talkmagic.co.uk

I've have to agree with you on this one Tom, and hopefully Laurence will take this on board and start including the forum standard 1-5 rating for all the tricks.

1=A begician can do it, 2=No sleights, but not so easy, 3=Some sleights used,
4=Advanced sleights used, 5=Suitable for experienced magicians only)

However we have to be a little careful as these ratings can be subjective. I know there at least 2 on-line sellers of magic that do this, and their ratings for the same trick very often differ. For example "The Raven" has a rating of 1 at Magic Box, and a rating of 3 at magictricks. Both (as far as I am aware) rated from 1 to 5 where 1 is easy.

But it can't hurt, and as you point out, giving more information to the buyer is always going to be a good thing.

It would also then be nice if it were possible to search for all tricks at a specific rating. (Seige and NickJ could then go straight to those number 5's )

If it is that good a trick I would definately keep hold of it because, in my opinion anyway, the Elmsley count is not too difficult to do. It all depends on the explanation given. In Dai Vernons Inner Card Trilogy the Elmsley Count is described, not too well though, and subsequently I was really struggling to get to grips with it. Only when I saw it visually did it actually make perfect sense...

....after a few hours my Aces were Twisting like nobodys business.

It is really useful count/display and I would imagine it would be a mainstay in many a trick.

..also learn the gemini count......thats a beauty!!!

Thanks for the 'venting'...

You've basically hit a couple of proverbial nails on their metaphorical heads...

Now, I'm treading on thin ice here - because I've been promising demos of the NFW effect and the Elmsley count for ages. (Fear not - NUMS is coming, and it delivers all I promise and more).

The problem here is not the move, as such - it is the abject misery involved in receiving cleverly marketed 'poo' (for want of a better word).

I work with a marketing agency, and our job here is to take a concept, product, service or idea - and make it a commercially saleable item - whether it is rubbish or not. That's our job. In fact - we're paid to glorify things, or 'lie' in other words (DON'T LET A FEW WHITE LIES GET IN THE WAY OF A SALE! - as I was told once by a marketing guy).

This type of thing happens all the time around us, and we're susceptible... e.g.

NEW AND IMPROVED CLEANING POWER - OUR BEST EVER
So, this is the best ever. Sounds good - but it implies the previous product was therefore NOT the best???

NOTHING IS BETTER FOR RELIEVING YOUR HEADACHE
If 'nothing' is better - use nothing!

REASSURINGLY EXPENSIVE
Are you calling me a cheapskate???

OK, so you see what I mean?

Effects and illusions are dressed up in glamour - and although sometimes we're suckered in, we only have ourselves to blame.

Forums like this one are invaluable for avoiding 'turkeys'. And we can all thank Tom for his advice on this one.

The Elmsley Count is NOT readily available in RRTCM (as I had pointed out to me! - must remember to read it again soon to avoid 'egging' my face...). Therefore, effects like this are NOT within the skill level of your average 'self-working' magician!

We need to see more of these reviews... in fact, I will endeavour to create a new area for the specific purpose of sounding-off about 'turkeys' and 'lemons'.

Tom, the best online explanation Ive seen of the Elmsley count is at cardtrick central.

http://web.superb.net/cardtric/sleights/elmsley.htm

It has pretty good diagrams too. Of course the best will soon change once "Nums" is up and running.

As for the trick actually being called "Mutanz" - which I guess makes more sense, I have seen it advertised as both, but the clipart logo that is (I assume) supplied by the manufcaturer seems to be Muntaz. A bit of a boo boo here maybe.

good luck with the count.