talkmagic.co.uk

Well said Tomo

AJ82 wrote:Wukfit,

I can see how quite easily... Some religions do not like certain aspects of magic... (some don't like magic at all) probably poor example but needle through arm could be one as it could be seen as self harm and that is a sin in some religions so a magician of that religion would not perform this trick therefore changing their performance.

I notice Jesus apperently did "nail through hand and foot" as his second to last show....and of course the well documented "resurection" as his finale...
and would you believe it he's probably the most well known magician in the world!..

No it wasn't a very good example was it?

Humour... this is humour.. please don't take offense as it is not intended... if it does get life

But seriously how would being a Christian effect a performer, what would make it any different? Unless you mean including bible babble in the patter, which is the same as doing a corpartate show and including a sales pitch for the product.

Or is there something else?

Fine. Sorry but I think you will find jesus did not put the nails through his own hands and feet!

Before this turns in to an argument I will not add any more to this topic. My views are just that, my views and I may see it easily when others do not. This is just a personal view.

As for humor, you may intend it this way but people with a deep religious view may see you calling jusus's resurection a show very hurtful. As I said earlier religion can be personal and should be treated with respect weather you believe it or not

(Edit) I see you have removed the part calling the resurection a show and humor. Good thinking!

It may be misinterpretation but I would say that:

wukfit wrote:Just like you are doing now... you are trying to defend your faith by trying to twist the words of someone else to make it fit... therefore causing tension.. therefore leading to what always happens with talk like this...
And yet you still believe religion is not the cause of war?

As for worrying about upsetting others by talking about religion, the only people who get upset are those who are so small minded they can't see further than their own beliefs.

and

Wukfit wrote:Well when you have had more experiences you will discover I am correct

Are at the very least impolite and dismissive of other's views. These are both traits which are not held in high regard here. As you have questioned me on it I can only assume that you did not intend them in that manner and so, once again, can I suggest that we all re-read what we have written before we jump in and hit the "Submit" button?

nickj wrote:It may be misinterpretation but I would say that:

wukfit wrote:Just like you are doing now... you are trying to defend your faith by trying to twist the words of someone else to make it fit... therefore causing tension.. therefore leading to what always happens with talk like this...
And yet you still believe religion is not the cause of war?

As for worrying about upsetting others by talking about religion, the only people who get upset are those who are so small minded they can't see further than their own beliefs.

and

Wukfit wrote:Well when you have had more experiences you will discover I am correct

Are at the very least impolite and dismissive of other's views. These are both traits which are not held in high regard here. As you have questioned me on it I can only assume that you did not intend them in that manner and so, once again, can I suggest that we all re-read what we have written before we jump in and hit the "Submit" button?

Well I am a "Wukfit"... sorry for some reason religion gets my back up... delete me at will except the sorry bit.

I just want to clear up one of my comments, so as it does not offend someone in the future. I did not mean for my remark about the Roman Empire to shine a bad light on Paganism, but to establish my thoughts on the fact that atrocities happen regardless of the ideals of a faith. The Roman Empire changed its faith and was still committing atrocities but I do not believe that faith created the Empire but rather that the Empire adapted the faith and incorporated it into it’s own system and needs.

As for your previous comments Wukfit, I believe they have been dealt with appropriately by Pitto, AJ82, Tommo, Nick and your apology.

I must also commend you Nick and further want to apologise for the heavy-handedness of my earlier post. As you’re objectiveness in dealing with this situation has shown me you’re true worth as a levelheaded person and a moderator who is doing a very good job.

Dearie me. Far too much argument here. As a holy reverend man of the cloth myself I must say that religion causes more strife than anything else.

I don't particularly like that God chap. Too much smiting people and turning them into pillars of salt for my liking. Besides he is nearly as boring as Derren Brown. No. I am a follower of Satan and find him much more amusing. As a matter of fact he is a good friend of mine.

To calm you all down I will tell you a story about Danny Korem a magician and Jewish convert to Christianity.

I came across a very odd book by Danny Korem in a Christian bookshop. If you are wondering what I was doing in a Christian bookshop I will tell you. Satan sent me in on a spying mission. You'd think he would do his own spying but he tells me that he was busy at the time. There were a lot of wars he had to start that week.

I purchased this book. It spent 80% of it's space debunking psychics (and one in particular) and then spent the last 20% trying to convince the reader that it was perfectly within the bounds of possibility to rise from the dead.

I showed it to Satan and he had a good laugh.I think he was mentioned in the book and rather liked the publicity.

My two favourite parts of the book were the following. First, where he says he used to be Jewish but isn't any more. I found that highly amusing because once you are Jewish you are stuck with it no matter what religion you join later. I am a psychic reverend and minister of some church or other.I forget the name of it. It cost me $35 to be ordained on the booth of a psychic fair. Yet I am still Jewish.
Danny still thinks he isn't according to the book.

The other part of the book I loved is where he goes backstage to visit Kreskin and threatens to expose him if he does not stop claiming he is psychic. George got a trifle peeved at this impertinence. I just hope that he put it down to youthful stupidity. No wonder Kreskin keeps well away from magicians. They are rather doltish at times.

I don't think many magicians know about this book.
It is called "Powers" subtitle "Testing the Psychic & Supernatural". Published by Varsity Press. No doubt you can get it at your local Christian Bookshop.

On a sidenote I once spoke to a manager of a Catholic bookshop in Dublin. It also sold all sorts of religious artifacts and holy prayerbooks. The shop was busy with nuns, priests and other holy people including myself. The manager amused me greatly by saying that the biggest problem the shop had was shoplifting.

Perhaps nuns should be paid more.

mark lewis wrote:It cost me $35 to be ordained on the booth of a psychic fair. Yet I am still Jewish.

I thought you said you were born in Scotland of British herritage and that you were some kind of Canadian Reverend ! So, are you a Scotish Satantic Jew ?

mark lewis wrote:On a sidenote I once spoke to a manager of a Catholic bookshop in Dublin. It also sold all sorts of religious artifacts and holy prayerbooks. The shop was busy with nuns, priests and other holy people including myself. The manager amused me greatly by saying that the biggest problem the shop had was shoplifting.

Perhaps nuns should be paid more.

Perhaps - OR - Possibly other spies for Lucifer such as yourself were constantly frequenting this Bookstore and turning tricks !

..ultimately, none of us are going to know if there's a God or not until we kick the bucket, then we'll either be

shocked to see its not the God you chose to believe in
smug/content/relieved that it is, or
absolutely bricking it 'cos you might of coveted someone's ass in 1993...

True.

Perhaps it's better to let this thread rest it isn't like a discussion on what brand of playing cards to use no one will change their mind as a result of the thread and it is verging on argument.

Macbeth wrote:Hi, Haven't posted here for a while, but I am a Christian Magician and yes it affects the way I perform.

Hi Steve! Good to see you here.

Wukfit wrote:

Macbeth wrote:Hi, Haven't posted here for a while, but I am a Christian Magician and yes it affects the way I perform.

How?... really, I would love to know how being a Christian (or any other religion) would make any difference to a performance of magic.

I think, the main thing is that most of us make sure that our audience understands that what we are doing are only tricks. Some non-christian magicians may do this too.

Yes, bible patter is often incldued in it when we do gospel magic but alot of us do normal secular tricks too without any message etc

What do you mean by the word 'tricks' ?

AJ82 wrote:Fine. Sorry but I think you will find jesus did not put the nails through his own hands and feet!

As Neil said in the first episode of The Young Ones, crucifixion is "a really negative way to kill yourself, man. I've tried hundreds of times, but there's like just no way of hammering the last nail in."

taneous wrote:What do you mean by the word 'tricks' ?

A trick - A seeminly impossible effect created by using a "hidden" method thats only known to magicians.