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Hello, again.

This is a slightly older video, but I need advice on some of the slight-of-hand work I'm doing, here. The triple and quadruple lifts are okay, I suppose, though I always tense up when I'm on camera, so they could have been better, but my Elmsley count just doesn't seem to look quite right.

As I've said in earlier posts, I've been away from magic for awhile, and my skills are rusty. I thought I had a good hold on the Elmsley Count, but this video showed me otherwise. It's a bit embarrassing, to say the least, but I figured I could possibly ask some advice from you fine folks, and maybe you can help me figure out what I'm doing wrong.

Here's the performance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eCsPeLgKi4

I refuse to perform in front of strangers until my skills are back up to snuff, so for now you'll have to deal with me talking into a camera all by my lonesome. (And yes, I'm American, hence my lazy way of speaking in the video).

As for the performance in general, I'm almost positive that I went too fast, not to mention some of my movements were a little too big, so I need to tighten up the screws a bit, especially when I do the shaking motion when the cards change.

If you are a member of SAM I wrote an indepth lesson on the Ghost count in the January issue. If you are not in SAM yet, you can join now and get the first six issues of the year (the Mike Close issues) online.

Being honest, there is so much wrong with the count it would take too long to go into here.

Take care, Ian

mjoel wrote: The triple and quadruple lifts are okay, I suppose, though

I wouldn't go that far. They were pretty obvious.

The Ghost Count, or the Elmsley, is supposed to be showing four cards, it shouldn't look like a move, just a mere count.

Just watched the vid. Your lifts look like mine, and let me tell you that is not a good thing!

I'm working on letting the card(s) drop as they turn over as that looks a lot more natural. You are almost placing them back on the deck with each turn and that looks suspicious straight away. I think it's also a good idea to move the turning hand away from the deck - you are almost "hovering over it" as if you expect something to go wrong, which again looks suspicious. Hope this helps.

With the count (I am right handed) I find it is better visualy if when you (how can I put it without giving away the secret) deceive the eye while collecting the second card dont move the left hand at all except whilst pushing the top card as if you have to movement in your left hand the spectators look straight to it and catch you out.

Thanks for the honest and brutal opinions. I guess I do suck after all.

Harsh commenst to yourself there - you don't suck

The double and triple lifts aren't too bad. Yes, they are a little stiff, but a layperson realistically wouldn't notice.

The elmsley count, as you are aware, could use a little practice.

I'm off to sleep now, as it is 3.42am, but when I awaken, if I remember, expect a PM in your inbox with a bit of advice

Nighty night!

I notice you're doing the count at the fingertips. This is a bit of a subject for debate - there are those that feel it looks cleaner, but there are other that say it's a less natural way of counting cards, and therefore dirtier. You might want to think about doing the ghost count with the cards deep in the hand instead, I think most people find this easier, and more convincing because it's a much more natural way of counting out four cards.

Surely it's only magicians that count four cards? wouldn't most normal people spread them ?

Mr_Grue wrote:I notice you're doing the count at the fingertips. This is a bit of a subject for debate - there are those that feel it looks cleaner, but there are other that say it's a less natural way of counting cards, and therefore dirtier. You might want to think about doing the ghost count with the cards deep in the hand instead, I think most people find this easier, and more convincing because it's a much more natural way of counting out four cards.

Funny, I always used to think at the fingertips was easier. Could never get the hang of in the hands. But today, after reading this thread, I thought I'd try it, and it just clicked!!! So if you're going to move it to in the hand, rather than at fingertips, keep at it - it took me almost a year off and on! Sometimes you have to push past a mental block!

But remember, either way, always count your cards the same way, whether you ar doing an Elmsley or simply counting, just for continuity.

I've pretty much always done it in the hands. I thought that's the way it was suppose to be! Anyways... I've made this video for you mjoel. I thought it might be easier to explain on video rather than text. Oh... and sorry about the baby in the background... my niece lol. Hope you find some use with it. Just my advise on the DL and the Elmsley count.

The password to the video is the answer to the following question: Who in the magic community is often referred to as "The Professor"? Just the surname in lower case.

http://vimeo.com/4691185

A great resource stevebo, useful for any magician who is looking for advice on the Elmsley or DL.

(Btw Ghost Count is the name Alex Elmsley gave to the Elmsley Count)

Thanks . I'm hoping to make more of these little tip videos on some subtleties that I use on sleights. My knowledge on the sleights will probably be quite limited though since I'm not a working professional. I'll try my best to help

stevebo wrote:I've pretty much always done it in the hands. I thought that's the way it was suppose to be! Anyways... I've made this video for you mjoel. I thought it might be easier to explain on video rather than text. Oh... and sorry about the baby in the background... my niece lol. Hope you find some use with it. Just my advise on the DL and the Elmsley count.

The password to the video is the answer to the following question: Who in the magic community is often referred to as "The Professor"? Just the surname in lower case.

http://vimeo.com/4691185

Thank you so much for the video!

As far as the Elmsley Count tutorial went, you helped me immensely! I had always used my fingertips even when naturally counting off cards, but after giving it a little thought, it seemed to me that even if I weren't doing a Ghost count, pulling the cards away with my fingertips rather than keeping them in the mechanics grip looks fishy regardless. So I've already begun forcing myself to count off cards in the mechanics grip all the time, so that my Elmsley Count will match the movements pretty well.

I'm also trying to pull my left hand away rather than the right hand like you said, and already it's looking a lot better! I cannot thank you enough! Anytime I was ever taught the count, no one ever explained it as well as you did.

Just let me say, however, that double lifts aren't my problem: double and triple lifts on a small packet of four to five cards only is what threw me off in the video. When I have the whole deck in my hands, it's a lot easier for me to let the cards fall naturally, but when I have so few amount of cards in my hand, it becomes a lot more difficult to determine if I have a solid grip on the right amount of cards, or not.

So could someone please give me some tips on how to do multiple lifts with only four to five cards in my hand? That's what scared me the most about that particular move.

Anyway, again I thank you, stevebo, for the very helpful and practical tutorial. Would you mind leaving it on the server so I can go back and check on it from time to time?

IanKendall wrote: . . . Being honest, there is so much wrong with the count it would take too long to go into here . . .

Oh, I dunno, Ian, everybody else seemed to be able to explain it rather well.

lol, good thing I didn't take your post too closely to heart, else I would have been quite disheartened.

No worries buddy! Just so you know though... on Vimeo, you can actually download the video. It should be on the bottom right hand side of the page. Having said that, I don't tend to remove videos anyways.

I know what you mean about the fingertip thing! I had never thought about it, then I saw your video and I tried it and I was just thinking... hang on, who holds cards like that?! So yeah... if you are doing a sleight that's purpose is to mimic a natural move, then try and do exactly that... mimic the natural move!

It's good that these videos help people! It encourages me to speak better on camera, because right now, I still feel nervous and it's probably pretty obvious from the video!

As for the multiple lifts in packet tricks, I don't really perform packet tricks (to be honest... I don't really perform at all anymore). However, I will hopefully try and get a video done for you tomorrow to give you my insights on multiple lifts. I'm sleepy now .