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Struggling with an effect? Any tips (without giving too much away!) you'd like to share?

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Postby IAIN » Jul 18th, '08, 20:37



Magic Chris wrote:
practice the whole routine and patter at the same time


No no no no! all wrong....whats with the practice patter rubbish.....Big no's....ok get the effect/book/gimmic out of its packaging, read thru it read it again, play with it, play with it again until you see how it works.....then go use it.....theres nothing more boring and annoying than a Magician that says the same patter and speal to each person he does a trick on.......

DO NOT WRITE IT LOOK A BOOK!!!! have a rough outline in your head of how the effect should go, and then use the natural element of performace and your audiences reactions and their attitudes as part of the patter...its shud be different everytime, therefore making you better at dealing with every situation that performing that effect could offer......If you practice it like a book and do the same each time, you cant handle different situations....STOP BEING LIKE OTHER MAGICIANS AND USE BE DIFFERENT........THIS IS WHY SO MANY FOLK HATE US!!! we bore people with the same old rubbish...come folks think outside the box a bit, go on just give it a try, in time youll see how great this method is...

Cheers, and have fun x


disagree completely..its not the same old rubbish, if...well...your script is good to begin with...being able to "jazz" comes with confidence, but that confidence comes with the knowledge that you know how it all works, the timing and the whole process behind the effect inside and out...

only really achievable with a script...

folks hate magicians because they are cheesey, show offs or egotistical...

making comments on things that the spectators do or react is a natural thing to do - but you will still need to go back to your script...

IAIN
 

Postby magicmindben » Jul 19th, '08, 01:12

Michael Jay wrote:Judge it from successful acts in other genre:

Movies: they all have scripts.

Plays: they all have scripts.



But I see what magic chris is saying Michael. The difference between movies and plays, and magic performences, is that magic performences have a lot more audience interaction. You can
't know what the audience is going to do. I agree to have a GOOD rough outline of what you are going to say, and your reasoning. "It's Magic" "I can read you mind", well hopefully better than just that, but you get what I'm talking about. Then, you work around with what you are saying while interacting with spectators. Otherwise you risk having a solid script that is prepared only for single reactions or interactions. Then you weren't expecting much different to happen, and it can throw you off. One important thing to do is to interact well with your audience. It is also important to have fun interacting with them. If you fail to be entertaining in this way you might become a person who just does tricks.

Just my thoughts.
(Perhaps i should try blend in more so...)

Just my two pence.

(I think that's what you guys say right? I'm from the USA.)

-ben

magicmindben
 

Postby Michael Jay » Jul 19th, '08, 03:34

magicmindben wrote:The difference between movies and plays, and magic performences, is that magic performences have a lot more audience interaction.


And why is that? It's because we break the fourth wall, which is a rarely used technique in movies or plays. But, for us, we have to.

Still, I guess this depends greatly on whether you're a stage magician or a stand up magician or a close up magician. Anyway...

I agree to have a GOOD rough outline of what you are going to say, and your reasoning.


Please, you will note that at the end of my post, I specifically stated, "Script your material, even if it is just a loose script." I think we are saying the same thing, yes?

Then, you work around with what you are saying while interacting with spectators. Otherwise you risk having a solid script that is prepared only for single reactions or interactions.


No, you don't risk anything. The script tells you exactly where you are. The more you do any given trick, the more you say the same stuff over and over. The script identifies areas that allow for a break in the action. Remember, if you start interacting with your audience right on the cusp of your climax, then you have an anti-climax.

Also, you should be trying to get your script as tight as you possibly can. Not too much, not too little. Writing a script is a tough thing to do because, as the late Eugene Poinc says, "Sometimes you have to kill your children." You see, in your script you may have something that you are really proud of, a clever line or something like that, but it doesn't help to drive the script or enhance the effect. You get rid of it - you kill your children.

With a tightly scripted piece, you know precisely where you can break to allow for audience interaction. You should be leading the spectators, not at the mercy of the spectators. You are the guy on stage - you must control your audience. With a good, tight script, this is much easier to accomplish.

Without a script, it is easy to trip over your words or get caught up in audience interaction to the point that you lose your audience. Again, your job as an entertainer is to lead your audience, not try to catch up with them. If you let them, they will get out of hand. Trust me, they have a lot more important things to deal with in life than watching your silly, little tricks.

One important thing to do is to interact well with your audience. It is also important to have fun interacting with them.


Fully agreed. How do you figure a script will destroy this?

If you fail to be entertaining in this way you might become a person who just does tricks.


You might just become that person with or without a script. But I'll tell you this, with a script you've got a better chance of being an entertaining magician over a guy who haphazardly makes up stuff as he goes because he wants to interact rather than have a plan to take his spectators through a journey.

As I said, there is a time and a place for everything under the sun. I know of one magician who likes to have absolutely no script when he first unveils his new tricks to friends and family. But, then he uses those sessions to build the script that he will ultimately use when he starts showing those tricks to strangers. It's how he writes his script - but nevertheless, he writes a script.

Personally, I like to do "jazz" magic from time to time, especially when I am with friends in an intimate setting and they ask me to do something. I have come up with some really good routines this way. But I would never perform walk around in a restaurant or get in front of any audience for pay without having a script for the magic that I will show them that evening.

Mike.

Michael Jay
 

hmm

Postby magicmindben » Jul 19th, '08, 04:48

Interacting in magic with a script is like having a conversation, with you having a script already prepared. It becomes pointless to have a script once you start real interacting.

Just my two pence,

-Ben

magicmindben
 

Re: hmm

Postby themagicwand » Jul 19th, '08, 12:13

magicmindben wrote:Interacting in magic with a script is like having a conversation, with you having a script already prepared. It becomes pointless to have a script once you start real interacting.

Just my two pence,

-Ben

No. You're not really interacting with the specs. You're giving the illusion that you are interacting with them. What you're really doing is entertaining them in the way that an actor does. Giving the illusion that you really like your specs, that this is the first time you've done this routine, that this is the first time you've spoken these words, is the real illusion of magic. The "tricks" are secondary (but still important abviously).

There's more to magic than tricks.

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What?

Postby magicmindben » Jul 19th, '08, 22:53

I am afraid I don't follow any of that first paragraph paul.
[/i]

Oh, forget it. I just really hate to loose such a long argument. BUt I still sort of agree with myself. Also depends on what kind of magic. maybe. Oh well. Everyone has their own style.

-Ben

magicmindben
 

Re: What?

Postby themagicwand » Jul 20th, '08, 01:47

magicmindben wrote:I am afraid I don't follow any of that first paragraph paul.

It's because I exist on a higher plane to most normal mortals. My words are the words of angels and their sweet music is often lost in translation.

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Postby magicmindben » Jul 20th, '08, 02:24

Paul is a psychic angel in disguise?

magicmindben
 

Postby Lady of Mystery » Jul 20th, '08, 08:48

I think Mr Wand is exactly right, why does it matter if you've run through the same script 101 times? The main problem that people seem to have with it is that they feel it wsounds stale and forced. But if it's the first time that spec has seen that presentation then to them it will appear fresh and new. They don't know that you use the same script, to them it should feel new and natural, even if it's not.

Watch any magician, I've got videos magician performing the same routines for different audiences. See a few of these performances and you'll noitice that even the most off the cuff comment or joke is actually part of the script.

With a script, you know where you are in a routine, where you've been and where you're going. Everything is set up and prepared for the effects you're going to perform. These no damger of looseing your way, thinking what shall I do now or 'oh bu**er I should have done so and so before the last trick to set up for this one'.

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