talkmagic.co.uk

ok, ive had a quick scan through the topics and, unless I missed it, i dont think this has been covered.
as ive stated before im looking at doing some light street/table hopping work. but this counts as being self emplyed right? which brings up the whole issue of working out tax and letting organisations know etc.
Its all confusing, business advisors are expensive, anyone who do this give any tips or advice? ( dont say see a business advisor lol )

The best ting to do is to ask your local tax office. They're really not the Gestapo. In fact, they tend to tell you how to keep more of your cash. Basically, if you earn outside of PAYE then they will send you a dead easy form at the start of each April. You fill it in by the end of September and they tell you how much tax you have to pay to keep good old Blighty in nuclear weapons, nurses and roads by about Christmas.

Just don't go out and spend every penny as you make it and society will continue to function as it should, the tories will remain in the wilderness and the tax man shalt smile upon thee mightily, which is nice.

ok *makes note:- dont spend every penny* well, thats probably the hardest part lol. thanks ill shoot round and see them soon.

As a rule, take 35% of what you bring in and set it to the side, this will generally cover all the Tax, Withholdings, etc.

PLEASE PAY CLOSE ATTENTION TO THE FOLLOWING... If you are in the U.S. (and I'm certain other countries have something similar) you must pay into SSI in order to gain compensation should you have health issues, etc. down the road. This is a mistake many make (myself included) and thus, when things hit the fan, you're pretty much left high and dry.

Sit down with a Tax Accountant or CPA and get everything set up. You may also find that in creating a "Company" or "Corporate Entity" around yourself, that you will gain more advantages as well as added responsibilities but the benefits out weigh the disadvantages IF you are seriously looking at move more into the professional realm of things.

Take some classes in business, marketing and bookkeeping! Even if you are going to have other "more qualified" people take care of such things for you.

There are many other "tricks" to all the financial side of the game but you will learn those as time moves on... silly things like how to get major stage illusions for free, etc.

Bimey Craig, is this really what you have to do in the US if you're looking to do the right thing over a bit of table hopping!?

Seriously, all he has to do is just ask at the tax office. They'll give him the big pack of information on being self employed. It's the best part of an inch thick and contains all the tricks and pointers. Free! Our economy is based on the idea of small businesses and sole trading. It's in all our interest to keep as many afloat for as long as possible.

In the UK, you don't have to worry directly about health insurance, due to the NHS, however when you're self employed, you do have to pay Class 2 National Insurance contributions (instead of the normal class 1 you see deducted from your pay slip). I'm not sure of the details regarding any ability to claim statutory sick pay or anything similar.

They will send you a form for Class 2 NI this when you register as self employed IIRC, and it works out as £2.10 per week, usually taken by direct debit.

If you earn more than a certain amount as self employed (can't remember the amount, but it's a fair bit), you need to pay another type of NI contribution in addition, which is more costly.

As mentioned, you also need to allow to pay tax at the end of every tax year. The form you have to fill in looks terrifying, but only takes a couple of hours if you have all your details, and can be done online if you register.

Make sure you keep a good record of all your earnings and dates. You should also keep track of your expenses in terms of working tools (props etc), as these can usually be deducted from your earnings for tax purposes. You will need to be able to provide receipts, although they probably won't ask for small amounts.

All of this is explained in the forms and explanatory notes you can get from the Post Office, but it's probably worth checking the details with the Citizen's Advice Bureau - They are generally quite good at providing advice like this, and they don't charge any fees.

I had to do all this malarky last financial year, so I think the details are correct, but do check them for yourself.

down2infinity wrote:ok, ive had a quick scan through the topics and, unless I missed it, i dont think this has been covered.
as ive stated before im looking at doing some light street/table hopping work. but this counts as being self emplyed right? which brings up the whole issue of working out tax and letting organisations know etc.
Its all confusing, business advisors are expensive, anyone who do this give any tips or advice? ( dont say see a business advisor lol )

Hidown2infinity,
If you start in business as a magician then you are taxed on your profit. You will need to pay the NI contributuions on the profit you earn.
Profit is the amount you are left with after deducting your expenses. In the Uk if you purchase a computer to help you run your business I think it depreciates 100% and is allowed against tax in your first year of trading. You will probably need to set up some office equipment. Some of this will be considered as an asset and be allowed against tax. Probably so much a year. You should also be able to claim part of your telephone bill and internet access etc. Watch out that you don't claim for a room in your house as an office because it could have other implications when the house is sold. There is also the cost of getting to each individual job ie fuel or taxi etc. I think you can claim for replacement tricks (ie ones that have worn out) but not new one. There is a difference. You can claim for some costume but not if it in ordinary use I think. Equity have agreed with the tax man that you can claim for make up!
Please don't take this advice for gospel currently but it is given sincerely. Check it out with an accountant. If you intend to earn serious money then an accountant is a necessity but you still have to provide the accountant with receipts.
After re reading this it seems that you may even make a loss in your first year.
Best of luck with your venture

well most busineses regardless of type make a loss to start with, thats to be expected I guess, Im going to look into it a bit more anyway, and do some more free/volunteer bits n pieces to get a better grasp on the market round here - I think thats the way to go for now, then when and if i start charging ill have a nice lil reputation to get things moving lol. so this gonna be a few month of yet probably.
Thanks for all your help guys you make it sound... well... not simple but simpler lol
cheers

Best of luck to you man... trythe local hospital... they might want a volunteer magician on the kids ward.
If I had transport/money I'd do that...

down2infinity wrote:Thanks for all your help guys you make it sound... well... not simple but simpler lol
cheers

Hehe... that reminds me of a quote (that I can't quite remember who actually said it...)

"Thanks man! You make it sound so... much... bit... less impossible than I thought!"

down2infinity wrote:Im going to look into it a bit more anyway, and do some more free/volunteer bits n pieces to get a better grasp on the market round here - I think thats the way to go for now, then when and if i start charging ill have a nice lil reputation to get things moving

Probably a good idea, in order to get more experience, but someone gave me some advice once which is worth thinking about. They said that people don't tend to value your work so highly when you give it away for free.

It's not always true, but it's worth considering. I have had experience (in other fields) of doing free work for people, then finding it very difficult to start charging. People often won't want to start paying for something that they got for free last week. Sometimes they don't understand the value of what it is they are getting.

I'm not saying don't do it, but be careful to manage expectations (both yours and theirs) in order to avoid bad feeling.

Yeah that kinda makes sense, though I could do it in a way ( if im careful ) so that they know its what it is, a temp thing. kinda like doing an audition you do one performance to demonstrate how the customers react to it then emphasize that to the manager ( some one said on another topic to encourage customers to let the manager know what they thought ) all this increasing your worth of course. if you get what i mean.

Hi down2infinity,
Don't do free work where they normally pay. If you are doing free work then somewhere like a hospital ward is great but you would have to liaise with the medical staff.
Only do enough to get the experience. When you start working as a pro you have to entertain all sorts not just people such as your own peers so the experience is not just in the actual performance but also in handling people of all types.
If you start working in retaraunts you must charge!

Just adding another complicating factor, if your work brings you into contact with children or vulnerable adults (ie. some hospitals), you will have to be careful to make sure there's always another responsible adult present. A simple misunderstanding could cause a lot of problems for all concerned.

Some organisations require special vetting before people can work with vulnerable groups. Just something else to bear in mind.

The special vetting system is a Criminal Records Bureau check. I have had this done under voluntary work that I do, but I am not sure if this allows me to work with children or venerable adults when I’m not working as part of that particular charity.

Current legislation does not allow individuals to have these CRB checks done. Surely it would be a good idea to set up a system that allows self employed entertainers to have CRB disclosure. If there is anyone who has any information on this front, I would be grateful if they could share it. It seems that the self employed entertainers amoung us have nothing to fall back on if there are 'simple misunderstandings'.

im not sure if this is what you mean but isnt there a way you can obtain a copy of your criminal record at a fee? I remember a few years ago one of my mates had to do just that while applying for a job.