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storm01 wrote:Tomo
I know your well respected so thanx for the info. It makes me even more curious now.

You have to remember that traditionally mentalism is about shifting focus from what you're doing to what you want people to believe you're doing, far more than in magic. Over the summer, some of us were lucky enough to hear his creative partner Andy Nyman talk about how much work Brown puts into developing what might sometimes be a very simple trick into something that looks completely without cause. He's a very clever man, but he's at least honest in his dishonesty. Thinking on though, it probably backfires if people immediately think it must all be a stooge-job!

Tomo wrote:[ Over the summer, some of us were lucky enough to hear his creative partner Andy Nyman talk about how much work Brown puts into developing what might sometimes be a very simple trick into something that looks completely without cause

This is a big part of his secret and he reveals as much in Tricks of the Mind where he takes a very basic coin vanish and dresses it up so much that it is hard for the spectator to deconstruct what went on through the trick. Thus effectively hiding where and when the magic was done and the coin vanished.

I have used his routine for this simple trick in pubs and with friends and they are all astonished when I open an empty hand to show the coin has gone and a most of them are totally convinced that they saw something which wasn't there.

I think that dismantling one of Derrens effects would take many, many views of the performance and a sound technical knowledge of magic practices. As a relatively inexperienced magician I can sometimes say, yes, I know how he did that, but the "that" is only a small part of the overall effect and is probably only put in there to put off the experienced magician from spotting something else.

A very clever man with tremendous presentation skills is how I would sum up Mr Brown

Seek and you shall find. Derren uses a lot of old effects and "dresses" them up. I am not saying none of it is original but a lot of his stuff can be found in books and Dvds. Even in dare I say it 13 steps.

Performing mentalism my self (no where as good as Brown dose it) Some times the methood is not always the big secret.

To quote Osterlind "A lot of mentalism isnt that sophisticated."

Basicaly one can take an effect build showmanship in to and have a wonder.

Believe me I'm gonna seek

The trick is almost undoubtedly in convincing the audience and volunteer that the force at play is that of suggestion.
I seriously doubt that Derran employed editing to enhance (let alone achieve) this particular trick, however do not be fooled into thinking he is beyond that. Was it not in one of his very own TV series that in the opening voice over, he comments that no camera trickery will be used and then promptly does so? O how Mr. Brown adores the double bluff on many levels.
Note that in his earlier TV work (I haven't seen his recent stuff), David Blaine, at times, also used careful editing to his advantage.

Derren Brown is just awesome! He's as near to perfection as it gets. And he's got a brilliant sense of humour too! He makes me sick. Totally sick. I hate him.. no I love him.. is he single? ha ha ha

hes mine lmao

Derren Brown's greatest gift is that he performs so very, very well. The trick isn't in the cards or whatever else he's using, the trick is him. His presentation is just exquisite with every trick he does, it's inspirational to watch.

Serendipity wrote:The trick isn't in the cards or whatever else he's using, the trick is him.

That's a really good way of putting it, and its a challenge for a lot of us to see our magic in that way.. it's not in the latest trick we've bought due to CUPS, it's due to us! It can be quite hard to believe in oneself!

QUite impressed by this one. Strangly, just before Lucas named the last card, i said out loud "jack of diamonds". I was almost 100% sure on it aswell. Yer, there was a chance i just guessed it correctly, but knowing who this guy is, and what he is capable of makes me think he forced that on to me. Maybe the pattern of the words or the way he read off the previous two cards.

However he does it, he is absolutly brilliant at it and is certainly one of the few i look up to.

Blapsing_Beard wrote:can you imagine how much someone such as he, who claims to use no stooges, would have to pay to shut them up?

There are some very creative ways to use a 'stooge' and they don't really know they're being used. One example that comes to mind is the 'Lift' trick. You have a spectator raise their hand. This causes another spectator with their eyes closed to raise their hand. The 'patter' at the end of the trick subliminally tells the spectator that had their eyes closed to not reveal what has happened.

yeah I understand that. I have used instant stooges a fair bit. I'm more thinking a stooge, along the lines of "I'll pretend to read your mind, you just agree", e.t.c

If anyone's seriously into the direction this thread seems to be taking, check out "The Gift" by Paul Brook. It's not cheap, but it's a serious work on pre-show by someone who's spent a lot of time doing it for real. Plus he's a psychologist with groovy glasses.

....Maybe the pattern of the words or the way he read off the previous two cards.....

Some "explanations" baffles me. I hope do not reveal to much, but if you listen carefully you can hear that Browns voice has a fractal pattern that plants the desired thought in the subject.

storm01 wrote:I too noticed the cuts in camera, but Derren is far too professional for any "cheating" one would hope. At first I thought the stealth was at work but then watching it again I became more confused, so decided to stick with what I know I can win at and played snap with my 6yr old daughter !!!!!!

the reason for the camera cuts is most likely to hide some sort of visual suggestion or more likely, misdirection. Whilst DB is a master of misdirection of a spectator, the cuts serve to prevent is from replaying his every move a 100 times. live specs dont have the benefit of video rewind.