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Eshly wrote:Kolm, I have done that. I performed that routine hundreds of times, because the ID is a killer!

Oh my god, Eshly!! You just gave a spectator a non-examinable gimmick!

because it looks less like a magician is performing, because we all associate the image of a guy fanning cards with magic, not Mentalism.

Then what on earth are you there for? As far as the audience is concerned you might as well leave a list of instructions on a table

When people pay to see a magician, they come to watch you do magic. Not some stranger, or if they're lucky their mate. You.

Randy wrote:

Eshly wrote:Kolm, I have done that. I performed that routine hundreds of times, because the ID is a killer!

But it makes me happy to use a hands off deck instead, because it looks less like a magician is performing, because we all associate the image of a guy fanning cards with magic, not Mentalism.


Tom
xx

Mentalists fan cards too. And really who "fans" the cards. You are just going through the cards in a standard "pick a card" like manner in the hands. It looks completely normal and natural for anybody to do. Hell even NON magicians do it as well.

1. I agree that the ID is a great effect.

2. But are you seriously trying to tell me that doing the effect WITHOUT ever touching the deck isn't more impressive?

Eshly wrote:2. But are you seriously trying to tell me that doing the effect WITHOUT ever touching the deck isn't more impressive?

Yes

Eshly wrote:

Randy wrote:

Eshly wrote:Kolm, I have done that. I performed that routine hundreds of times, because the ID is a killer!

But it makes me happy to use a hands off deck instead, because it looks less like a magician is performing, because we all associate the image of a guy fanning cards with magic, not Mentalism.


Tom
xx

Mentalists fan cards too. And really who "fans" the cards. You are just going through the cards in a standard "pick a card" like manner in the hands. It looks completely normal and natural for anybody to do. Hell even NON magicians do it as well.

1. I agree that the ID is a great effect.

2. But are you seriously trying to tell me that doing the effect WITHOUT ever touching the deck isn't more impressive?

I'm telling you that there is nothing wrong with you going through the cards and then up jogging their thought of card. If you are performing like you say you are. Then people aren't paying you to give them a list of instructions, they are paying you to entertain them. People do not want to think (too hard) when they are being entertained.

Like I said, there is nothing wrong with just going through the cards as normal and then simply up jogging their thought of card. It looks completely normal.

Also I could probably name a jillion top dollar mentalist who use the I.D. in their act, and handle the cards.

kolm wrote:

Eshly wrote:2. But are you seriously trying to tell me that doing the effect WITHOUT ever touching the deck isn't more impressive?

Yes

Well it is.

I perform different effects, and the most "popular" are the ones where I never touch the cards, and people tell me thats why. Because they feel like they are doing the work.

And by the way I bought no less than 2 ID's today.

kolm wrote:

Eshly wrote:2. But are you seriously trying to tell me that doing the effect WITHOUT ever touching the deck isn't more impressive?

Yes

Yes again! Seriously Eshly, if as soon as you've had them pull their card out of the ID they start thinking it's a gaffed deck then you have utterly and completely failed as a performer. They never do! Ever! All they see is a card overturned, when they're telling their friends they've never going to stress who took out the damn card!

Eshly wrote:I perform different effects, and the most "popular" are the ones where I never touch the cards, and people tell me thats why.

I'm gonna hazzard a guess and suggest that your handling is all wrong in that case. If they believe the stuff which you don't touch is better, it could be because you're handing the deck in a way which is making them think that ain't no ordinary deck there

Van_der_Belt wrote:

kolm wrote:

Eshly wrote:2. But are you seriously trying to tell me that doing the effect WITHOUT ever touching the deck isn't more impressive?

Yes

Yes again! Seriously Eshly, if as soon as you've had them pull their card out of the ID they start thinking it's a gaffed deck then you have utterly and completely failed as a performer. They never do! Ever! All they see is a card overturned, when they're telling their friends they've never going to stress who took out the damn card!

I AGREE!


I AGREE!

I AGREE! PLEASE STOP THINKING I DISAGREE!!!!




... but I still prefer my new Brainwave deck. For two reasons:

1. IF I WISH (not always, but if I wish) it can be handeled by the spectator.

2. It can be viewed from underneath, which was actually one of the flaws of the origional Brainwave deck, because the sight of the underneath and all the other cards "as they should be" is visual confirmation of non-gimmickary.



To me, the Brainwave has always been more impressive than the ID, just because I like the colour change idea. Thats just me. Please stop thinking I don't, or haven't, performed such things as the ID.



NOTE:
It still pees me off to this day that although I can perform some brilliant effects, people still ask to see the ID routine. -.-

Eshly wrote:2. It can be viewed from underneath, which was actually one of the flaws of the origional Brainwave deck

Damn dwarfs, always spoiling magic. Did you know I nearly hurt one last week because he wasn't big enough for the lady sawn in half trick?

But seriously. I have a better and cheaper solution

Hold it a few inches lower down

kolm wrote:

Eshly wrote:2. It can be viewed from underneath, which was actually one of the flaws of the origional Brainwave deck

Damn dwarfs, always spoiling magic. Did you know I nearly hurt one last week because he wasn't big enough for the lady sawn in half trick?

But seriously. I have a better and cheaper solution

Hold it a few inches lower down

But I like showing the underneath subtly :p

Oh look, can be done with an ID:

kolm wrote:In the offbeat of them looking at the card and picking up their jaw off the ground, replace the top half on the bottom. Take the card off them, put it on the bottom of the deck faced up. Flash the bottom subtlety as you replace the deck in its box. DO NOT call attention to the bottom card

Edit: You know what, I give in. You're never gonna listen to reason. Once more you have to find fault in everything anyone says, and I get the feeling I'm gonna be up until sunrise at this rate

kolm wrote:Oh look, can be done with an ID:

kolm wrote:In the offbeat of them looking at the card and picking up their jaw off the ground, replace the top half on the bottom. Take the card off them, put it on the bottom of the deck faced up. Flash the bottom subtlety as you replace the deck in its box. DO NOT call attention to the bottom card

Are we now turning this into "Hands off brainwave deck" VS "ID"?

I have a question.

Why do you care about showing the bottom? I mean put yourself in the spectators shoes (i know that's hard for you.). A guy performs for you, reveals your though of card to be reversed in the deck. You are now not only impressed but generally amazed at how he predicted or KNEW what card you were going to think of. Then he decides to show you the bottom of the deck for no reason at all.

Randy wrote:I have a question.

Why do you care about showing the bottom? I mean put yourself in the spectators shoes (i know that's hard for you.). A guy performs for you, reveals your though of card to be reversed in the deck. You are now not only impressed but generally amazed at how he predicted or KNEW what card you were going to think of. Then he decides to show you the bottom of the deck for no reason at all.

Because I'm clever.

When I was 5 years old I had a magician for my birthday party, and I had one every year for the next 5 years. The problem is I was a loud, autistic person who didn't understand that you wern't meant to reveal the tricks. I saw through the card magic he performed and ruined a lot of tricks. I wasn't trying to heckel or anything, I just didn't understand.

Maybe my magicians were all c*** (not the best), I dunno.



Anyway, the point is, I like to improve stuff. In my On the Mark routine I have changed things so that the wallet is a lot smaller, examinable (though I only ever show them inside it briefly, explaining that "heres my wallet"), and I take the envelope out much earlier in the routine.

The same goes for the ID. I like to show the underneath, as it decreases the look of gimmickry. This is very true of the origional brainwave deck, where you could ONLY see the backs of 51 of the cards, so there was a big temptation to see the rest of them underneath (which you could ofcourse not to)


I have a law:


If you can improve it. Do.

If it ain't broke....