"psychic" day courses!

Struggling with an effect? Any tips (without giving too much away!) you'd like to share?

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Postby Mandrake » Sep 7th, '09, 16:06



Mr_Grue wrote:I just think that if you go around saying you're getting information from the big beyond, then you are messing around with people's beliefs. I know a lot of working psychics will make some kind of disclaimer, along the lines of "I don't know where the information comes from" but if they then go on to say "I'm seeing a man with gingery white hair here, and he's showing me a box of old photos..." then they're certainly not sticking to their claimed doubts about the origins of the information. Throw a few grieving people into the mix, and then where are we?

Can't argue with that, and it's why anyone thinking of becoming involved ought to understand how powerful even their throwaway remarks can and will be to some other people.

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Postby Ted » Sep 7th, '09, 16:09

I can't explain it but right now I'm getting this sense, a feeling, that Mark... no, someone called Paul? is writing a... book?

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Postby themagicwand » Sep 7th, '09, 16:12

Ted wrote:I can't explain it but right now I'm getting this sense, a feeling, that Mark... no, someone called Paul? is writing a... book?

Oh, you're very good. Did you train under one of the old masters? :D

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Postby daleshrimpton » Sep 7th, '09, 16:13

themagicwand wrote:
Ted wrote:I can't explain it but right now I'm getting this sense, a feeling, that Mark... no, someone called Paul? is writing a... book?

Oh, you're very good. Did you train under one of the old masters? :D

right on both accounts.. Mark has a book, and Paul has a book. :)

you're like Yoda.you dont say much, but what you do say is worth listening to....
Greg Wilson about.... Me.
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Postby Mandrake » Sep 7th, '09, 16:24

I've booked Paul's book and marked Mark's book...

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Postby theseer » Sep 7th, '09, 16:59

This reminds me of the History of Magic Chapter in Tarbells course of Magic volumne 1

Where Tarbell states the difference between the Magi and Pagan Priest.
If we put this into modern terms and subsititue "Magic" for shut-eye and "Pagan Priest" for sceptic and/or Rowland Type we will see this term tarbell so wonderfully presentss in this statement

The Magic tauaght the miracle of natural law, love within the heart-the pagan priests taught the power of phenomena

The Magi sought to expand every man into a superman-the false priests sought to enslave man

This all applys very good and well this conversation. Shut-eye readers are legitmitaely sympathetic with their readings, instead of flaunting their ego around like many so-called mentalist/readers do.

Many Mentalists will try and disprove psychics/mediums in his show, when in fact he has a need for his audience to believe that in fact he has occult powers. Sceptics (who are usually just cynics) Tend to hold illogical beliefs, on magic occult phenomena. Although in their mind they "know" this kind of activity cannot exist, they are still subject to it all. Such as if the moment they think of their Dead grandmother the lights go out, although they know these two events are unrelated in any way there is still a strong notion of something supernatural.

I truly believe that psychics and such live in fact a much simpler life, which is the main goal of many people. :D They do not live with a constant need to show prove themselves, or to explain seemingly unexplainable things. They are happy with the unseen and live quite in peace with it. I think alot can be learned from shut-eyes. They know something that we can't seem to grasp.

But opinions aside. And onto another idea, The moment we turn off our logical mind is the moment we tend to let out a stream of un-concious bable that usually turns out to hold more truth than in logical "cold"-readings....

WELL...Isnt this the point of theories put forth in WonderWords by Kenton Knepper? The more sensational ideas you can get away with the stronger the reading. I am very fond of his book "Mind Reading"

But this is also a main point in acting, the moment we stop thinkning through every action and reaction we stop thinking and grasping for the right words to say...is this moment we shed our logical, thinking, acting, body and instead put on the robes of our character in a mystical baptism. This is the goal of every actor, complete union with character. The moment we stop thinkning of ourself, is the moment we begin thinking of other...thus "reacting" so to say. (which is what real acting is)

If we really get down to it, thats what shut-eye readers accomplish. REACTION to their sitter, complete and other empathy with them, they are no longer thinking of their every word and reading, worrying about what they are going to say next. Instead they let their sitter lead them slowly guiding them unjumbling the steady stream of symbols, and coded messages their subconscious sends them. This should be the Readers/mentalists main goal.

We tend to throw the baby out with the bathwater, we often deem things too simple or irrational, but these things down the line are the things that usually make the most sense.

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Postby IAIN » Sep 7th, '09, 17:24

"if you meet buddha, kill him"

can't remember where i read that, but in amongst some zen koans somewhere...

anyway - the thing is with rowland is this...he isnt a reader, he never claims to be, he has appeared countless times on tv though, doing much better than the real psychics and readers do - when tested against them...

funny that innit...

I'm not saying there isnt any psychic ability, i think its more down to the use of language within that definition...

ted andrews has some interesting books out, one on psychometry...he makes a massively valid point that if you are going to be making a living as a reader, underneath it all - you better go and get yourself some training in counselling...especially bereavement...

ted andrews does give readings, doesnt perform, and is quite successful at what he does apparently...and yes, is a fully qualified/trained counsellor...(for what its worth)...

lets not forget where we get most of our techniques from either eh, if the old school dames were doing it for real, why the cracking toes, slate writing with toes...in fact, why the obsession with toes?!

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Postby themagicwand » Sep 7th, '09, 17:29

IAIN wrote: why the obsession with toes?!

I must admit, I have quite a crush on those Fox girls! :oops:

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Postby mark lewis » Sep 7th, '09, 18:08

Rowland does NOT do better readings on TV than real psychics do. His readings are bloody awful as a matter of fact. I think he has been reading his own book.

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Postby Mandrake » Sep 7th, '09, 21:12

IAIN wrote: why the obsession with toes?!

Ask Sarah Ferguson and John Bryan.... :twisted:

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Postby Craig Browning » Sep 7th, '09, 22:25

daleshrimpton wrote:
themagicwand wrote:
Ted wrote:I can't explain it but right now I'm getting this sense, a feeling, that Mark... no, someone called Paul? is writing a... book?

Oh, you're very good. Did you train under one of the old masters? :D

right on both accounts.. Mark has a book, and Paul has a book. :)


I have two books on the topic but they're for the shut-eye market :twisted:

As to the comment made by Mr_Grue about not knowing where it comes from and then offering details... I think one is confusing elements.

I have had situations that (coincidentally) involved the dearly departed. To this day I don't know where certain thoughts, images, smells, etc. came from and yet there is no denying that it happened... at least for me and those the information was shared with. Similarly, I've had far more than a few Readings convey information that was absolutely impossible for me to know anything about... even the person I was doing the Reading for was either denying what I was saying at the time or at a loss until suddenly something clicks... and no, this isn't one of those crafty psychological dodges... it couldn't be given the details that were WRITTEN OUT without any double-speak and yet the entire scenario came about and rang true...
... and don't get into the stupid JREF challenge, you know where I stand on that and there's no reason to drag that horse back out of its grave.

Oh! And no, it is not something that happens regularly or that can be made to happen on cue... at least not in my experience and according to some of the old ones I've had long chats with, not with most. But that is not saying that it doesn't happen or that such things don't exist.

Thinking that a Reader or Psychic is hurting others or infringing on them is a matter of opinion and not the opinion of the person patronizing said operator. So maybe, if it's not directly affecting you or your own household, you might want to leave room for the rest of the world... especially when you consider the fact that more people believe than not.


Some years ago I caught a Spiritualist minister doing what was essentially the same billet reading act I was doing in my show at the time... I had this dude bare handed and yet the authorities couldn't do anything because NO ONE HAD FILED A COMPLAINT AGAINST HIM. However, they could and did enforce the court order that said I couldn't word things so as to create prejudice towards him and his congregation... now figure that one out.

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Postby IAIN » Sep 8th, '09, 00:28

mark lewis wrote:Rowland does NOT do better readings on TV than real psychics do. His readings are bloody awful as a matter of fact. I think he has been reading his own book.


not the ones i've seen, nor the ones documented (and verified) in his book...

in fact, most of the people who get on telly from the psychic world, are horrible vain ghastly beasts...

colin fry (who once changed from "its a person who is physically in spirit, with his grandad" - who was then informed that the person was still alive but brain dead, and didnt have any known relatives from that era - and also got caught playing a trumpet in a seance)

derek acokorah - who told a guy all kinds of things during a live gig, only for that guy to be an undercover reporter who explained his family background before going to the gig, and just agreeing with everything derek said to see if it was all kosher

by the by, I'm a huge fan of peter hurkos and Croisette, and would love any kind of ability to be verifiable and true...

:D

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Postby Randy » Sep 8th, '09, 00:32

Who was the guy on "Most Haunted" who acted like he was getting possessed by a spirit that actually wasn't even there. I think the story went that he got the info incorrect or the other person made up the name of the ghost, and then as the show went on. He was acting like he was getting possessed by said ghost. He also acts like EVERY house is haunted when it could just be leaky pipes or something.

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Postby IAIN » Sep 8th, '09, 00:37

Craig Browning wrote:Some years ago I caught a Spiritualist minister doing what was essentially the same billet reading act I was doing in my show at the time... I had this dude bare handed and yet the authorities couldn't do anything because NO ONE HAD FILED A COMPLAINT AGAINST HIM. However, they could and did enforce the court order that said I couldn't word things so as to create prejudice towards him and his congregation... now figure that one out.


i may be missing the point of that bit, but surely YOU could have filed that complaint as you caught him red-handed? :?

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Postby Reverend Tristan » Sep 8th, '09, 03:04

I'm really enjoying this topic so please keep it clean guys :D no point in trying to change anyones minds so don't try but keep up the posts.

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