talkmagic.co.uk

POOF! Gone, as per request and advice.

Okay, Michael, I'm going to give you a gift, here. That gift is going to come up to be, about, an hour of my life, working with your treatise above...I should be charging for this. And, if you stop to consider that - that some nobody on the internet should be charging for his time, then you've come a little close to understanding why you shouldn't be charging people for this book that you are putting out...

WHAT IS MAGIC?

Don't type in all caps. Unless you are really trying to make an extreme statement, it is unprofessional. If, in the entire length of one full book, you see a statement in all caps, it is surprising. Take a look at the bulk of your essay above, how many times are you using all caps? Wow!

What many young magicians do not understand about magic is that it is a highly respected art form by those who pursue it and are engrossed by it. It saddens me to see so many exposures by people young and old on the internet or live. What they do not realize is that, as kind as they may think it is, it is hurting our profession. If everyone on the block starts doing Coin Matrix and Triumph routines, then what is left? Will the layperson soon become a vanished breed?

Argumentative. You pose these questions, then leave the reader to answer those questions for themselves. You do not expand on your arguments, which is required in this format - the reader cannot answer you, so you must give thought to the ideas that you propose, otherwise you leave the reader with nothing but their own thoughts on the subject.

Further, this depends on who you ask as to whether or not exposure is hurting magicians in the 21st century. You will find that if you ask the professionals, they will tell you that exposure doesn't hurt them one, little bit. Lance Burton stated (when asked if exposure was hurting magic), "It is not an issue, never has been to the professional." So, if you are going to dispute the likes of Lance Burton, then you'd better have a good argument.

As long as magic shops are public and internet magic websites running, some average Joe could learn or purchase, say, a DVD by Jay Sankey or Tyler Wilson’s book, learn the effects they were not meant to learn, not take it seriously, and teach it to others without a care.

With the exception of the internet, shops have been exposing and selling magic to the laymen for 100 years. All the old catalogues can be seen to sell magic tricks with the tag line, "Do it right out of the box, no practice required."

It hasn't been an issue to us for 100 years, why is it an issue now? You must answer this in your text, you must give us reasons.

PRACTICE. If, for whatever reason (as an icebreaker?), a layperson is willing to put the time and effort, the person CAN learn the routine or sleight and use it. That is another form of exposure: poor handling of an effect. If a layperson learns an intermediate effect, the person will most likely slip up, or get caught. And what is worse, THEY OFTEN DO NOT CARE. They often do not take magic seriously. They think of magic as a simple hobby such as knitting or baking.

Examples? (And, yet again, proliferation of all caps in the text). What makes you say this? We must assume that most anyone taking the time to read your essay/book feels much the same as you do, so this becomes "preaching to the choir." Good points, true - but we need expansion on your thoughts.

Most magicians’ jobs and lives rely on magic, and if laypeople know, for instance, a D/L exists, they could call you on one, even if you aren’t doing it! I, for one, would be destroyed by that, since most card routines I do contain at least one D/L.

D/L? Do not assume that your reader understands your abbreviations. You must give them the abbreviation in the text prior to using it. And, overuse of abbreviations will lead to an extremely difficult to read text.

Example:

When using your D/L with a R/D you will want a BDLS/DK so as not to hinder and S/S with a P/O or T/P.

Try to stay away from abbreviations in your text.

One of the best ways is to CREATE your own magic. To invent or innovate a new trick or sleight and keep it to yourself. “How can I create my own magic?” There are numerous ways to go about it. Here is the first way.

...followed with...

We are going to execute a test. Right here, right now. Do NOT leave your seat, but look around you. Find the closest object to yourself. Pick up the object. I am going to tell you exactly what you are holding. Concentrate on the object. Think of nothing else but the object.

So, you’re thinking of it, your mind clear of any other thoughts. Read the following:


The object you are holding is rather small. It has a slightly round quality to part of it. It is a smooth object. The object is slightly flexible. The object is…

Your first magic creation.

I am right, aren’t I? Of course I am, because that is the object you are stuck with for the next while. At least, until you create magic with it.

What? There is no lucidity to this. You might understand what you are trying to say, but your reader does not. Ten different readers could read this and come up with 10 different explanations of what you are trying to say.

In all honesty, I'm not sure I understand where you are going with this. Once you lose the reader on the path, you've lost the reader. They will put your book down and never return (which means that they'll never buy anything in the future that bears your name).

Look at your object. Now think of something magical that could happen to the object. Could it change colour? Could it levitate? Could it spontaneously combust? Could it be ground into powder with your bare hands? Of course not… in real life. I want you to think about reality now, and relate the magical occurrence you have in mind to it. What could be used with your object to make the magic happen? IT? Confetti? Paint? A TT?

More abbreviations.

Again, you are asking too many questions of your readers. They don't want you to ask them questions, they want you to give them answers - that is specifically why they bought your book.

Now, I want you to think of a way your magical occurrence could happen to your object. Could it be palmed? Could you use the paddle move? Could it be sleeved?

You are making assumptions. Does your reader know what palming is? Does your reader know what a paddle move is? Does your reader know what sleeving is? If they don't, then you've lost them.

Think of an easy method, utilizing (for example) a false transfer or key card principle. But also think of advanced methods, even if the method is far beyond your skill. As long as you know the mechanics of the advanced sleights, you should be fine. Think of methods using Culling, Multiple Breaks, Sleeving, or the Tenkai Pinch.

False transfer? Key card? Culling? Multiple breaks? Tenkai pinch? How can I think of advanced methods if I only know basic methods? Again, you are putting far too much on your reader as to what they should/do know.

It is up to you to take your reader by the hand and lead them down the path. If you do not, then they will get lost.

Now that it has all been worked through, go get any materials you have in mind to make the magic happen, and work with your idea. If your idea doesn’t work, NO PROBLEM! Just use alternative methods! You must have skimmed through a few techniques while brainstorming, why not give them a go? It wouldn’t hurt to try.

Make what magic happen? Going back to your opening, "what is magic," you still have not answered this question. Your reader is unsure as to what magic is and now you want them to make magic happen.

You are further suggesting using alternate methods when we haven't even decided on a base method and we don't even know what the hell we're trying to accomplish. You need specific examples, rather than "pick something up and figure out something magical and make something magical happen."

I wouldn't hurt to try what?

Now, I know that in your own mind you know exactly what you're talking about - but your reader, the important person in all of this, doesn't. They cannot read your mind.

Congratulations! You now know the basics of putting together a routine!

No, they don't. Routining is a seperate issue to what you are attemping to explain above. Routining has nothing to do with picking up an object and figuring out what we can do magically with that object which, based on your text, we don't even know that, yet.

You are now all over the boards, explaining a million things and yet not explaining one, single thing. You are telling your reader to sprint when they don't even know how to crawl. You are making assumptions based on what you personally know to be true, but leaving your reader completely in the dark.

*******************

Okay, I've just now spent 45 minutes on the above. I think that you can now understand some of the very important problems that your text has and anything that I do at this point will be just to say much of the same as what I've said above for the rest of your text.

And, Michael, I've done the work above free of charge for you. I guess I have a hard time understanding why so many guys want to sell stuff all the time, rather than just help out at no charge.

You have a long way to go, but you are still very young. You have time. Quit being in such a hurry.

Mike.

Wow, he's good.

Listen to Michael Jay, he has some very, VERY good points there (capital letters, I know )

Read his post again. It can only help you in the future.

First off, about the abbreviations: They aren't there in my actual notes. The mods got to it

But WOW, thank you very much for your informative post. I can and wil make a bunch of changes to the notes (especially the Putting Together A Routine chapter). I will change it and repost it. Could you please view it and let me know if everything is a-ok?

Thank you !

Michael Kras

Hello Again Michael,

Here are my revised notes. Enjoy! Let me know if it is better.

Thank you.

Michael Kras




YOUR MAGIC

Michael Kras

























Chapter 1: Exposure


What many young magicians do not understand about magic is that it is a highly respected art form by those who pursue it and are engrossed by it. It saddens me to see so many exposures by people young and old on the internet or live. What they do not realize is that, as kind as they may think it is, it is often hurting our profession. If everyone on the block starts doing Coin Matrix and Triumph routines, then what is left? Will the layperson soon become a vanished breed?

As long as magic shops are public and internet magic websites running, some average Joe could learn or purchase, say, a DVD by Jay Sankey or Tyler Wilson’s book, learn the effects they were not meant to learn, not take it seriously, and teach it to others without a care. The truth is, anyone can do what we do. How?

Practice! If, for whatever reason (as an icebreaker?), a layperson is willing to put the time and effort, the person can learn the routine or sleight and will often use it. That is another form of exposure: poor handling of an effect. If a layperson learns an intermediate effect, the person will most likely slip up, or get caught. And what is worse, they often do not care! They often do not take magic seriously. They think of magic as a simple hobby such as knitting or baking. But it is not! Most magicians’ jobs and lives rely on magic, and if laypeople know, for instance, a DL exists, they could call you on one, even if you aren’t doing it! I, for one, would be destroyed by that, since most card routines I do contain at least one DL. Many times we get away with sleights because laypeople aren’t looking for a palmed card or coin. They do not even know that type of thing exists, but if they do, POOF! The close-uppers career is weakened. Exposure happens; it is all too real. So how can it be avoided?

One of the best ways is to create your own magic. To invent or innovate a new trick or sleight and keep it to yourself. “How can I create my own magic?” There are numerous ways to go about it. Here is the first way.





























Chapter 2: A Simple Test

We are going to execute a test. Right here, right now. Do NOT leave your seat, but look around you. Find the closest object to yourself. Pick up the object. I am going to tell you exactly what you are holding. Concentrate on the object. Think of nothing else but the object.

So, you’re thinking of it, your mind clear of any other thoughts. Read the following:


The object you are holding is rather small. It has a slightly round quality to part of it. It is a smooth object. The object is slightly flexible. The object is…

Your first magic creation.

I am right, aren’t I? Of course I am, because that is the object you are stuck with for the next while. At least, until you create magic with it.

Look at your object. Now think of something magical that could happen to the object. Could it change colour? Could it levitate? Could it spontaneously combust? Could it be ground into powder with your bare hands? Of course not… in real life. I want you to think about reality now, and relate the magical occurrence you have in mind to it. What could be used with your object to make the magic happen? IT? Confetti? Paint? A TT?

Now, I want you to think of a way your magical occurrence could happen to your object. Could it be palmed? Could you use the paddle move? Could it be sleeved? Of course, most magic effects use more than one magic sleight or principle to make the magic happen, so you should think of numerous ways to accomplish your dream effect. Think of an easy method, utilizing (for example) a false transfer or key card principle. But also think of advanced methods, even if the method is far beyond your skill. As long as you know the mechanics of the advanced sleights, you should be fine. Think of methods using Culling, Multiple Breaks, Sleeving, or the Tenkai Pinch. For example, a Colour Changing Hair Comb could be accomplished simply with a couple of Paddle Moves or in a more advanced way with the Flipstick move and a quick sleeving.

Now that it has all been worked through, go get any materials you have in mind to make the magic happen, and work with your idea. If your idea doesn’t work, no problem! Try alternative methods. You must have skimmed through a few techniques while brainstorming, why not give them a go? It wouldn’t hurt to try.

Congratulations! You now know the basics of putting together a basic effect! All that is left is patter and presentation, and maybe an extension or improvement of your effect. There is definitely much improvement needed for your effect. However, you are still not done. The next chapter is of great importance, so read it carefully before so much as practicing your creation.










Chapter 3: The Angry Magician and YOU

Michael Kras has just created a magic effect. He calls this effect “Coins Across” which involves the coins magically traveling from one hand to the other. He claims this is a totally new concept, and publishes it in his new book. His book becomes a bestseller, and magicians love this new magic! Michael sits in his armchair, greedily counting his money, when a loud knock on the door is heard. Michael jumps out of his armchair and makes his way toward the door. Through the peephole, he espies a group of angry close-uppers! Michael does the only thing he can think of: he RUNS! He gallops toward the back door, and a loud THUD is heard! The magicians have broken down the front door! They quickly hurdle toward Michael, and….


I will leave that to your imagination. Sorry if I scared you, but that IS what will happen if you rip-off a published magic effect. Okay, maybe not so extreme, but many in the magic community will be against you. Why? Because you have stolen.

Whether you know it or not, you have stolen an existing effect from a potential artist. As negative as it sounds, it happens all the time. Magicians do not do there homework before releasing their effect to the magic community, and get burned on it later.

How can this be avoided? Easily! Just do your research and find out if the effect has been done before. Of course, you can easily find out if the effect is the same as a slightly famous effect just by looking around. Surf the internet, read a book. It is acceptable if the EFFECT is the same but your METHOD is different, but a routine accomplished by a method that is already in print is definitely a no-no. Heck, you should even be careful in Case A. Some magicians STILL think if your effect is the same or even somewhat similar to an existing effect but the method is different, it is still stealing, especially if you call the effect original. Just take a look at every magic book and DVD you own and check if your effect is in print before releasing. If it is, you can still remodel the effect until it utilizes a different magic principle. The best place to research is in the Tarbell Course In Magic, since so many methods are in print just there. Of course, it would be impossible to study and research every existing magic book, video, manuscript, or marketed effect, especially for one effect, so the best thing to do is study the most popular magic products and records. If you reprint something that has been long forgotten, it can be called a discovery. Note that I said “discovery”. That is a mistake many magicians make. Since it is near impossible to create something totally new these days, the best you can say you have accomplished is discovered an effect. Not created, not invented, but discovered! There is no possible way of telling if an effect is original, which it most likely isn’t, so you lose all credibility in the magic community by, basically, lying!


As long as you have studied and have really tried to find an effect, you can call your effect a discovery. Since the earliest magic book in print dates back to 1584 with a book entitled The Discovery Of Witchcraft, there is no possible way of finding out if an effect has been done before. Note the word “Discovery” in the book’s title! Even in the 1500s there was no way of telling! If someone in those times could figure that out, so can you.







Chapter 4: Effective Ways To Create Magic

You are in a creative mood. You feel the need to play around to create an effect. Ideas start brewing in your mind, and you anxiously jump out of your seat and lunge for a deck of cards. STOP RIGHT WHERE YOU ARE! STEP AWAY FROM THE BIKES!

I strongly recommend you do not try to create a card effect until you have some experience in creating magic. Why? Believe me, as common as card effects are, you will find it very difficult to create a card effect… at least one that is as “new” as possible. You might find yourself re-inventing The Ambitious Card or Twisting The Aces. Trust me, as experienced as you may be with cards, it is no picnic to create something new with them. You will most likely get burned, or worse, stuck. But do not fret! You can still brainstorm today, my friend. Why don’t you grab the hammer in your garage? Get a sponge from the bathroom while you’re at it!


Believe it or not, the best way and easiest way to discover something that is hopefully new is to play around with the most uncommon props in magic! Tennis rackets, batteries, broccoli, ANYTHING. That is, anything BUT cards or coins.

How about recharging the battery with your hand? Biting and restoring the broccoli? Levitating a tennis ball and whacking it into the distance with the tennis racket? All great examples of effects with the most uncommon of magic props. What can you do with a kite? A television remote? A belt? A knife? The possibilities are endless! I suggest using the technique in Chapter 2 to start brainstorming with your object. However, use this technique in a different way. Enter each room in your house, and grab the first object you see. While you do this, think of the possibilities. How could your object do the impossible? It doesn’t matter if the effects won’t fool other magicians! To fool any layperson from age 5 to 105 is the goal. Don’t stop with household objects either! Check your backyard. What can you accomplish with a rock? A fallen leaf?

While reading this, you may feel rushed to create magic with everything in sight. I advise strongly against that. If you want to create something great with an object, work with that object for a while. THEN move on to something else. Rush is never a good thing, unless you suffer a sudden violent bowel movement.
























Chapter 5: Magic That Is YOU!

Close up magicians create close up magic. Stage performers create stage magic. Children’s performers create children’s magic.

Close uppers don’t normally create stage illusions. Children’s magicians won’t experiment with cards and flash paper. It’s just NOT what they do. Which is why you should create the magic that suits you. Do not create magic that is not your style. You are wasting your time creating something you will never use. The main reason magicians create magic is to keep to themselves. To use themselves without fear of other magicians already having knowledge of the effect. Don’t just create for the sake of creating or keeping yourself busy. There is no point!

When you create an effect, make sure it suits you. Not only your style of magic, but your personality. Add your own humor and your own patter. Patter that is YOU. Not only does it make creating and developing magic much easier, but it makes the magic more believable. If you are a welder that does magic as a hobby, people will relate to and find the magic more believable if, for example, you fuse two pieces of metal together with the heat of your hands. If you are a young magician and start pattering about being on the job or purchasing a new car, you automatically lose credibility for creating real magic. This not only applies to creating magic, but performing magic in general. My advice to you is to try not to use the patter and presentation supplied in the instructions that come with an effect. Create your own patter and presentation that screams “YOU!” This makes magic more believable and more fun for laypeople when you perform impossible feats that relate to your normal life. That alone makes real magic.

I think Michael Jay spent nearly an hour helping you for you to spend a long time going through it. You only spent about half an hour re-doing it. I didn;t read it all, but from the parts I read you are still asking questions and not giving answers. Capital letters are still there which, like he said, look unprofessional.

Your book isn't a piece of homework you feel you have to finish. Let it take time to develop and start to enjoy writing it.

I think that is the main point you are missing.

Exactly! Thank you very much. I wil work with it for a little while. The capitals that are left in there are there deliberatly and I feel as though the questions get the reader's imagination going. I am still missing a few things though, and I will get to work on them. I also revised Chapter 5. Please take a look!

Michael Kras


Chapter 5: Magic That Is YOU!

Close up magicians create close up magic. Stage performers create stage magic. Children’s performers create children’s magic.

Close uppers don’t normally create stage illusions. Children’s magicians won’t experiment with cards and flash paper. It’s just not what they do. Which is why you should create the magic that suits you. Do not create magic that is not your style. You are wasting your time creating something you will never use. The main reason magicians create magic is to keep to themselves. To use themselves without fear of other magicians already having knowledge of the effect. Don’t just create for the sake of creating or keeping yourself busy. There is no point!

When you create an effect, make sure it suits you. Not only your style of magic, but your personality. Add your own humor and your own patter. Patter that is YOU. Not only does it make creating and developing magic much easier, but it makes the magic more believable. If you are a welder that does magic as a hobby, people will relate to and find the magic more believable if, for example, you fuse two pieces of metal together with the heat of your hands. If you are a young magician and start pattering about being on the job or purchasing a new car, you automatically lose credibility for creating real magic. This not only applies to creating magic, but performing magic in general. My advice to you is to try to not use the patter and presentation supplied with a marketed effect. At least, not after a while. I do recommend you start off the effect performing it exactly as the instructions say you should. Practice it this way for about a week, until you have the effect down to a decent working. Afterwards, now that you have decent knowledge of the effect, you can create your own presentation and patter that suits you and your style. To present a routine or effect to laypeople that can relate you your style of life with the effect set to your style, what you are in terms of personality and job, and what you do in terms of hobbies or lifestyles feels like real magic not only to your spectators, but also to yourself. Magic does not get much more real than that!

"Sometimes you must kill your children." - The late, great Eugene Poinc -

Eugene Poinc - a name you should know, Mr. Kras. If you are unfamiliar with the name then google it or ask knowledgeable magicians.

You wrote:I will just keep these notes to myself until I am more knowledgable and can write better and more in-depth about the subject.

"These notes" are just that - notes. These are scattered ideas that need to be made into a lucid essay or even a book. As they stand, though, they have a long, long way to go.

Before I go any further, though, I must say that you exhibit a knack for comedic writing. I tell you this not to stroke your ego, but to ensure that you realize that comedic writing is actually a strength of yours. Your writing needs work (a LOT of work) but if you pick up the books that I've suggested, then you'll find that you may be able to polish yourself into a good writer. Maybe, just maybe, even an excellent writer.

One thing that successful writers will tell you that is important in learning to be a good writer is to read. Read a lot. Read everything you can get your hands on. You cannot read, however, if you're too busy writing all the time, which leads me to:

Please note the date that you've joined these boards and the sheer amount of posts that you've made. You've been a member here for under 4 days and you have 130 posts to your name. Dude - quit typing and start reading. This site offers you so much, but you won't have time to find it if you keep going on and on and on.

This evening, I sat down at my computer with the decision in my mind to do a full rewrite of your notes. Do you know - I just can't. I can take your Chapter 1 and make an entire book on that, and that, alone. As it stands, your Chapter 1 is nothing more than an introduction. It is not a full chapter by any stretch of the imagination. However, I could take what you've given me there as an introduction and make many, many chapters out of it (and none of those chapters would be about anything that you have as subsequent chapters in your notes above). Which is why you need more time to become more knowledgeable and get better at writing and study this subject more in depth.

For example, let's take a look at Chapter 1. It is titled, "Exposure," and the very first line is the question, "What is magic?" Well, is this a chapter on exposure or a chapter on what magic is by definition? It can be one or the other, but it cannot be both (not while maintaining reasonable lucidity, that is).

If I were you, do you know what I'd do with those notes above? I'd throw them out. Sometimes, Michael, you really must kill your children. This is one of those times.

At this point, Michael, I'm sorry, but I can be of no further help to you. You have my best wishes.

Mike.

Michael

I can only echo the comments above.

Personally, I would put the documents aside, and re-visit them when you are a bit more, well, older, wiser etc.

I also agree.

The posts above are perhaps an example of the difference between knowledge (MK) and wisdom (MJ)

Wow . . . he . . . ju . . . I . .

I'm at a loss for words. Mike, you are not taking any of Mr. Jay's advice. You are simply rehashing your old stuff with a slightly different hue to it. As to what you said about the mods giving putting your notes in all caps, that is simply ridiculous and an outright lie. No moderator would alter a post in such a ludicrous way. Also, you may know enough about magic to write a book, but you don't know enough about writing books to write a book. I'm taking a few college courses on English language and composition and I still doubt I could crank out a piece of literature. Wait until you have a fuller idea of the English language and composition writing until you publish a book. Otherwise you will be mocked for your crude sentence structure, flimsy arguments, and rampant fallacies.

???? I thought this whole thing was over.

I took many people's advice and have permanently put aside these "thoughts". And I never said mods capitalized my work. I said the abbreviated some words like, for example, TT.

Thank you. I have taken advice and have gotten rid of the manuscript.

Thank you

???? I thought this whole thing was over.

I took many people's advice and have permanently put aside these "thoughts". And I never said mods capitalized my work. I said the abbreviated some words like, for example, TT.

Thank you. I have taken advice and have gotten rid of the manuscript.

???? I thought this whole thing was over.

I took many people's advice and have permanently put aside these "thoughts". And I never said mods capitalized my work. I said the abbreviated some words like, for example, TT.

Thank you. I have taken advice and have gotten rid of the manuscript.

Mike, you shouldn't take it personally. All your thank yous make them seem insincere. The advice you were given, whether they seemed harsh or not, were good ones. Mature in magic, then come back to awe us. Good luck in the future.

Monker, it seems like you're picking on Mike. He didn't lie, you misinterpreted what he said. You could have left out your lovely adjectives, flimsy and rampant.