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Two days ago I had the chance of trying out Corinda's memory game: you ask the audience to shout out 20 or so items, ask someone to write it all down, and then show them you remember each and every item by number. Osterlind's version also advises you to joke with the audience, ask for extra details on some items and then recite the entire list backwards. Nice little touch, but the principle is the same.

While practicing for the real performance, I found out a most intriguing problem. I have an image for each number, and in order to practice the effect, I actually write down items and memorize them. After I write down 20 items, I check that I can recall them correctly.

On the fourth practice or so, I noticed that my memory started getting... swamped. Swamped down by details. I mean, my image for number 1 is a bear. After four practice runs in two days, the image of a bear that holds a coin (first item from first run), or a CD (first item from second run) or dancing on a table (first item from third run) were simply too strong. I couldn't edge another item into the picture in my mind. The other items were just fixated in there already.

I guess this is a warning for all of you who want to attempt the memory feat. Be careful when practicing the day before the show, because you might create associations too powerful to overcome easily. As anti-intuitive as it sounds, it might be that you want to just remember your list, practice on associating items with it AS LITTLE AS POSSIBLE.

That, at least, was my impression. A few hours before the show, when I saw I couldn't fit in more items into the images in my head, I panicked and changed the images I had for each number in the list. The new imagery worked perfect, and the memory game was a great success. Still, if I hadn't discovered that in time, the game might have gone horribly wrong.

Did it ever happen to you too? How did you deal with it?

I had a similar response when using a loci system to memorise sequences of 13 cards. Only thing to do is leave it for a bit, I think, or "empty out" your associations, though that will probably take a bit of focus.

That's never happened to me, for mnemonics which I have just created there is always a perenial freshness and so I don't really get confused.

I think that from the way you described it you weren't making the mnemonics crazy enough- if I was just imagining a bear holding a cd, or a bear holding a coin then I would expect to get the two confused, since the point of mnemonics would almost become pointless if I had to rely on my memory to remember what the bear was holding. However, if I morphed them into one item then it becomes much more memorable- for instance I imagine (don't ask why) being given an ancient antique coin with a bear's head on and being told about an ancient bear-civilisation and their economy by a boring museum curator. Similarly when I think of bear and CD I imagine an advert for a CD of a bear singing in the most beautiful human voice.

I'm not entirley sure why being more absurd with the mnemonics gets rid of your problem, but I have found that it does. I think it is perhaps because I'm more likley to remember when I was thinking up that mnemonic because it was so memorable and thereby not become confused about when I came up with the mnemonic- the principle of location as Dominic O'brien might say- A bit like if you're reading on the train and you tend to remember where you were as you read something memorable.

Alternativley, I could be being really patronising and you already knew all of that...

If that's the case then I would reccomend perhaps using two different mental locations to distinguish the sets of mnemonics, thereby giving your memory time to allow the mnemonics to 'fade'. For example, in memorising dates for the Russian civil war, there are several times I need to remember 'marching' things to remind me that the month is march. But mentally in my head the mnemonic to remind me that the treaty of Brest-Litovsk was signed in March, 1918 is imagined in an entirley different room from the March 1919 defeat of Kolchak by the red army and therefore there is no confusion.

Finally, and I hope I have not been droning on too long, but: I cannot praise running through the mnemonics afterwards, enough. In fact, for such a brilliant effect, I think it adds to the authenticity of it, if you have to pause and close your eyes for half a minute or so and genuinley perform some mental activity, as though you were going over some kind of mental photograph (which you sort of are). I think you could probably even say 'I'm using an ancient mental technique which anyone could learn' and still get some credit for it, as though it were something special.

When I used to practise memorising lists, I too had this problem. The solution I had was to prefix the lists with another number. So, list 1 would be numbered 1-1, 1-2, 1-3, 1-4 etc, list 2 would be 2-1, 2-2, 2-3 and so on.

What system you use for the prefix is, of course, up to you. I found rooms in my house to be quite effective.

Mr. Grue -
It might be that a good solution would be to give it a week's rest between each performance. Or maybe have two lists (which I'm also considering doing), as Ken suggested.

Sam -
Thanks for the detailed reply. I really value those. I try to make my mnemonics as crazy as possible. The bear doesn't just hold the CD, it is actually stuck around his neck and he's having trouble breathing.
However, it's interesting to hear that you involve auditory mnemonics in your image. I didn't think about doing that, but I'm sure it would increase the longevity of my mnemonics. I'll start incorporating this into my method.

As for the running through the mnemonics backwards, it is indeed a brilliant stroke. We often forget how impressive this feat of memory seems to be, because of how easy it is to do it. Running backwards through the mnemoncs gives you a true air of a memory expert.

By the way - I did it in an evening private show, which was mostly about science and the brain, with a little memory game here and there. After everybody said an item, I asked them to say a number, and I said which item was at that number. Then I wanted to recite them all backwards, but the hostess jumped forward and said: "Maybe someone here remembers everything?"
So I asked, and it turned out there was one volunteer who said he remembered, and he actually did recite them all.
SOOOO
I congratulated him for stealing my applause (in these words, which brought out a bit of laughter and more applause to him), asked him how he did it (he didn't know), explained how I do it, and moved on with the lecture. After a minute people remembered that I haven't recited the list myself, so they asked me to do it anyway, and I did, to a somewhat lesser applause.

I think asking your audience whether someone remembers all the words can be a good thing to do with a small audience. If nobody goes forward, they'll treat it as a friendly joke on their behalf. If someone does remember all the items in order, he becomes the star of the party, and you can ask him how he did it and put him in the spotlight... then show how you can recite the items backwards (which is better, obviously). So you prove your point, and also turn one of the guests into a birthday kid. I like that.

Ok, enough typing. Nighty night

Sam: The reason it's easier to remember absurd images is because in order to make an absurd image, we have to invest more effort into creating the association. The more thinking we must do to establish a memory, the stronger it becomes.

Personally, I've never had the problem. That said, it might help if you adopt Harry Lorayne's peg system (from his Memory Book) since the numbers themselves are used in creating the key image, and with each number, you have various available images that will work. That way, you can switch between different key images each time you perform.

[edit]

dup: the person who managed to remember the list may have unconsciously utilized a mnemonic system or, if you're very lucky, you may have encountered someone with a form of synesthesia that makes them picture everything they hear, allowing them to-- with no effort at all-- memorize things the way we train to. Bascially, we're emulating what they do naturally.

If you're interested, Ricky Jay's Learned Pigs and Fireproof Women describes a guy called Data who probably had that innate ability. Sleights of Mind (by Stephen Macknik, not the one by Harling&Nyrup) briefly describes a case of someone with synesthesia-based-memory.

I’ve been toying with Lorayne's Memory Magic Square for some time now, not yet got the memory work down 100% though. I do have trouble making up images that are absurd enough to stick in my memory. At least, I have trouble thinking of then quickly enough.

R

Robmonster wrote: I do have trouble making up images that are absurd enough to stick in my memory. At least, I have trouble thinking of then quickly enough.

R

The more graphically violent or obscene the better. There's a memory segment on a Harry Lorayne video where he advises that.

I never had a problem with it. I only perform this for relatives ( come show them how you memorize stuff ) because its not the on-the-go type of effect and I just do it for fun. What I'm trying to practice right now is the Harry Lorayne stunt where he names out many people's names in the audience who he just met.

Anyhow, I've done the 20 objects game 3 days ago, and it went on well. The time before that, I've done it twice in a row and I didn't have a problem with it.

Perhaps I'll have to say that... ummmm, the image you imagine should make you frown in amusement or laugh a bit. This way its not only ridiculous, but also more emotionally connected at that moment.

For example. One is a gun. And it was a table last time. I imagined a scene from a movie where a cowboy shoots the heck out of a table.

Two is a shoe, and it was a mobile phone ( wow, I still remember them ) ... I actually imagined a shoe hidden inside a shoe, and it went on well. However I think I should have imagined the same cowboy stepping and ruining the mobile phone. ( What a home-appliances hater this cowboy is )

3 is flea, and it was a chair perhaps. Imagined myself sitting down and annoyed by the fleas around me.

See, its all active images and it leaves an imprint in you. The fact that you clearly and emotionally imagine those images helps I believe.