side, I'm really keen to do this stuff in a performance that isn't presented as traditional magic 'tricks'. I'm nowhere near experienced enough to call myself a mentalist, but I'm very taken with the subtlety of performances by the likes of Derren Brown, and keen to see if the same subtle approach can be applied to 'mental magic', leaving the spectator wondering whether the effect was brought about by trickery, suggestion, cold reading or some supernatural means. In my case, of course, the widgets, gimmicks and sleights have it.

Thanks again,

Pete

pcwells wrote:On the magic side, I'm really keen to do this stuff in a performance that isn't presented as traditional magic 'tricks'. I'm nowhere near experienced enough to call myself a mentalist, but I'm very taken with the subtlety of performances by the likes of Derren Brown, and keen to see if the same subtle approach can be applied to 'mental magic', leaving the spectator wondering whether the effect was brought about by trickery, suggestion, cold reading or some supernatural means.

Definitely. Once you get to grips with the artful vagueness underlying it, you can start to weave it into your performance to create something more spookily mental. If, for instance, you already know the identity of a forced card, you can use CR-like patter to generate a feeling that you're probing for the colour, rank and finally the full identity of a card in an esoteric way. It's often surprising just how much a spectator will react and even give themselves away too, nodding or shaking their head unconsciously and swearing they stayed absolutely still.

Just to back up what Tomo has said, CR can be used to transform the most run-of-the-mill magic trick into a truly miraculous experience for your spec. Just use your imagination and think how a simple key card routine would be executed by someone like, say, Uri Geller?

Whoops. Here comes Craig. Everyone duck...!

From my dabblings with cold reading, I can concur that dabbling in both magic and cold reading can be a little bit of a roadblock.

Magic/Magic-alism (that's my hybrid magic/mentalism term to use before Craig kicks my butt ) can teach lots of bad-habit shortcuts about how to achieve certain cold reading results.

Cold reading can be thought of as natural and predictive body language/subconsious tell-tales, and some people are naturally more receptive to body language and 'giveaways'. And indeed, it seems many people are more adept as 'senders', and certainly give things away a lot easier.

But, the reason I personally didn't take my 'dabbling' any further is that I can only say that Craig has hit a nail on the head: this isn't something you'll pick up in five minutes. It's a sort of 'life experience' thing.

I initialy used to give this a whirl on my ex-girl, who was really into dark magic and stuff, and I really started trying to get into cold reading to try and prove to HER that fairground psychics were in fact just very clever manipulators.

But, the whole field of cold reading is, as again Mr Browning points out, a classification of it's own. It really does require dedication, experience and a heck of a lot of study. Something which I personally wasn't prepared to chuck into it.

So, I tell you this as a little bit of advice: If you fancy yourself as the next Acorah or Derren Brown, you may want to set aside a bit of dedicated time and get down to business.

Frankly, unless you are REALLY dedicated, this is a goal you may not attain.

However, to study cold reading for your own enlightenment is fascinating.

over christmas i performed a little...one of the effects kinda went, well, near enough completely wrong...just a simple esp thing...

gave the guy the 5 cards, asked him to look at each for 5 seconds, then place them down one by one...i got the first right, then i completely "mis-read" the rest - apart from the obvious last card...

all absolutely my fault...i was distracted by pretty women and cigar smoke...

however, because of the way i framed it all, he still absolutely freaked out...he kept asking me - "yeah, but HOW did you know i put down the cross shape first?"..goes to show how the occasional miss works in your favour...

and yes, i did apply some basic CR techniques to it...cos i noticed he had a cross round his neck as he leant forward...so i just said i felt he was a spiritual man, he had a faith - and that he was a warm and forgiving gentleman who should start putting himself first just a little more, as he'd been taking the brunt of someone elses bad behaviour fairly of late...

he said he felt all shakey cos he'd been covering for his brother who'd been having an affair recently...

EDIT: yeah, full on psychic entertainment - a lifetime's work, but there's no harm of learning some if you can act it correctly in my opinion...

And the best way to learn is to get out there and do it, or at least experiment with it. You can spend years locked away in a library studying everything that's ever been written on the subject. But until you try it in the real world, you'll still know nothing.