talkmagic.co.uk

Hi there guys,

I don't really know how to start that post but magic has been part of my life since I was 5-6 years old. Of course, back then I wasn't nearly
an ellusionist (neither I am now) but I was so keen on magic. The first trick I learn was a simple with some kind of svengali deck for example:)
For me magic is something that makes others believe that the impossible is possible and gives them a part of happiness in nowadays hurried life.

So here is my main dilemma, I started actively learning magic, basicly card sleights for now. I am going to perform for friends, not going to head up to
the stage or something, just going to have fun with friends and maybe other people I meet. The problem is I don't really know how to build up my
routine. I can say that I'm very interested in fire magic and manipulation with items (as well as levitation of items). So could you please tell me:


1: What fire gimmicks to look for ( I mean those who produce a flash or something, so you could use it to produce a rose for example - I know it is used flash paper
and cotton but I saw some kind of guns & stuff at magic shops), also I was looking at some fire wallets (as well wallets that produce burning business cards) and
possibly if you know any great fire magic trick or gimmick please advice me what to look for:)

2: Also could you tell me please what decks are best for card magic - currently I am practicing with some regular bicycles, but I am looking to buy some
more, as well as some designed ones like Ghost/Black Ghost, Arcane and shadow masters, Tally ho(s). What's your expirience with them and which of them handles good (possibly
for card magic ?:) I know that maybe other decks are good for manipulation? . I was thinking of buying 3 decks from all of them but I really have limited
budget, which I know is a problem and that's why I was thinking of buying 10 or 12 decks of one kind and I hoped they will be enough for about an year at least ?:) I stopped at ghost decks,
especially on the black one, because it looks mistique, and as well as white ghosts + the gost gaff (by the way which gaff deck you think is best?:) also what black deck.
(I am ready to spend about maybe 500 $ for all my stuff, and I know what in the world of magic it is nothing, but that's
all I can give, even gave up of buying a car:). Good part is that those 500$ are only for gimmicks and props, I already buyed some DVDs that gona touch me some moves I hope.



3: Could you please suggest me some really cool and stunning card tricks (close up ones) that have a great effect on audience (may be gimmicked ones or not,
I am currently looking at the distortion DVD & Gimmick but I've read that it was really fragile and one must handle it with a lot of care).

4: About Levitating objects I was wondering what IT is best (by the way as far as I know you can make loops with thread right?), I've stopped
currently on the Invisible Elastic Thread by Yigal Mesika. Is there any better? I know that you can make thread with Woolly nylon thread, but it's not elastic
right?:) . Also here comes the big question - do I need a gimmick like the tarantula, how do you think? I heard that It must be handled with care too , but still
you can make a great effects (is it worth buying it or I can just stick up to regulard using with IT). Maybe buy some dispenser?. It may be stupid question
but I don't really know what is the difference between loops and IT (just guessing but can I make loops by using million dollar knot or I missunderstood something:). Also what
else will I need for levitation objects (wax?, and if you could tell me what kind of wax - is mesika good?:), and maybe some other stuff?:)

5:I looked at the Card Fan to Card top hat item and I liked it a lot. Thing is that even on the photo in the magic shops I could see that the fan is part of the
hat and I pressume it is visible from a close distance. Can it be used for a close up magic or it is made for stage magic mainly?:) Also could you advice me on what
else to look for, mainly for close up acts at parties or going out with friends:)

If you have in mind any other mind blowing trick or gimmick I will be happy to tell me about it:) ( not the reveal of course but that to look for:)

For me magic is not a way to entertain and make people think that the impossible is possible, it makes
me believe that impossible is really possible. Even when I know how stuff work and they are only illusions,
I want to believe that there is more. Maybe that's ellusionists greatest curse - they make people happy
but actually it is kind of sad because the magic for them is kind of gone.
I wrote a lot of stuff in this post and I am sorry but I had so much questions:) Hope to hear from you soon.

I will be happy if you guide me to some good online stores, so far I use ellusionists, theory11 but they are US ones, thing is I am going to use a friend of mine
to bring me some stuff from the USA, but the others I must buy at european shop probably, so do you know any good European store?, or possibly some other good USA one:)


Best Wishes

Hi and welcome to TM! Nice to read of your enthusiasm. You might want to post something in the intro thread if you haven't already

Ok, here goes my 2p worth...

Don't run before you can walk. You mention wanting to learn pyro effects and stage type flourishes with a fire vanish or transformation, among other things. I'd have thought that's pretty technically advanced for a beginner (which I am rightly or wrongly assuming you are). What books have you read? Which magicians do you like to watch the most?

I think most people here will tell you to avoid the flashy decks and stick to either bikes, bees, fournier or tally-ho. They are all cheap and handle pretty well. What gaffs you want depends entirely on what effects you're aiming for. Not an easy question. I'd recommend spending a few hours browsing this forum. It contains hundreds of hours worth of study material from some very skillful and knowledgeable people. Use it as a resource and ALL your questions will be answered. You're not asking anything new here

I'd say $500 is a lot to have to spend on magic. If you're into stage effects or bizarre, then it's probably not going to go very far, but for someone into cards, that's a LOT of money. Buy a few books on what interests you (there's plenty of recommendations in other threads here), some cheap bikes, and study and practise. Don't blow your money on things that will sit on a shelf, like most of us do.

That's about all I can say. I'm sure you'll get different and better answers from those who know far more than me.

Good luck and keep smiling

All the best,
Wishmaster

You need to learn to crawl before you walk. You're trying to run a marathon at the moment. That being said, your enthusiasm is nothing but a good thing. I would suggest focusing in one area of magic first. With the art of magic, even being a jack-of-all trades but master of none takes a lot of time, effort and practice. For purposes of getting an idea of what goes into each of the major areas, I recommend Mark Wilson's Complete Course in Magic as it covers a little bit of everything.

DO NOT BLOW $500 JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE IT TO SPEND!

If you choose to go the card route first, all you need is a copy of Royal Road to Card Magic and a deck of cards. That's it. All of a whopping $15 USD and you are set for some time.

Going the coin route is pretty similar. Buy a copy of BoBo's Coin Magic, gather a handful of coins and you're out the same $15.

There are similar "bibles" for areas such as IT, spongeballs, cups and balls, TT, etc. Most, if not all, are available in the same price range. IT is cheap though some of the mechanics can get a lil' pricey, sponges are cheap, TTs are cheap. A very nice set of C&B can get expensive but they're not needed.

Buy a mirror. A full length mirror if you intend to perform standing or a large one to place in front of you while sitting.

I would avoid like the plague gimmicks at first. The majority require some sleight of hand anyway. Learn to basics first.

The other side of the coin is your performance. Unless you are extremely comfortable with public speaking, it would be wise to study this area as well. Do not perform for friends and family just because they will be more forgiving of screw-ups. Do not perform for friends and family just because your confidence with them is higher due to familiarity.

Go to your local comedy club on any night except open mic night and observe the handling of hecklers and what works/doesn't work. Also pay attention to the timing and delivery of scripted lines. Participate in open mic night. You'll only need a couple of minutes of material but you'll get a free education in dealing with strangers and speaking in front of them.

Along those lines, it may benefit you to take acting lessons. With acting lessons you will learn two key elements to a performance: using tone of voice and facial expressions to direct the spectators thinking and emotions. This can be extremely powerful.

Another non-directly related recommendation that has done wonders for me is to pick up a book or two on the topics of salesmanship, advertising and suggestive language. The wording of what you say AND how you say it is crucial.

Hey amadeusbg

If you want to learn a couple of really astonishing tricks using some simple sleights buy Oz Pearlman's Born to Perform. On this DVD he shows you some great routines and they rely on some easy sleights that you'll need to practice. The good thing about this DVD is you get to see Oz performing in front of people and what he does to manage the situation - since magic is about entertaining people - you also get to see the strong reaction he gets from doing some quite easy stuff. He also has a stripper deck DVD and an ID dvd/download that can help build confidence.

My advice comes not as a seasoned old pro but as someone returning to magic after a long absence and is bamboozled by how much magic is out there especially on the internet.

Back this up with the advice that the other two have given you!

One other bit - find and join a local magic club / society.

.robb. wrote: DO NOT BLOW $500 JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE IT TO SPEND!

Why not ??? That's part of the fun of it, and it's good for the magic dealers and the people here that will end up buying the stuff back unused at half price

Le Petit Bateleur wrote:Why not ??? That's part of the fun of it, and it's good for the magic dealers and the people here that will end up buying the stuff back unused at half price

Hehe, that's a good point! amadeusbg, if you'd like a list of things I'm after, please feel free to buy them and sell them on to me later for, shall we say, half price?

Go and grab a handfull of bikes, and get a copy of the royal road to card magic.
If you are a *cough cough* 'visual learner' then I can reccomend Roberto Giobbi's excellent card college volumes, which are a little easier to follow Plus it's always nice to have books in sets
Then perform.
It is quite simple really, once you've got into that, then you will find yourself absorbed in it all and studying fancier stuff.

But trust me on this one, there is no greater satisfaction than to be able to be handed a deck of cards (this scenareo has never happened to me funnily enough, I have always had cards on me) at a party or something and asks you to perform, to be able to improvise and perform stuff you've never done before..

A question for amadeusbg. Are you doing this to become a performer or just to have fun?
I'm not asking that to be condescending or rude and I hope it doesn't come across as such. It's just that most people here will advise you in ways to improve your art or become a performer, when perhaps all you want to do is magic tricks.

I do think many of us forget that for some, magic is a hobby or novelty, something to show your friends and why shouldn't it be?

I remember when my interest in magic started it was all packet tricks, D'lights, Ravens and those hollow stacks of ten pence pieces that disappear when you put the brass thing on it.

I remember going to the local magic shop to buy tricks, not books or tools, just magic and while everything I brought was useless c*** (not the best) it was still fun.

I still recommend 'Complete course in magic' it's magic for everyone and also if you just want a flashy trick you can buy and use I recommend D'lights, those things rock and you can get them at any magic shop.

Hi and welcome,

Get onto you tube and subscribe to 'magicgeek'

Hundreds of videos that show the effects. Have a look and see what appeals to you. Make yourself comfortable tho as you could be there for hours!!

Start off small and learn the basics first as i am doing. Ive discovered very quickly that with magic it is a small drip feed system that works best. You might think that old tricks are a bit lame but the principle will hold you in good stead for future effects.

Good luck!

Alec

amadeusbg wrote:Hi there guys,

Hi, pleased to meet you.

amadeusbg wrote:So here is my main dilemma, I started actively learning magic, basicly card sleights for now. I am going to perform for friends, not going to head up to
the stage or something, just going to have fun with friends and maybe other people I meet.

Ok, I am a complete amatuer but I done some street/pub tricks. I would like to say in my experience, people that don't know you well are a bit easier to work on for the following reasons.

-They are slightly more likely to do as you say without making an attempt to catch you out.

-They won't try and squeeze the secrets out of you so much or try and impress people saying they know how you did it and proving to you that they don't really know

-They don't have any idea how experienced or skilled you are.

-Your patter won't seem out of character to someone who doesn't know you.

amadeusbg wrote:2: Also could you tell me please what decks are best for card magic - currently I am practicing with some regular bicycles, but I am looking to buy some
more, as well as some designed ones like Ghost/Black Ghost, Arcane and shadow masters, Tally ho(s). What's your expirience with them and which of them handles good (possibly
for card magic ?:) I know that maybe other decks are good for manipulation? . I was thinking of buying 3 decks from all of them but I really have limited
budget, which I know is a problem and that's why I was thinking of buying 10 or 12 decks of one kind and I hoped they will be enough for about an year at least ?:) I stopped at ghost decks,
especially on the black one, because it looks mistique, and as well as white ghosts + the gost gaff (by the way which gaff deck you think is best?:) also what black deck.
(I am ready to spend about maybe 500 $ for all my stuff, and I know what in the world of magic it is nothing, but that's
all I can give, even gave up of buying a car:). Good part is that those 500$ are only for gimmicks and props, I already buyed some DVDs that gona touch me some moves I hope.

For the few tricks I perform without any need of a gaff the very best cards in the world are ones supplied by your spectator.
The other night I was in a pub talking to a girl I know that plays poker a lot, she knows I do a couple of tricks asked me to perform for her and her friends. I politely declined reasoning that my cards where at home, she checked her bag and found three decks of cards. A quick run through of "do as I do" and another trick(I don't know the name of but it involves a slop shuffle) and her and the people watching were in awe.

About fancy decks, I like the white ghost deck but I am noticing one thing. The more flashy the deck looks the more likely people are to think the magic came from the cards not the person holding them. They handle nicely but to someone with my low level of skill, they are just a deck that fans nicely and looks fancy.

Things I'd reccomend:

A Brick of standard Bicycle,Bee or Tally Ho cards.

The Royal Road to Card Magic Book, DVD or both and Oz Pearlmans born to perform(DVD).

If you master the content of those DVD's (Something I am working on currently) You will be an extremely impressive card magician.

Those few things listed will give you months of learning and practice. You'll be able to hold on most of that cash, maybe earn some interest on it.

amadeusbg wrote:3: Could you please suggest me some really cool and stunning card tricks (close up ones) that have a great effect on audience (may be gimmicked ones or not,
I am currently looking at the distortion DVD & Gimmick but I've read that it was really fragile and one must handle it with a lot of care).

Oz Pearlmans Born to Perform will show you a few stunning routines which take some practice but will shock people without any gimmicks.

I got an ID off a fellow user of this site last night. I've already got the trick to a performable standard. If you want an extremely powerful quick effect that will stun people this is golden.

Anyway, I'm only a beginner myself so if someone thinks my advice is bad or my observations flawed, please point it out.

I hope this helps.

Kind Regards

Gavin

If you're wanting to get into fire magic, it's best to get yourself at first, a nice simple gimmick that gives a quick spurt of flame nice and safe. The 'guns' you are talking about can be expensive and dangerous.

Fire is simply a utility in magic. If you make something appear from seemingly nowhere, lovely. If you make something appear from nowhere in a burst of flame you get more of a 'wow factor'. Fire should emphasise an effect, not be an effect in itself.

The first gimmicks I would recommend for fire would be a 'Finger Flasher' or 'Universal Flasher'.

First I want to thank you all for the answers:)

I am really going to perform only in an informal surrounding. You are right about spending 500$ and I will reduce that amount (hopefully), thing is that I want to buy anything (I know it is impossible) or at least the most important things that I will need at least for the year ahead because in my country (Bulgaria) there is just 1 magic shop , that for example sells Arcane for 22 $ (regular price is 7-8$..) and not to mention more complicated stuff.
Jean Eugene Roberts nailed it, for me magic is just a hobby for real, something to have fun with.

I was thinking much about cards. Truth is that basicly I can't borrow decks from people. Playing cards in Bulgaria are c*** (not the best) (for real). When I first thought about ghost and other black decks I was thinking that I can present them in front of my friends as decks that are kind of mistique and hold the souls of great magicians or something ( although I was goint to show them that are regular cards despite of that). I am definetely going to look for the books and dvd(s) you mentioned.

You made me really think over fire magic and effects so I should probably look for a simple fire gimmick a kind of ignitter for the flash paper or something that makes a little flash (although I must be careful with it too), I liked a fire wallet, too (especially that one http://www.peteraustinmagic.net/id120.html) could you please tell advice me either to buy a fire wallet or not and maybe if you like some other wallet let me now:)

Thank you all for answering my questions again:)

Best Wishes

I'm going to make your day
http://www.illusioncraft.co.uk/illusion ... oducts.htm
As for fire wallets I really can't help you. I used to have a really great fire wallet that I got in America. Since then however I've had no luck finding a good one. If you do find one let me know.
It's already been said but I'll say it again if your into card magic all you'll need is RRTCM. Also do look in the reviews section you'll find tonnes of things you'll want to buy (that £500 is going to disappear fast).
Best of luck to you.

or, spend fifty pounds, give it a month and see how you go? its funny how quickly tastes change...

fifty quid will get you a lot of good magic...

IAIN wrote:or, spend fifty pounds, give it a month and see how you go? its funny how quickly tastes change...

fifty quid will get you a lot of good magic...

Agreed but like many people, ive wasted so much money on things that sounded good but were useless. Books and basics really are the way ahead. I know it sounds dull and time consuming but its the only way to get very good at what you want to do.