talkmagic.co.uk

Alright, this is something I've begun to notice recently, and I'm hoping that the fine fellows here can put me at ease over it.

I've recently decided to get back into Close-Up Magic after a few years of being without it in my life at all. Naturally, I decided to go back to my old hangouts online in hopes of getting re-aquainted with Magic and discovering what new wonderful effects have come into existance during my absence.

Imagine my shock, then, when instead of the intelligent, resourceful online magic communities of my memory, I find that all of the message boards I once loved have turned into petty flame wars led by immature middle-schoolers who's only goals are to insult and put down their fellow magician as viciousely and quickly as possible, just because they have a different opinion than themselves.

The Penguin Magic forums are the worst; full of nothing but Criss Angel haters who constantly bash anyone who admits to liking him and proceed to gloat and lecture on 'technique' and 'knowledge' of the art, as if they are the top authority.

So I decided to jump in and defend Angel and others like him. Big mistake. Instead of having an intelligent discussion on the matter, I get called names pertaining to sexual orientation and crucified for even trying to make any points. To make matters worse, even in threads that have nothing to do directly with Criss Angel OR David Blaine, some troll decides to jump in and turn it into that very thing. And the flame wars start all over again.

That's when I realized that I wasn't going to be sticking around these places for much longer, because it seems the magic community on the whole (at least where I have visited) no longer wants to discuss 'magic', and would rather bash others for having an opinion and accuse them of not knowing what magic truly is.

I am desperately looking for an online magicians community that still sticks to the basics of what a community should be about, and I truly hope that Talk Magic is a place like that, because I really enjoy talking about this art, and I shouldn't have to deal with all the immaturity just to get a word in.

So when exactly did this happen? When did the magic community turn into a bunch of middle-schoolers who have their heads so far up David Blaine's rear end that they can't see the reality of it all? I mean, the magic world is much, MUCH bigger than Blaine or Angel. but I can't seem to get away from them or people discussing them no matter what I do. Yes, I love Street Magic and Close-Up effects; it doesn't mean I want to fight over which Magician is better. Ever.

Maybe I'm just overreacting, but this has come as quite a shock to me; I am out of the community for a little while, then I return to find it turned on its head. Someone out there please tell me that I'm not alone, here.

Wat u on mun? Criss angal is da biz innit. Not like blaine shiznit!

Nah - kidding matey

Unfortunately many forums run by online shops, penguin, ellusionist, Theory 11 e.t.c, mainly include members pre-adolescent, who believe that they know all

Talk Magic, although not perfect, is my personal favourite of all the online magic forums. Yes we have our disputes here and there, but more often than not they are held in an adult fashion. It is very rare that you see somebody of the Penguin/Ellusionist/T11 age on here. The majority are either working professionals, or those who take their art seriously

I personally hope you get as much from this board as I did. We have several people on here who's advice is second to nobody's!

Blapsing_Beard wrote:Wat u on mun? Criss angal is da biz innit. Not like blaine shiznit!

Nah - kidding matey

Unfortunately many forums run by online shops, penguin, ellusionist, Theory 11 e.t.c, mainly include members pre-adolescent, who believe that they know all

Talk Magic, although not perfect, is my personal favourite of all the online magic forums. Yes we have our disputes here and there, but more often than not they are held in an adult fashion. It is very rare that you see somebody of the Penguin/Ellusionist/T11 age on here. The majority are either working professionals, or those who take their art seriously

I personally hope you get as much from this board as I did. We have several people on here who's advice is second to nobody's!

Thank you, man. I was beginning to think nobody else cared about what really matters.

I too hope to get a lot out of this community. I want to do it right this time; learn the techniques, perform in front of people with confidence, enhance my act as often as possible, etc. Hopefully I'll get some good tips from the people here.

Mjoel,
First let me tell you welcome back to close up magic!

You are correct in your statement that most forums have been taken over by snot nose kids. I miss the way we use to have really GOOD conversations on forums.

I did like the Green place but find it completely different than it had been a few years ago. I still go to a few boards but only to look around. This is how things are now and like it or not, it is here to stay. These kids THINK that they knew everything because they have watched a few DVDs. They even give advice to anyone who is dumb enough to listen! They know nothing of magic or mentalism BEFORE there was Criss Angel. WOW, this is the type of crowd that I want to be a part of! …. UHHH …that last part was a joke…..



Ray

Ray, thank you very much for the welcome back, and I hope to get better as I focus more of my time on my magic, which like I say has been neglected for a while, unfortunately.

At least (from the responses I've gotten so far) it seems that this forum is still pretty resourceful and mature, so I think I'll stay awhile. I'm sure I'll enjoy my time here.

Would you say that this is my best bet in terms of quality online interaction with magicians? All the other forums seem to be just like the rest.

Criss Angel is great.. if you like overrated middle-aged wannabe Goth kids.

Truth is long before the world knew who Criss was, he did some great, very solid magic and was a humble and very respectful kid that most people liked. After his first season with MTv however, the quality of his material plummeted down hill quickly, getting worse with each season and of course, the swelling of his ego and general assholiness towards 99.9% of the people that helped put him on the map.

Sorry to be so down on your dream date deary, but even before Criss proved to the world that he had an IQ slightly lower than a Rock on the U.S. PHENOMENON program his status (ratings) were falling. Add in the fiasco @ Luxor and voila!

At one point in time Criss had all the duckies in life lined up perfectly for launching the sort of career most all of us dream of. Sadly, like so many, his success destroyed him. I've watched this scenario hundreds of times over the past four decades and I know there are a few other old timers around here that can echo what I'm saying.

Criss lost his sense of genuine humility and more importantly, his respect for both, the art and his audience. The way he treated Steve Baker is just one example of how indignant this little twerp can be, I'll not air the laundry of others that worked with him at various levels in that they've gone out of their way to obfuscate their reasons for disassociation, but the truth is known.

The point to all of this is the fact that there are many reasons why people talk down about Criss these days... sadly, much of the scuttle butt you hear on the forums however, is not based on the sort of things I'm referring to but simply the fact that the public gets tired of the same flavor after a while and wants the next new thing. Frankly, given the "quality" of what I've seen on Tv in the past year, I don't think we're going to be seeing any kind of landmark talent hitting the headlines anytime soon. The so-called "Masters of Illusion" is rife with some of the worse acts I've seen in years (with the exception of a few old timers that drop in to carry the show here and there).

Sorry for not supporting your idol, but as I said, there are many reasons as to why Angel and Blaine (in particular) are not viewed as favorably as they once were. Then too, Blaine seems to be picking up the slack and moving up in the ratings game, being the more preferable to watch now days... at least that's the word on the streets, as we say.

I never said he was my idol, and your post now makes me worry about talk magic's maturity level as well.

mjoel wrote:I never said he was my idol, and your post now makes me worry about talk magic's maturity level as well.

Welcome toTM...you will like it here...it is my preferred forum as it has some great people and good discussion. Stay a while and hopefully you will find some good resources here. PM any time.

Best wishes

Todd

As the good doctor said, I think you'll enjoy your time here at TM. Do yourself a favour and stay away from the Penguin forums; no good will come of it if you venture back there. TM is the only magic forum I frequent on a regular basis, with occasional excursions to the Bunny and the Cafe (although I don't post much on either of those forums).

Anyway, welcome back to the scene and if you stick around I know you'll get a lot from it. There are lots of very experienced and knowledgeable members here who will be happy to help.

Thanks, guys. That's four out of five responses so far that have been kind. VERY different from what I'm used to.,

Welcome mJoel

I mainly come to this forum for the social aspect of meeting up with fellow magicians, having a laugh, learning with like minded people and getting out there performing for the public building confidence and working on routines while having fellow magicians around to help you out on the way.
Regional Meets thread is where you'll find various meet ups.

Fluff a trick, no worries one of the other guys will come along and pick up the slack etc.... point you in the right direction of presentation, tell you to drop stuff that doesn't suit you, all the good stuff you sometimes need to hear.

Without the meets I wouldn't be out there performing to the level I am now (some might say why do I bother of course ). Of course there is also the great advice and reviews etc that the place really does feel like a "community"

Hope you enjoy your stay here, it's not all bad

(IB laden post I know so feel free to quote large parts of it if you want as it's been a while since i've been there)

TM is a prety good place to chat, there are plenty of people here who really do know what they're talking about and offer very good advice. We do get the odd arguement flare up but it's certainly not as bad as many other forums out there.

Hopefully even widely differing opinions can be held and put forward for proper discussion here. Messrs Angel and Blaine did magic a great service by shoving it back into the limelight and if they get back to the roots of 'proper' magic they'd easily be top class performers once again.

As for problem posts, from time to time we get worryingly know-all newcomers intent on stirring up trouble but they soon realise we aren't that kind of Forum and either shape up or go somewhere else (possibly with a little assistance from the Moderators ). I don't always agree with some of the thoughts and ideas put forward here but I have great respect for the way they're presented and the 'give and take' attitude employed by most members. Most times there's something new to learn from these discussions so it's worth making sure they stay on course and those who may perhaps feel a little less confident can feel free to add their comments.

I am a member (like a lot of people) of far to many Magic forums.

But there are Two i use
1. Is to mostly check in with my mates and occasionally get tid bits.
2. Is TM, to have grown up conversations.

On some of the other sites - The first people to critisize are the "Arm Chair Professionals" who would probably pee their pants if they ever had to stand up and talk in front of a group, let alone perform.

What i like about TM is you dont always get the answer you want to hear, but it is 99% of the time, truthful and meant without malice.

One problem with any forum on any subject anywhere is that the people who are most vocal aren't necessarily the most informed or best able to give relevant answers. Unfortunately it's common when on a new site to take notice of the five or so most regular or loudest posters and assume that they're the core of the site, after all that's what you see at first look.

You can learn a lot from any established forum by lurking, searching and filtering out most of the day to day posts. It's nice to see that TM is already living up to your expectations without needing to do that!