talkmagic.co.uk

One of my gripes in magic concerns the awful webcam videos again but they also ask a rather perplexing question and opens up a psychology debate.

Now, I believe that magic is a 'spectator sport', in that we learn these wonderful things to impress and entertain the layman so therefore we pick something that is enjoyable.
If I film something, it's always with a spec as you get the reaction to the effect as well and as I believe close-up should be a personal experience, you can create rapport with the spec.

What I find bizarre is the amount of videos that are performed to a camera. Not even a decent one. Often a cheap (Tesco buy one get one free) webcam and I can't really see the point of it. Surely these people could at least find a friend who enjoys their magic to partcipate.

Which leads me to another point. Are these videos filmed to impress the layman or are they there to show off to other magicians? The reason why I ask this is because I always believed that effects, tricks, whatever you want to call them, were named for the magicians benefit and the layman were not meant to know they had a name at all. But every youtube goon says things such as "I'm now going to perform Daniel Garcia's Greed" which says to me: THIS IS NOT MAGIC. To a layperson, this says "I bought a DVD - and here's what it's called if you want to find out how to do this. I am not magic, I just bought, or rather asked my parents to buy for me, this DVD and I've learnt it off pat including all the patter. Nothing original. I have not talent. And for twenty quid you could do the same."

To me these come across as rather bad adverts for things you can buy rather than someone who is magical.

Am I alone in thinking this????????????

There are Magicians and people who call them selves magicians. Aprantley I do “weird” stuff and I am happy with that.

It’s the age old argument on one had isn’t it? Is magic to accssable to kids? And yes it is. Ok I don’t think it should be wrapped in secret and you would have to know some one who knows someone before you can learn a trick about 3 burglars.

I actually like watching the bad you tubers though when I am having a crisis of confidence. Makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

I have seen Freddie’s vids and that poor cat. Anyway one person or one hundred people on a video performance adds so much to it. a lot of vids I have seen on tube and I think is that the worse trick in the world., is it just poor presentation?

Take this for an example. On the rather fine things of rare beauty that is Easy to master mental miiricals.. There is a really nice billet effect. When you watch it in the context of a L&L tape it looks good (like its ment to) but they are a strange audience. You go out perform it for real people and you can see how much of great routine this. It is a great peace of mentalism.

A “Magician” will get no where performing for his mum and dad and a cheap old web cam. Misdirection, Scripting, etc cant be learnt like that or on a dvd you got to go out and do it. Also you get to touch a lot of hot women. Men in beards case.

The audience comes first, learn to talk the talk before you can a trick.. Throw the web cam away and bobs your uncle.

Lord Freddie writes: "Surely these people could at least find a friend who enjoys their magic to partcipate."

Have you ever seen some of these bozos?

First of all, most of them don't have any friends and, secondly, if they do, they won't have them for long if they force them to watch their crapola.

I agree with his lordship, the names are there to let us magicians differenciate between similar tricks instead of 'you know the one with the five cards'. I never say the name of the trick, but sometimes I do say the name of the originator, as in 'ladys and gentlemen I now present an amazing peice of magic first discovered by mr saunders, magician extraudinaire'. In my mind said like this it seems more magical, as if there is some high magic that I look up to and am amazed by. Hopefully my enthusiasm and amaizment will rub off on the audience.
But I never just say 'and now a trick by.......'

I'm glad I'm not the only one!
I see all the learning as the hard work and the enjoyment people get from participating in them (whether it be close-up or stage) the reward for the effort put in.
There's nothing as heartwarming as a room of laymen strangers applauding something you have performed. It's confirmation that you are doing something right and people have gained pleasure from it.

I'm always astounded when I see these "to the camera" videos. It's as if the only magic they have seen is Ellusionist instructional videos and they think that's what magic is about. One man (or child) and a camera.

I have done children's shows and although I felt sick at the thought of doing them, the kids actually loved it with a few saying they wanted to be magicians when they grow up. I told them they can't do both. (Boom! Boom!)

My ultimate dream is to perform visual magic for a group of chimpanzees after being inspired by Paul Daniels doing the same as the wonderful Pan-Kun (search on youtube for 'chimp vs magician) doing so.

Interestingly, even when leaving aside points regarding the poor quality of videos/lack of skill/lack of imagination etc, when filming it just makes a huge difference whether there is someone else in the picture or not. I found when watching videos posted here that even if someone performs a feat well with good presentation and so on, but without audience, it isn't half as enjoyable as watching someone perform for real people, even if I personally only get to see it on the screen (with some very rare exceptions).
Without audience, it's like telling a joke to a camera and claiming you're a comedian.

Spot on. Anything kind of performance which relies on a reaction, whether it be applause, laughter or gasps of disbelief, becomes redundant when coldly done in from of a $hitty webcam.
These youtube videos are the magic equivalent of masturbation. A solo activity which only the perpertrator derives any pleasure from.

Lord Freddie writes: "These youtube videos are the magic equivalent of masturbation. A solo activity which only the perpertrator derives any pleasure from."

Couldn't agree more!

I agree with the entire name thing. However I magicians have a share of the burden of blame on this one. Heaven forbid if somebody performs a trick and there is another magician in the room and the performer does not give the creator credit. Heck there is so much flack over this that you almost need written concent from every magician on the planet before you perform an effect. And imagine if you credit the wrong person. You may as well just place you head on the chopping block because you performed an effect but didn't spend 5 years and hundreds of hours in front of a computer or a dusty old magic library to find out who the first who did the first variation of the effect.

Just look at the response on this board when the guy on worlds greatest morons or whatever that was and Chris Angel mentioned it was Banachecks effect. Granted it was the reverse from what I was saying. Everyone got upset because he did mention what the effect was.

My point being that this has become such a touchy issue and its only magicians who really care. And at this point I have no idea what I'm talking about anymore, Heck not even sure what the conversation is about.

Have a Happy holidays.

his lordsip wrote

Spot on. Anything kind of performance which relies on a reaction, whether it be applause, laughter or gasps of disbelief, becomes redundant when coldly done in from of a $hitty webcam.

so true. Have you ever had a routine for a 50 plus show and decided to run the routine passed a small group, say five magicians?
You get hardly any proper feedback. You may get 'do this', 'change that' or 'that was great should be good', but until you put it passed a large group you still have no real idea!!!!!!!!!
It's strange but the same trick for a table can have a completely different dynamic for the stage.
This is the place that the true art of magic lies. Its a shame that the you tubers will never experience this