talkmagic.co.uk

fair comments you make... all of them. as i said though, i do shop around and buy at what i believe to be the "right time" to get the right price. in any case, my main point is why do people bash Ellusionist... ???

NB. Ellusionist deal of the century, How to Do Street Magic DVD + King Rising DVD for less than US$30... that's less than 17 pounds right? i received mine last week... very happy with that value. sadly i think the deal is over now.

mark lewis wrote:Oh. The Greeks are even worse than the Australians. I live in a Greek area of Toronto so I should know.

My cousin in London had some kind of business where he would supply materials to all the Greek tailors. He used to go nuts because their cheques would always bounce. He went bankrupt in the end. To this day he blames it on the Greeks.

They make good Kebabs though.

As long as they make good Kebabs everything can be forgiven. I hope your cousin has learnt his lesson now. Beware of Greeks bearing gifts (and bouncy cheques).

Good Evening BobbY_Cat, it's good to see another dude from Australia struggling with the Pound and the U.S Dollar and also those nice overseas shipping fees.

B0bbY_CaT wrote:I think Ellusionist is a great site, for the most part their products are very well presented and if you watch carefully and time things well... very very well priced (eg. how to do street magic DVD + King Rising DVD for US$30... amazing!!!)

That's all very well and good but what about us poor misers that bought it for the full price.

B0bbY_CaT wrote:i often read people "bashing Ellusionist", making comments like "didn't someone else think of that first..." and "same sh*t different wrapping" and "flashy but little substance..."

rarely (by their own admission) have the people making such comments got any direct experience with the product they are "bashing" or even any experience with doing business with Ellusionist themselves.

I thought the people who made comments on this particular thread were not brainlessly bashing Ellusionist.com. None of them sounded bitter to me. I think their points were quite valid, level headed and objective (except for mine ). A lot of us buy some of our gear from Ellusionists, so we obviously don't despise them (God! I bet Brad is breaking one of my pay cheques as I am typing up this post!) Nonetheless, I always think it is healthy to have an open and democratic discussion regarding peoples views. So you are definately entitled to your say.

B0bbY_CaT wrote:as someone relatively new to magic, the one thing i can see very clearly is that presentation, presentation, presentation is as, if not more important than any sleight of hand or well gaffed gimmick. and in many cases, it is that precise presentation, suggested handling, key points to focus on, that can make even an old concept... so much more effective it seems like it is NEW. does anyone do that better than Ellusionist??? even Banacheck said Wayne Houchin's handling of Stigmata was better than his... so all those people knocking Stigmata as a waste of money and a "copy" of something someone else did... are you more qualified than Banacheck to make that observation? do you own Wayne Houchin's Stigmata?

Banancheck's job is to mess with peoples minds ! He did it to a group of scientist for a couple of years and has continued to do it to laymen for countless more My "conspiracy theory" would be that Banacheck is probably getting royalties from Ellusionist's Stigmata, so it would be a wise thing to say what he said, especially if people have already bought his previous product. But nonethelss from what I have heard you are probably right; Wayne Houchin's presentation is meant to be very good and makes this product what it is. I am also aware that Brad Christian likes to focus on the subtleties of presentation which probably stems from his drama background (this is a good thing).

B0bbY_CaT wrote:I am not sure what this "Mark Lewis" from earlier in this topic is trying to say. trying much too hard to "appear" intellectual. he comes across as very bitter and jealous of Brad Christian, sad really. doesn't like Aussies either it seems, but big deal... we dont get upset or offended so easy.

I think he is good value! He is a liar and a thief and a corruptor of all that is good and pure! But he is also someone to pay attention to (just don't get pulled into the darkside while you do it ). He is a magician from the old school and if you read some of the advice he gives in several of his posts, you will find that he is very knowledgable in the art and we are lucky to have him on this forum. I also don't think he hates Aussies, he might hate Greeks for what they did to his cousin (can you blame him!), but I think he has a soft spot Aussies - actually I think he thinks of himself as an Aussie deep, deep inside

B0bbY_CaT wrote:Thanks to "money making" ventures such as Ellusionist & The World Magic Shop & Penguin Magic, my childhood fascination in magic has now been realised in adulthood.

Yes, and making me completely and utterly broke!!

B0bbY_CaT wrote:and i tell you, doing a few tricks for my 6 and 10 year old sons at a restaurant on the weekend, seeing the looks on their faces as their eyes light up... worth every cent of the $100's of dollars i willingly spend at Ellusionist.com

Yes, that is priceless I have always loved performing for my nephews and my god daughter. But it still somewhat shits me that Brad C is walking around with my hard earned cash! I wonder what he spends it on...

wow!

Costas... what a breakdown! i enjoyed every paragraph! thanks for your input, comments and yes, also your insight into the dark world of Mark Lewis, I am wiser as a result of reading your post.

sorry to hear you paid full price for HTDSM... not as sorry as i would be if i paid full price but...

The Ellusionist "bashing" is not isolated to this thread, it is a common thing i see across many threads, often by people who dont acctually own the products they are bashing. I think the best thread was the one where someone was bashing a book by Ellusionist based on doing tricks with a (black deck i think???) only to find out it wasn't Ellusionist's version of the book they were complaining about.

you know, the urban myth... "what do you think of Ellusionist?" "they are flashy and over priced..." for example???

if elllusionist have what i want at the right price, i buy it from them, if not i shop around on eBay. it works for me. I have purchased many authentic Ellusionist items at savings of around 20 - 30%... i dont mean second hand DVD's, i mean new stuff from retailers.

what i like about Ellusionist is that they allow normal magicians to sell their tricks on their site (Mercury, Mindbender, Stigmata, king rising). i dont see any other sites or stores that do this very often.

B0bbY_CaT wrote:sorry to hear you paid full price for HTDSM... not as sorry as i would be if i paid full price but...

Thanks, I know exactly how you feel.

B0bbY_CaT wrote: The Ellusionist "bashing" is not isolated to this thread, it is a common thing i see across many threads, often by people who dont actually own the products they are bashing. I think the best thread was the one where someone was bashing a book by Ellusionist based on doing tricks with a (black deck i think???) only to find out it wasn't Ellusionist's version of the book they were complaining about.

That is funny! But seriously, I usually keep away from threads or posters who are just out to be malicious. But I did appreciate the comments made on this particular thread and I felt the issues brought up were thought provoking rather than just ignorant.

I have made my comments regarding the ellusionist forums. I had stated that I think the protective forums are an excellent idea and can be invaluable when it comes to learning more about your purchased effects. But when it comes to reviews or constructive criticism I cannot see how a forum that is run by that very same business that sells those effects can remain totally unbiased. I don't mean to sound cynical, but for me, it's just the law of nature.

As far as their products go. I do think for the most part they are of high quality and I have been happy with all my purchases. Their instructional videos are professionally made and pretty much fulfil their advertised goal with the exception of the rushed teaching in Ninja 1 regarding the pass (even though I still think this is a great video). I think Brad’s teaching is engaging but I sometimes think he skims over certain details he shouldn’t; like for example in Crash Course 1 he has a good way of setting up a DL with one hand - which is used several times throughout the video - but he doesn’t go into explaining exactly how this is achieved, he just says to do it. But when he does decide to explain something thoroughly he does it pretty well.

As far as their customer service is concerned, it is top notch without a doubt. Purchases I have made in the past have arrived on my doorstep within four days! And I live all the way in Australia! Any queries that I have had have been dealt with immediately. An example of this is when I purchased the four DVD set of “On The Loose with Bill Malone” it came with a free Black Tiger ID, but when I received it I noticed the cards were cut unevenly. I sent an email out to Ellusionists and they replied very promptly, stating their apology and that they had already shipped out another deck for me. This deck arrived in four days in perfect condition, no questions asked! The only thing was that I wanted the Tiger Deck with the red pips like the deck they sent me originally to match my non gimmicked decks, but I left it at that as I thought it to be my fault for not being specific enough and not noticing that they stock the Tigers in another format.

Zero000 wrote:what i like about Ellusionist is that they allow normal magicians to sell their tricks on their site (Mercury, Mindbender, Stigmata, king rising). i dont see any other sites or stores that do this very often.

I quite agree with your comment. I mean Ellusionst is obviously getting something in return at the end but it's still commendable and refreshing to see that they are open minded enough to give an amature magician the opportunity to market their effect.

"I am not sure what this "Mark Lewis" from earlier in this topic is trying to say. trying much too hard to "appear" intellectual. he comes across as very bitter and jealous of Brad Christian, sad really. doesn't like Aussies either it seems, but big deal... we dont get upset or offended so easy."

I do not understand this quote thing so I shall have to do the best I can. The above excerpt seems to be from an impertinent Australian gentleman who has had the audacity to make the most slanderous remarks about me without having made a formal appointment to do so.

His very post contradicts what he says about Australians not being easily offended. It appears that he himself is a resident of that far off land that is populated by the descendants of convicts. It also appears that he is very easily offended by all sorts of things hence the length of his post moaning and groaning about things of no consequence whatever. It ill behooves him to yap about not being offended when he posts in a manner showing that he is indeed extremely offended. If he weren't offended then why would he make remarks about me in the first place?

I would suggest that he reads my posts carefully and pay better attention to what I have to say in the future if he wishes to progress in magic. I am a very busy and important person and he will understand if I cannot devote my entire attention in trying to educate him. He really will have to do a little thinking for himself.

First he accuses me of trying to appear intellectual. I must inform him that I am MARK LEWIS and am not an "intellectual". I am merely a genius. Australia is known for many things. Kangaroos. Yes. Beer. Yes. Descendants of convicts. Yes. A rather brash people. Yes.

Intellectuals? Dearie me...................Australia? No. I am afraid that country and the word "intellectual" does not appear to me to go together. The gentleman would therefore not have any familiarity with the understanding of what the word really means so would not be in a position to ascertain whether or not I am an intellectual or not. He would therefore be wise not to comment upon the matter.

I must also advise him to study my posts on Brad Christian a little more thoroughly. Brad is an old friend of mine and I even spent Christmas in his home many moons ago. I am delighted that he is making great gobs of money instead of continuing to starve as a professional magician. It appears that the internet has saved him.

I haven't studied his business and still have only a hazy idea of what he gets criticised for although I did meet a local magician who is a member here who told me sniffily that Brad is a very wicked person indeed because he puts out standard tricks under different names without crediting them to the originator. Or something like that anyway. I am not sure what the complaint actually is.

My position on the matter is who cares except the originator? And the odds are that this illustrious person is dead anyway. If one wishes to make great gobs of money one cannot be worrying about silly things like that. I would have thought that a descendant of a convict would understand this.

I hope Brad continues to get you all to give him pots of money and I approve of it wholeheartedly. He seems to run his business efficiently and far more ethically than I would. He works hard and he deserves every penny. His mother must be proud of him. Better than piddling around in the street doing card tricks anyway.

[/quote]

ah... i see i've struck a nerve. mission accomplished... the waffler turns away from the mirror... albeit momentarily.

Mark, there is a difference between being "easily offended" as you so ignorantly suggest i am, and bemused by your banter as i truely am.

rarely, if ever... does one who owns true genius feel the need to tell people that is the case. typically they simply accept it is obvious and unnecessary to do that... seriously, i should know.

in any case, i enjoy your posts although i must admit to being a little unsure of your intensions beyond having a crack at someone you knew in the past who just turned out more successful than you. i thought Brad's reply to you was very classy... so if you can take away at least one positive, i dont know Brad from E, but having seen your post and his replies i must say that he has gone way up in my estimation... way up.

oh, and just to satisfy your curiosity, i own 4 - 5 Ellusionist DVD's and all give ample credit to originators of a trick. of course i dont own every DVD Ellusionist themselves produces therefore i am only really qualified to talk about those i own... think about that!

anyway, i am off to perform Wanye Houchin's coin through soda can for my kids and their friends... the smile it puts on their faces makes the price i bought it for at Ellusionist (around 13 pounds) worth every cent.

you truely seem an interesting chap, it's people like you who breathe a little humour into the message boards. more power to you Mark and all the best!

Like every some people ellusionist was 1 of the first big sites I came across when starting in magic so did not know ne better.

The site is well put together and the tricks and other products are of ok standerd. Some always look better than they are but that is with all sites.

I seem 2 go for the downloads more than anything else as like most people, can't wait for it 2 be shipped over, so i'd look 2 find the trick somewere closer 2 home.

Ebay is usually a good port of stop 2 find some little gems!!

what i like about Ellusionist is that they allow normal magicians to sell their tricks on their site (Mercury, Mindbender, Stigmata, king rising). i dont see any other sites or stores that do this very often.

Check out siege's fantastic site- http://www.nothingupmysleeve.co.uk

You yourself could sell your own trick, yourself! Gasp!

It appears that I must reluctantly respond to this personage who comes from a place where people walk upside down. I expect it is this odd manner of transporting oneself which has made the blood run to his brain.

I am not in the slightest bit jealous of Brad and indeed feel very proud of him. There is no "crack" at him whatever and any suggestion of such is purely in your imagination. Anybody who manages to extract great wads of money from the undeserving has my deepest respect and admiration. In fact I hope he manages to get a great deal more.

With regard to my own success I am renowned for my modesty and wouldn't dream of commenting on the fact that I also earn great gobs of money and have done so ever since Brad first set eyes on me. I would suggest this impertinent personage who appears to consort with kangaroos and has subsequently picked up some of their habits in jumping around in a demented manner and neglecting to check out the facts.

As to my genius he will see if he checks out Brads reply that Mr Christian himself agrees with my assessment.

I do hope this Robert the Cat personage will try to improve himself in the future.

oh, love it! somewhat "whitty" rhetoric... Mark you are a master at this, i am sure we could be friends if we got to know each other...

but only because i am not easily offended...

i agree Sid, i buy from E when the price is right and look to eBay the rest of the time... i just purchased Revolution from eBay for US$8 + $5 frt... that's $13 total so at that price i am not so fussed if it is the "ant's pants" of vanishes or not!

It is good to see B0bbY_CaT that you have not given in to hostility and incivility regarding the comments made by the reverend of malevolence, Mr Mark Lewis; for such feelings of resentment would only lead you further along the path towards the dark side.

It also perplexes me as to why Mr Mark Lewis believes that walking upside down is such a negative practise when in fact it is quite the contrary; every modest genius and their dog should clearly know that the act of walking upside down stimulates the brain and promotes cell growth. This cell growth is what gives Australian’s (making up a mere population of 20 million) the edge when competing in sporting events against other nameless foreign countries .

Nay, I do not think Mr Mark Lewis is jealous of Brad Christian (apart from desiring the hair on his head); in fact I think it is the other way around - it is Mr Christian who is jealous of Mr Lewis! He is jealous of Mr Lewis’ notoriety! For if he had the same level of infamy as our infernal friend; then and only then would he have the freedom and the audacity to slag off our precious bouncing marsupials and those who live among them!

But I, unlike Mr Lewis, am jealous of Mr Brad Christian! I envy him with greenery ! I would love to wake up and go to work and get paid a sinful amount of money for the very thing I was passionate about! Of course I would want his knowledge, his success, his recognition, his fortune, the speed of his Pass, the power to execute an adversary on the Ellusionist forums, his pet dog (or monkey) and the groceries in his fridge! Yes, I would say that I want it all!

Now if you can forgive me my fellow members, I must end this rant right here, as I am starting to feel a little giddy - typing out this post whilst standing upside down is proving to be a little more challenging on this frosty morning.

Regards,

The Modest Costas The Great!