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I was doing a few tricks last night at a REPLICANT gig in Stevenage and this one guy thought it was great. But it meant that he wanted to watch everything I did for the rest of the evening following me round as I went to other groups in the pub, and, of course, some tricks have semi-fixed routines or reveal a certain card. I couldn't do these because he'd go "oh it's the 7 of hearts again" or whatever. So, in these situations how do you stop someone being TOO keen? Has anyone else had this and what is the nicest way to tell them to go away!??

"i'd really appreciate it if you'd let me entertain these other guys for now, but as a thank you...i'll come and find you a little later and maybe you can help me out - or i'll perform something special, just for you..."

Stoner asks, in part: ". . .in these situations how do you stop someone being TOO keen? "

That's simple: You don't.

If you are table hopping, you have to expect "followers" and you should tailor your effects to allow for that.

Don't you think that's a little idealistic, Peter? Given that elsewhere on the forum, people have been given the (in my opinion good) advice that when doing table hopping or strolling, it's advisable only to carry 6-8 effects, and given that one (perhaps two) of these might involve forcing the same card for use with a particular gimmick or revelation, I really don't see any way you can expect and cater for someone following you round all night.


Suggesting you "tailor your effects" is an easy thing to say; what you're implying is that all of your effects need to a) never have the same cards selected, b) rarely use the same method twice from peformance to performance and c) introduce a surprising change to the climax of every performance.

So, that's pretty much every magic routine known to man ruled out then... Perhaps you could give us a working example of how to tailor one's effects to stand up to repeated viewing by the same spectator?

I think Iain's advice is much realistic - thank them kindly for being a great spectator, tell them clearly that you're going to perform for some other people now and that you'd be most happy to perform something special for them and/or involve them to a greater extent (perhaps giving them some responsibility, like planting a card) at the end of the evening when everyone has had a chance to see some magic.

Yeah - that sums up the problem exactly! If I'm doing "Tagged" for example it would be a right pain to carry lots of the gimmicks round all night and keep swapping them. Or if you've got a routine where you misdirect by "accidentally" dropping a card or noticing you've still got the joker in the pack (etc etc etc) then that doesn't stand up to repeated viewings.

I haven't done table work in decades but I can count on one hand the number of times someone has followed me around and still have fingers left over. My favorite being Donna King (from the King Family singers) who fell in love with me one evening at a gala in Beverly Hills. She literally drug me from table to table and showed me off. Me, the kid from the Midwest performing for some of the biggest names (Legends in some cases) in all of Hollywood... it was a terrifying and yet, wonderful experience.

Something I've done for years that helps guard against snooppers... those seeking to "learn how I do it" is I simply have at least one alternative method for accomplishing a similar end result. For an example, when I'm doing a mixer these days, most of what I do are mini-Readings; all stock shtick. But where I use a billet switch or peek with one group I'll use my Butterfly with the next, etc. I get the same effect but via an alternate method, which prevents the curios from discovering anything and thus, they end up believing I'm for real... in mentalism especially, repetition of "a move" can seriously work against you.

kFarlsborough says, in part: ". . . I really don't see any way you can expect and cater for someone following you round all night."

I never implied or meant that one should "cater to" the follower. Rather, bore him! Figuring nine tricks (three per table for three tables, then repeat).

If the follower is still following then, after seeing NON-card tricks, perhaps it's time to drop magic and take up stamp collecting.

(If you INSIST on card tricks, please keep them to less than half of the tricks you do. Regardless of what magicians think, lay audiences DO NOT consider card tricks as magical so much as skillful and you will ONLY garner "pity applause".)

After YEARS of table hopping in half a dozen restaurants and bars, my repertoire is:
Scotch and soda (my version and ungimmicked)
52 on 1 (my ONLY type of card trick)
Professor's Nightmare (with my original Uncle Linguini patter)
and so on.

Peter Marucci wrote:If you INSIST on card tricks, please keep them to less than half of the tricks you do. Regardless of what magicians think, lay audiences DO NOT consider card tricks as magical so much as skillful and you will ONLY garner "pity applause".

I agree with not doing all card tricks, but only garnering pity applause is wrong in my experience - it entirely depends on what sort of card tricks. Tricks with lots of dealing, "perfect poker hand" type stuff and to some degree the ACR - fine, I acknowledge your criticism. But if the cards simply become objects which are then fused together, disappear and reappear in impossible places, torn apart and then restored, it's just as powerful as if you'd done that with a coin, a napkin or whatever.

Anyway, I know you're not going to change your tune Peter so I shall respectfully agree to disagree

My advice would be to take a break if this is possible/practical and make the time up elsewhere.

I agree with Craig that this isn't a common thing at all but it has happened to me once. If you're being paid to attend then I'd bet that your booker will rather you take a little time out to lose your stalker than to have his or her guests evenings entertainment ruined.

I'd have gone into the gents for five minutes and then sneak out and start over at the other side of the room and if that didn't work then I'd have to be blunt about it.

Hi Stoner;

you had the advice of experienced practitioners, nothing I can add to it from that angle

But, I'll make a little confession. I could quite easily picture myself being that slightly annoying guy follwing you around (no I'm not a stalker, honest).

It's just that you've probably had more experience at being a magician than he's had at being a spectator?

I would really like to see a magician in a bar, and sure, if I had the chance of seeing you perform a few routines, I'd try.

There's a chance that this is someone who really likes magic and genuinely enjoyed your performance, who may not realise he is disturbing you?

I know if it was me, and you were pointing out to me I was getting in the flow of your show, in a nice way, I would be embarassed, appologise and leave you alone. And yes, if you came back and showed me another trick "just for me ) I'd probably be the guy giving you free publicity with all my friends and family. And colleagues. And the postman.

Just from a newbie's perspective...

PS: If the guy was just another one of these arrogant (French?) stalking ignorant fat b***** - then - I just wouldn't know, sorry

Yeah - good point LBP. I suppose I would have been this guy myself, about six months back, trying to see how the tricks worked and pick up some tips and stuff. Hopefully without getting in the way and spoiling things for others.

I guess that's the main difference - if they are watching and following because they want to learn things and keep quiet about things they notice then that's OK, but if they want to spoil things for other people then it's definitely not and a firm "get lost" may be called for!

Not actually having much opportunity to see close-up magic performed, I have to be careful not to fall into this category if I arrive somewhere to find a magician performing. It's funny to think that as a layperson, you do kind of expect the chap to have magic flowing out of his ears and have something new to show you all night... thinking back to when I didn't do magic it might have surprised me to learn he will only have had a limited number of effects with him!

If I see magicians now, I don't even tell them I'm a magician - why add to their pressure! - I just try to be a perfect spectator, and not say things like "nice DL"

Yeah. Last time I saw that guy who sells magic stuff in Covent Garden I was thinking "false cut, false shuffle, DL, another false cut, p**m, etc" as I watched, but had to keep reminding myself not to say it out loud!

Farlsborough wrote:If I see magicians now, I don't even tell them I'm a magician - why add to their pressure! - I just try to be a perfect spectator, and not say things like "nice DL"

In my mind that's the difference between a magician and someone who just 'learns how to do tricks.'

Peter on your comment about 'pity applause'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&hl=e ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5frj2No_nc

Your wrong.

i remember my first paid gig and i thought (foolishly) that the svengali dec
was the best thing in the world, it didnt dawn on me untill i heard someone chatting at the bar after a few tables, to their suprise, they both picked the seven of hearts (or whatever card it happened to be...). Immediately i dropped gimmicked cards from my act (and indeed forcing a card). My new routine which i do adapt depending on my routine is as follows.
some Hypnotism (depending on the scenario)
crazy mans handcuffs
zamiels rose (derren browns effect)
Ambitious card (with jay sankeys nailed ending or card to bottle as kicker)
Oddball (not sure who did this but brilliant as no reset...)
Scotch and Soda