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I wondered if anybody could recommend a good method to get a multiple selection of face down cards (three or four) to the top of the deck without taking them to the bottom first? With an old, borrowed deck I find that it can be tricky to count off the correct number of cards at the bottom as they can clump together. Could get the break once they are on the bottom by spreading the cards but would like to avoid this if there is a better alternative.

I've tried BS control by Lee Asher but I found this too angle dependent. It may well be down to my bad handling but unless the spec is in the same position as the camera on his demo vid, it can look fairly unconvincing (at least when I do it).

Any advice or ideas would be very much appreciated.

Dovetail shuffle?

(I am very much not a card person, so apologies if I have said something absurd.)

cant you just get all 4 selections together and get them to place them on part of the deck and then pass it, or double undercut to the top?

stick a riffle in afterwards and you'll be looking fairly clean i'd say...

How about a multiple shift? There are two main ones I can think of: Dai Vernon's and Arthur Buckley's. Or perhaps a classic pass, or double undercut.

Hope this is what you're looking for

It depends totally on your presentation and handling.

I don't currently perform an effect with more than 2 selections, but if I was put on the spot and challenged to lose/find three or four, I'd probably approach it like this (and pray I didn't eff up):

You can fan the deck face down in one hand, have the three or four cards returned outjogged to the fan, close the fan and use the hindu shuffle jog control to return them all to the top.

EDIT: I just realised that you specified WITHOUT them going to the bottom first. Oops. D'oh!

Thanks for the ideas so far. Iain, a pass would be my favoured way to get a single card to the top but the psychology of getting 4 specs to each return their card to the same place feels a bit off to me. Cmryu, Vernon's multiple shift is something I use but that's really what's causing me the problem as the cards go to the bottom. If I have a crisp clean deck I feel fine about counting their cards off quickly at the bottom and getting to top but if someone has just handed me an old deck it just adds that awkward factor.

Just out of interest has anyone else tried bs control? If so what did you think? Am I just not getting it?

OK... How about swivel-cut then pass, times 4? All selections would end up on top.

Fort wrote:Thanks for the ideas so far. Iain, a pass would be my favoured way to get a single card to the top but the psychology of getting 4 specs to each return their card to the same place feels a bit off to me. Cmryu, Vernon's multiple shift is something I use but that's really what's causing me the problem as the cards go to the bottom. If I have a crisp clean deck I feel fine about counting their cards off quickly at the bottom and getting to top but if someone has just handed me an old deck it just adds that awkward factor.

Just out of interest has anyone else tried bs control? If so what did you think? Am I just not getting it?

Try Arthur Buckley's multiple shift, that brings the cards straight to the top. It's my prefered shift And vernon's shift would work if you hold the deck face up (slightly unnatural perhpas).

ask all four to look at each others selections too just for safety and verification, get one person to gather all four together as you ask someone else to point to where you'll split the pack...

they replace the entire packet on where you've broken the deck, and then pass...

if you're doing it one by one, maybe a side steal instead?

Look up the Elias Shift.

You can read about it, actually, in John Bannon's most recent book,

Dear Mr. Fantasy.


The book is great!

May have been the one mentioned as I don't know the name. But insert them all face up, show them in a face up fan outjogged. Slide off a group of cards onto the lower most (the closest face up card, but the bottom selection when turned face down) and then hindu shuffle the rest on top. Convincing way of shuffling them in while you are really just putting them on top of the deck

Harry Lorayne has a very simple method for getting four cards to the top of the pack, PM me!

Definitely the Neil Elias Multiple Shift - practical and not too difficult to pull off. Excellent move.

I collect the four selections then use an add-on move to place four extra cards on top of them. Then I can do whatever I like to the four 'selections'. Normally I just place them at random intervals in the deck.
Hey Presto, I'm clean.

I occasionally use Bill Malone's multiple control (On The Loose Vol 4 I think) where he loses them in half the deck and then mixes that half with the remainder. Very good!

You could always use Kenner's four 4 four switch. Easy, deceptive and gets the job done cleanly.

You can find the four4four switch in his book, Totally out of Control or buy it here http://www.theory11.com/1on1/

I believe its also published in Syd Segal's book Full Metal Jacket.