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Hello, my name is Tom a.k.a Eshly here on the boards.


I seem to have upset a few people -perhaps irrevocably- but I always at least TRY to be the bigger man if I can bring myself to be; so I'm making this thread to apologize to people and also to introduce myself a bit as well.

My name is Tom, I am 17 years old. I have been doing magic for two years, though I've been interested in it since I was four and first saw Copperfield flying. My two favorite "areas" of magic are Mentalism and Flying/Levitation illusions, which is an odd combination which I never really can combine. I fully admit I am new and niaeve in the world of magic; for which I am sorry.

I also suffer from Aspergers syndrome (a form of autism) and Bipolar Disorder (also known as Manic Depression) as some of you may know. I try and not to let this disadvantage me, but it does cause me to act slightly differently to many other magicians/mentalists: I tend to think about illusions and tricks an aweful lot, taking it into a deeper level than necessary; to make the illusion more complex and much harder to reconstruct from the layman point of view. I have a phobia of laymen working out what I am doing.

I understand many people think I am wasting my time with that, and I am over-complicating things; but I think it fits my style, and I do not try and force anyone else to do it. I agree that such things as a plane add-a-number, or a one-a-head routine can be perfectly useable, but I like thinks to be very hard to figure out.



Another problem I have been having on the boards, is that every time I ask a question, there always seems to be someone (usually with a very high number of posts) who says "You should know this; go read 13 Steps", and when I am unable to find such information in 13 Steps and ask for the page number, they won't tell me.

I wish I could apologize for this, but I cannot in all honesty say that I think it is entierly my fault. I have read 13 Steps a lot, and I admit I forget a lot of it (I have "blank" spots in my memory for days, and cannot remember anything before the age of 10), but I also feel like some people are deliberately being unhelpful.

So to anyone who thinks I did trolling or something to annoy them, I'm sorry; I have and had no intention of upsetting anyone.




If theres anything I missed, I'll try and come back and address it.


Yours,

Tom
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edit: I think this might be in the wrong forum. Please don't delete it Mandrake, but move it if needed

I'm not being deliberately unhelpful - I'm trying to get you to re-read and study properly the classics, so you can learn how to achieve what you keep asking about...

its not going to be one effect in 13 steps that will answer all your prayers - but its the studying of those effects and techniques that will genuinely help you in mentalism...

if you have memory problems, try going through each effect and boiling them down to their root, and keep a notepad of each effect (with page number) - and convert each effect into bullet notes...that way you have your own reference point for the book itself...

i have one question for you - why do you think the majority of people keep refering you back to PME and 13 steps? here's a clue - its not to annoy you...

I must applaud you for trying to set a few things straight Eshly.

I must also say that you are not the only poster on the Forum that has Asperger's Syndrome. Can't recall the name of the other chap, but i do know he seems to say it in every post as if it's some kind of excuse or license to behave however he pleases. It isn't.

There i said it.

Thankfully i haven't seen this from you too much, though it is clear that some people are getting riled with you.

I appreciate that you're here in the spirit of learning, and respectfully ask for help in certain areas.

You must understand that when the people who are directing you to books such as 13 Steps again and again were learning, they didn't have anyone to ask for page numbers of this and that.

The reason they won't reveal exact things to you like page numbers is not to be awkward, and not out of sour grapes either -"I had to find it, so can you" type thing - it's more lkely to be because in finding it, in reading through and taking in things you weren't originally looking for, you'll end up with a wider and deeper range of knowledge. In the future, you won't have to ask for things, because you'll know where they are.

As for the forgetting thing, a simple post it note system in the pages or jotting down interesting and relevant page numbers in a jotter might suffice.
My book shelves have plenty of magic books on them, but i have a master book with all the page numbers of my favourite parts or effects I'm currently using are written down.
I'm not going to ignore the other parts, but when i know I'm after something to refresh my head, i also know where to look.

As a relative newbie, perhaps your desire to over-complicate comes from feeling guilty that certain things are too damn easy. Some people shy away from self-workers for exactly that reason. Personally i think that's insanity. A good self worker can blow people away, so why not use it?

Im sure it's been said to you before, but it's the effect that matters, not the sleights or techniques you use to get there.

Eshly wrote:when I am unable to find such information in 13 Steps and ask for the page number, they won't tell me.

I told you the chapter to look at, as well as the number of effects that fitted exactly into your specifications. I even mentioned a special one that includes a prediction without a force. There are only a handful listed in that short chapter so your request for exact page numbers (and then claiming that I am "unable" to provide the numbers) indicates to me that you're not willing to put in even the slightest amount of effort in finding the details you need. So why should I bother spending 20 minutes looking through Corinda and typing the exact page numbers in?

Have to say, if your talking about the queery re- writing, the whole of the first step, deals with the various methods.


However, something else occurs to me.

If you have memory issues, i would recomend that you try and concentrate on effects that use forces, and switches, rather than memory work.
At least these can be set up well in advance, so you can double check things before you start.

I have a phobia of laymen working out what I am doing.

We all do Tom.. we all do.

daleshrimpton wrote:If you have memory issues, i would recomend that you try and concentrate on effects that use forces, and switches, rather than memory work.
At least these can be set up well in advance, so you can double check things before you start.

There are different kinds of memory, and so different kinds of memory problems. Eshly seems to have something similar to mine -- a problem with episodic memory (things that have happened to you in your own life). There seems to be a link between Asperger's/autism and specific defects of episodic memory.

Actually, I thought my own memory system was perfectly normal until I watched a documentary about people with severe memory problems. One fellow started describing his episodic memory, and I said, "Well, nothing wrong there. It's just like mine... oh."

You can have little or no episodic memory and still have perfectly good semantic memory (factual knowledge) and procedural memory (how to do things).

Robbie wrote:

daleshrimpton wrote:If you have memory issues, i would recomend that you try and concentrate on effects that use forces, and switches, rather than memory work.
At least these can be set up well in advance, so you can double check things before you start.

There are different kinds of memory, and so different kinds of memory problems. Eshly seems to have something similar to mine -- a problem with episodic memory (things that have happened to you in your own life). There seems to be a link between Asperger's/autism and specific defects of episodic memory.

Actually, I thought my own memory system was perfectly normal until I watched a documentary about people with severe memory problems. One fellow started describing his episodic memory, and I said, "Well, nothing wrong there. It's just like mine... oh."

You can have little or no episodic memory and still have perfectly good semantic memory (factual knowledge) and procedural memory (how to do things).

The same thing happened to me actually; I watched a documentary.

I just have "blank" spaces in my memory, sometimes a few hours, sometimes a few days or weeks in length. They usually happen when I'm very happy, which means I don't remember much good stuff :p

Heh.

Tom
xx

daleshrimpton wrote:

I have a phobia of laymen working out what I am doing.

:

I have a phobia, of Dale working out what i am doing

Well Done - It does take a big man to apologise.

When someone for instance Iain (hope you dont mind being the example) tells you to read 13 steps, they are saying it for a genuine reason, most of the questions you have posed can be answered in the book. The answers wont be that easy to find cos' you always have to put your own slant on to effects (Does that make sense)

If someone tells me that a certain thingy' i am looking for is in a book, i dont even bother to ask where, i just grab the book and start reading. It doesnt bother me who tells me, i am just glad that someone tried to help.

A question (and a rather serious one) Aspergers affects Communication skills and social Interaction? A Mentalist relies heavily on on both, would it not be an idea to look into stage illusions as i know thats where your passion really lies??

L

I am an excellent stage illusion designer, even if I do say so myself; but I have no idea where I'd get the money for it to go professional.

But yes it does affect my communication skills and emotional intelligence alot. Thankfully I am a very good actor.


Tom
xx

Eshly wrote:I just have "blank" spaces in my memory, sometimes a few hours, sometimes a few days or weeks in length. They usually happen when I'm very happy, which means I don't remember much good stuff :p

Oh, well, that's a lot better than mine. I tend not to have any personal memories at all. Or rather, I have some, but they're not in any particular order or level of importance.

If you imagine a shoebox with random photos tossed into it, but no notes on any of the photos, that's pretty much what my episodic memory is like. I can dig up a random "snapshot", but if you ask when the event occurred, for instance, I would have to take a guess based on how old I look in the picture, where it seems to be, etc. There's no guarantee I can recall anything on demand, even if there happens to be a snapshot of it in the box.

I have more snapshots than I need of useless moments like walking into the kitchen or looking at the living room clock. For most important events, there are few or no memories at all, only the intellectual knowledge that they happened.

Robbie wrote:

Eshly wrote:I just have "blank" spaces in my memory, sometimes a few hours, sometimes a few days or weeks in length. They usually happen when I'm very happy, which means I don't remember much good stuff :p

Oh, well, that's a lot better than mine. I tend not to have any personal memories at all. Or rather, I have some, but they're not in any particular order or level of importance.

If you imagine a shoebox with random photos tossed into it, but no notes on any of the photos, that's pretty much what my episodic memory is like. I can dig up a random "snapshot", but if you ask when the event occurred, for instance, I would have to take a guess based on how old I look in the picture, where it seems to be, etc. There's no guarantee I can recall anything on demand, even if there happens to be a snapshot in the box.

I have more snapshots than I need of useless moments like walking into the kitchen or looking at the living room clock. For most important events, there are few or no memories at all, only the intellectual knowledge that they happened.

Do you remember our date at McDonalds?

Beardy wrote:Do you remember our date at McDonalds?

Yes, I do! (Awww.) I have one or two pictorial snapshots set in McDonald's, backed up by declarative knowledge (the "story" of the event).

...Make that three snapshots. I just found another, I think.

Is it weird that I find the above post very cute? xD

Eshly wrote:Is it weird that I find the above post very cute? xD

Me and Robbie have been an item for 30 years