talkmagic.co.uk

Where can i find out more about large stage magic, like car vanishes, sawing people in half etc.

i have looked around for books and dvd's but all i can find is table/close up magic.

Any suggestion will be greatfully recieved.

‘Magic stage illusions, special effects & trick photography. This is one of the great magic classics. Explanations of classic stage illusions, conjurers tricks, ancient magic stage scenery effects, automata & curious toys & photographic diversions. Many can be recreated by the reader; the more elaborate information on illusions performed by such great magicians as Robert Houdini, Brautler de Kolta, Heller, Herrmann, Maskelyne & Keller; how jugglers, acrobats, fire eaters, sword swallowers, ventriloquists & mentalists achive their effects such as sunrise, stars, wind, thunder, lightning snow & more; principles behind trick photo-graphic effects, illustrations, a huge 556 pages’
£22.00. Don't know if it's any good though.
I found this in magic by posts catalogue but it's not on the website though.
If you want, send a piece of paper with the book title and price and code-mb26 and a cheque to 167 Winchester Road, Bristol , BS4 3NJ
I had a look on amazon and there was one called Magic Stage Illusions and Scientific Diversions
Albert A. Hopkins
It’s out of stock at the moment but keep checking.
Hope this helps.

anything in particular your interested in??

there are a few very competent magicians on this site that canbe pmed.

i will be happt to help you if i can.

I'm interested in any stage magic really, but large illusions i.e car vanishes etc.

i would love to progress from close up magic and childrens parties to stage magic and need some info before i go any further. any help would be greatfully recieved.....

ok i presume then your already a member of equity and have done some close up shows in front of audiences then??

if not then you have missed a couple of steps.

firstlt lets clarify, a stage magician is realy more of an actor, most go of the route of auditioning as guest spots on other shows just like any other actor you have to present your portfolio, atend interviews etc.

option two you become another stage magicians lakey for six years and learn the trade from the inside.

option three be recomended by the magic circle and equity.

option four do your own shows like me and hope someone spots your talent.

next when your in the circuit is to make lots of friends as you will need a crew.

wile your doing that you will need to squirel away a lot of money, stage props are expensive bulky and have to be specialy built.

most stage props use basic well knowen priciples, the masked magician showed several on his shows.

a stage magician rarely gets thier on his talent alone, its not what you know its who you know.

I can vanish a jumbo jet, eiffel tower, saw myself, elephant, jumbo jet in half.
vanish 30ft in the air then appear in a previousely empty box surrounded by the daganum girl quior, i just cant afford ti right now.

what i can afford just is to vanish and produce items from my tip trink, put swords through the head of a spec, levitate a spec on a chair, escape from shakles and chain's and make full size walking sticks appear from tiny lit torches.

if i could afford thr transport for an elephant i could produce that to, all i would need is a tent.

if you are a professional magician then i appologise if not then i hope this advice has opened your eyes a bit you cant just get this job at the job center it takes a lot of hard graft or family in the magic bussiness.

oh and by the way you'll need to be a cut throat bussines person too, nice guys need not apply, two of my uncles are in the trade and working thier way up so I'm not just waffaling on well maybe a bit....

i fully understand that many years of hard graft will/may be needed, but i want a push in the right direction and am willing to go to what ever lengths it takes.

if the only way i am going to get any further in that direction is to know a already accomplished magician i may be alittle stuck as this has been my passion alone until i came on this forum, i don't currently know any other local magicians.

so the push in the right direction will be great thanks.

unless ofcause you are offering...

okey dokey first off please add a general location to your profile so we know what portion of the planet your on thnxs.

second it looks like your in the same boat as me then, i started doing shows for relo's, then gave out bussines cards, onto shows and am now at the stage where people know me a a magician first and a human being second.

looks like your at the stage to make aquire / purchase some stage props, you might consider:-
change bags.
sliding die boxes.
square circle.
production / change boxes.
appearing canes, candles etc.

lawrence at e-magictricks can supply most of what you need and an e-mail to him detailing your requirements will help him pick items to suit, he is very experienced.

next decide your target audience, kids, adults, table hopping, corperate does.

when we know where you are I'm sure mog and siege will chip in with guidence, i sugest you start a new topic with the subject
fellow magician's please help me.

we will be only to glad to offer any assistance we can.
your post should include any relevant experience you have did you work with kids, are you great with cards, coins etc.
where you intend to go and what time / buget reastraints you have.
this will help us to taylor our suggestions to your requirements.

i myself have 15 years off and on experience doing kids magic / close up, no card slights at all, five years running my own magic / disco bussiness.
favourate close up trick haughted key (several posts by me).
favourate stage / parlour trick sliding die box.
types of shows / sets done, kids shows stage and hall, table hopping (corporate), boot sales, weddings.

aims to run the bussines at full capacity, do shows 5-6 days a week and eventualy franchise the bussiness and sit back and rake in the money.
50% of all profits are recycled back into the bussiness, the other 50% i exist on.
time spent on bussiness, every wakeing hour / sleeping.

hope this gives you ideas about what to put in your post.

thanks yankeetom thats given a good idea of prices , do all large stage magic of that type require expensive props/equipment.

if so will have to save more pennies, and i can understand why the shows i have seen have been more basic than i had expected.

Silver Shadow:-

It may help us to offer advice if we knew where you are at at the moment. Who do you perform for currently?

I think (and correct me if I am wrong) that what MagicDiscoman was trying to say is that you can't run before you can walk. To do the big cabaret illusions you must have a certain amount of exposure - otherwise who would hire a complete unknown?

This experience could come from many areas, Childrens shows is a good one (although thats not for everyone), or then there is Restaurant Table Hopping. In order to get Business Conference work you probably already need a name for yourself, which is why you have to give out cards everywhere you work.

The other excellent place to start is to put on a free show at old peoples homes. This would give you some proper experience and also be a real boost for the old people, but if you did a few of these and got the local paper involved to do an article on you then you are also getting good publicity.

The other thing I will add, is that if you are seriously looking for work then join your local magical society. There you will meet many prffessional and amateur magicians - some of which will most likely have real life experience with big illusions.

Possibly you are already doing many of these things - in which case I apologise - please let us know where you are at.

absolutely thanks banaafish for translateing for me, my posts are similar to the character mankind (wwf / wwe).

I wanted you to make us a profile so that we know what advice to give, i gave you mine as a exsample.

and a title for the post that will get you noticed.

i have let the lounge members know mog, seige etc to expect a post, then you have the knowledge of the entire board at your desposal, your local libary should have some reverence books on magic that will include stage effects.

Some sound advice here, but there's a question of MOTIVE involved...

Firstly (and formally) welcome to the board. It's nice to see enthusiasm.

Secondly, thanks for posing such a perplexing question... i.e. how does one progress from closeup/children's magic to big stage illusion...

I would imagine that the answer here lies in your motive for doing the larger magic. If you're an accomplished closeup magician, usually I would say that your skills are in one-on-one situations - and you're comfortable performing proximity effects and direct spectator involvement effects. Add to this the 'any time, any where' performance - and the 'pack small, play big' logistics and you can basically carry an entire 1-week show around in a briefcase.

Kids magic is more akin to 'grand illusion' stage magic, although generally I would imagine that the children's stage effects which we know and love are sufficiently small-scale enough to pack in a suitcase...

Which brings me on to my next point... with large-scale illusion, such as vanishing a car, sawing people in half, pro-levitation effects and the like - it's not only a case of purchasing the illusion... you need to also pay big bucks for venues, and almost certainly employ assistants, riggers, lighting engineers, special effects crews, sound engineers, costume artists... the list could be huge.

The previous advice about getting a name and reputation in this instance would be the key... if you were a reasonably renowned close-up artist with either sponsored backing or a pot of gold in the back garden (I wish!) then doing the big stage illusions would be a natural progression.

If, however, you're simply thinking ahead as to where you want to be in 5 years time - you may just want to consider if it's what you really want.

Or, my other rather sad suspicion may be that you're just looking for a source of knowledge into HOW the illusions are done to satisfy your curiosity. I hope I'm wrong about this.

In either case, the advice 'don't run 'till you can walk' is very true - and if you're serious about the BIG illusions - you really do need to have a reputation AND financial backing before you get anything off the ground... here's a quick reckoning of a one-night performance:

Example
At least 4 major illusions - interjected with lesser closeup/stage magic could cost in the region of £10,000 just for the equipment.
Hire of venue - including lighting, access all areas, soundstage, insurance - probably in the region of £1000 if done properly.
Hire of special effects - smoke, lights, music - all done for the atmosphere (call it smoke and mirrors, if you like!!!) - £1500
Hire of assistants, riggers, carriers, runners etc. probably at least 5 people at £100 per-night = £500
Publicity - posters, fliers, advertising - reckon at least £1000
Costumes/makeup - £1000

Now, assuming these are GUESSES - your outlay for 1 gig would be £15,000. Therefore, unless you're very established, you're not going to pack out a venue enough times to even cover the wages of the staff you're employing.

Add to this the initial man-hours involved in practicing, plus the cost of hiring in assistants and hiring a location big enough to practice - the cost alone would put most people off straight away.

The time aspect could be many years, and this is why our underlying message is:

Is this something you want to do for a career?

If so, then every penny and hour will be justified. If not, then you probably want to have a re-think.

somone over stepped the mark today.

no i didn't.

yes you did, now get back in your box.

okey dokey.

thanks for all your comments seige , i am very serious about a career in magic, and i am thinking ahead about 5-10 years, this is the time scale i am assuming to get anywhere near the knowlege and practice that i feel i will require, no, need to become that which i desire.

my motive would be that during childrens shows i enjoy the faces of amazement i see, and i feel the best way to achieve this is adults is to go for the big illusions, it's not about the money involved, either pay nore outlay, it's about the reaction for me. The first time i did magic for my little girl her face lit up with bewilderment and i knew right then that i had to find out more, this i did, and now i can't get enough.


i will be putting on a small profile of myself under the heading suggested shortly, so any help that your or any one else can give me will be greatfully recieved.

ooo a folower in my footsteps, well grasshoper i am here if you need me all you need to do is click you heals three times and say....

as i have done both childrens an adult shows i can recomend that one of your first illusions should be the slideing die box or run rabbit run, same priciple.

both kids and adults love the chance to shout out, look at the popualrity of pantamime.

i have a hand sized version at present, haveing come down from a 3ft version of my own design, you need to ballance size over space in your viehicle, my hand sized version still gets the same reaction as my large one used to (sadly gone to the woodworm graveyard).

a metal version of the appearing cane is a good investment especialy if you can get the fire attachment or can make your own, i had to get mine from america.

jumbo card packet tricks should be next on your wish list, colour changeing kings to aces is good.

with midsized illusions which i like to call parlour magic you need to figure out what packs small but plays big.

5- 10 years is a sensible goal, though with our help you may make it in three, i can steer you clear of some of the pitfalls that i well and truly fell in.

just ask and i will endever to help.