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Ah! Thank You Sir Darrel!

Yes, there is a difference between Mental Magic & Mentalism and yes, one can toss bits and pieces of Mental Magic into a sidewalk gathering with little issue being heard from we in the Peanut Gallery. HOWEVER, that is not saying someone should be doing MoAB or some other more "exclusive" bit of material in such a setting. For that matter, my stomach heaves when I see spoon bending, watch stopping and all the other rhetoric that IS NOT of the magician's domain... at least if we were to be proper and respectful and not cross or blur the lines of demarcation between each facet of the craft.

(and please don't come back with the "ok, if you don't use coin and card moves in your mentalism we'll stop doing this or that... etc.")

The Center Tear is a bloody Magic Trick exposed all to hell and back; so please go for it and use it on your street corners, that's where it belongs. I can't think of many self-respecting mentalist that would incorporate that p.o.s. method in today's world unless it fit the routine in a logical manner. Magician's see the CT as being a wonderful effect... Mentalists on the other hand, see it as a technique... a foundation to build upon IF the logic can be sewn.

Mental Magic is far more entertaining that Mentalism and I have no problem at all with folks using touches of this stuff as part of their shtick on the streets as well as their club acts, etc. But doing Mental Magic or 1,001 card forces followed by "mind reading" is not the same as being a MENTALIST or doing MENTALISM... It goes back to what I said elsewhere about putting some blood drops on a playing card and claiming to be a bizarrist... sorry but no!

HOWEVER... for the Street Performer Magic with a Bizzare or Paranormal twist is quite appropriate as well as effective. You can cause pools of salty water to appear from seemingly no where as your patrons squeal and discover they to are covered in such liquids... or, in some instances, smelly solids (but only if you've done the effect right, along with the telling of the tale... and it's so much better than applause, not to mention how it will get the word out on you... in a strange but good way)

Greg Arce, one of the more prolific American contributors to Mentalism, points out that the difference between a magician and a mentalist is that the magician will watch the mentalist work and try to figure out how he can put that blindfold routine into his act whereas you won't find many mentalists trying to plan how to throw Assembling Aces or Coins Across into their acts.

My defensive nature around it comes from having stood on the other side of the fence knowing that there exist an infinite sense of resource out there that most magic enthusiasts have never even heard about let alone played with or applied to their education... and that's just from what you'll find in Tarbell let alone all the other sources out there. That being understood, why do you need to steal from a field that is exceptionally limited when it comes to variety and resource? Why, other than ego and current vogue, do you feel you need to step into this particular arena when you've barely scratched the surface of things within the legerdemain?

In my younger days the idea that Mentalism was for the older, more matured man or woman was just being challenged by people such as Banachek, Maven and to a very limited degree, yours truly (I was experimenting with my first pure mentalism shows in the early 80s). We each learned different lessons, each had to make adjustments as to how we approached Mentalism or, in my case, the concept of things paranormal, so it "fit" who we were and more important, our maturation; As the masters of our day pointed out, folks don't like being told about themselves from pimple-faced punks but readily accept such insights from those with some crows feet and a touch of grey in the temples... hell, in those days I couldn't even grow a beard

The field has been opened up but that does not mean we need to toss aside those once golden rules of the craft or the intrigues it held through association when such things are part of what makes it work... part of the secret, the psychology and the romance that the public wants when they encounter a "Mind Reader".

MagicMatt777 wrote:I want to do some street mentalism, would a PSIdeck be good for that? Could someone name a few tricks I could do with a normal deck of cards or some that dont use gimmicks? ALL help appreciated, Matt

By the way, Matt, for clarity I didn't ask this in my other post: were you thinking of the Vernet Psimbol Deck? I'm not familiar with a product called the PSIdeck (but then there are lots of products I don't know about).

thank you guys for all the positive and constructive critisism, its all very appreciated, Matt

I agree that the genre is not particularly suitable for 'street' magic, but there are a number of impromptu settings in which mentalism can be performed, which can have a great impact. For example, Josh Zandman's Impromptu Book Test can be performed with any two books,some paper, and a pencil...so cafes with books, bookshops with cafes, libraries, university settings, on the bus, the train, or the tube....

In his promo videos, Doug Segal uses similar settings for his book test demonstration to show that he can do stuff in the round and off the cuff.

There are countless ways to do peeks, tears, and glimpses, as well as pendulum work and other staples of mentalism in a variety of settings, but I cannot imagine someone standing on a street corner doing these things.

To part-timer,

I think its called the PSI mind deck, they choose a card with a symbol and I already have a matching card in a prediction envolope.

DrTodd wrote:I agree that the genre is not particularly suitable for 'street' magic, but there are a number of impromptu settings in which mentalism can be performed, which can have a great impact. For example, Josh Zandman's Impromptu Book Test can be performed with any two books,some paper, and a pencil...so cafes with books, bookshops with cafes, libraries, university settings, on the bus, the train, or the tube....

In his promo videos, Doug Segal uses similar settings for his book test demonstration to show that he can do stuff in the round and off the cuff.

There are countless ways to do peeks, tears, and glimpses, as well as pendulum work and other staples of mentalism in a variety of settings, but I cannot imagine someone standing on a street corner doing these things.

And in that I was doing such things 20 years ago before it was part of the commercial craze and before we had dozens of variations on Hoy's famed book test in distribution, each claiming to be more different or "original" than the other... please

Yes, there are situations in which one can spring into a improvisational bit of demonstration. The Psychic Entertainer offering one, maybe two very simple manifestations associated with a particular theme... the Magician that has the word Mentalist inscribed on his business card on the other hand, will bore you to tears torturing the flatware and destroying one business card after another or all sorts of sundries, at the expense of the shop owner (we tend to use the books, magazines, flatware, business cards, etc. that are available within the environment)

It goes back to the old story Vernon used to tell... forget who it was that originally challenged him on it but essentially, one can produce a sandwich from out of thin air and people will applaud the trick. However, when you meet someone down on their luck who hadn't eaten in days, then you produce the sandwich... then you are a miracle worker... which do you want to be seen as?

So long as folks aren't creating temples or shrines around me, I'll stick with being a miracle worker.

MagicMatt777 wrote:To part-timer,

I think its called the PSI mind deck, they choose a card with a symbol and I already have a matching card in a prediction envolope.

That would have been my second guess (it's the companion to the Psimbol Deck).

It's a nice effect, perfectly usable in a street situation, but I think it's better used as part of a routine rather than a standalone trick.

I agree with Craig and Dr Todd; there really isn't much scope for a street mentalist (apart from readings, but that's not what you're after). They've posted some good advice, as usual.

Thanks PT...the IBT was just an example of the many things that could be done....