talkmagic.co.uk

Do you think being able to perform magic is something you are born with or do you think anyone can learn with enough practice?

Personally old bean, I think magical technique is a learned skill (I certainly wasn't born good with cards), but that we are all born with the talent to create truly magical moments in each other's lives...

How talented we are at it is another matter, strong magical technique can help you to create these moments more easily..

In other words, natural talent's cool but practice hard and you get better.

I don't believe anyone is born with the specific ability. Like anything else, you have to learn how to do it. However, I do think some people have a natural talent. Practice and training hones that talent - it doesn't create it.

People can learn how to do almost anything. Someone CAN learn how to play the guitar, for instance - they just won't always learn how to play well.

In my opinion, it's a mix of natural talent and practice.

We are all born with certain "aptitudes"; some of us are excellent athletes while others can do massive math equasions in their head faster than someone with a calculator. When it comes to magic we are faced with an interesting "twist" to that factor; what I do well you may not be able to pull off in the least and vice versa. That's one of the reasons Magic is such a fantastic field of study, it's full of variety and variance; it is an art form we can tailor to our natural strengths. This however, is becoming a lost reality of sorts.

Today we have tons of people that are new to magic and want to learn it all. There's nothing wrong with that but what is "wrong" is the philosophy that you must have a Close-up Act, Stage Act, Traditional Manipulation Act, Hypnosis Show, Juggling Abilities, be an Escape Artist, Side Show Geek and Mentalist all in one. Not only is this unprofessional it's not logical.

I recall someone saying something along the line of "man cannot serve two masters..." Well, that's the case when we get into the trap of this new jack-of-all-trades syndrome everyone's trying to get in on. When we spread ourselves too thin by trying to do it all, we end up doing little to nothing well and never being able to realize our goals.

This brings me back to what I was saying about having a natural penchant for specific modes of performance and the innate talent for making that work for you. A prime example is the fact that I stink when it comes to manipulation (slights) and for that reason it's just not practical for me to attempt a classic manipulation act... it's not a form of magic that I'm 'natural' at. On the other hand there are facets of Mentalism and Bizarre Magick that I do quite well and it has proven to be my strongest and most natural area of working, so I specialize in those areas.

Yes, in a previous incarnation I was an Illusionist and yes, I still design and consult for other performers in that capacity (I just love those big boxes!) In my younger years I did fair as an Illusionist but again, though my passion was in it, it was not one of my strengths. I had to cut the chord and go with the style that best suited me in order to know progress and genuine accomplishment, mentalism has given me this.

Long story short, there is a "natural" side to what we learn and how well we do it. But at the same time, it is a process of on-going education and the cultivation of not only skill at the technique level, but skill as a showman that has learned to use his/her natural traits and "connection" if you would, in order to gain that optimum sense of advantage that makes you look like a "natural".

I know, it sounds rather strange and even a bit confusing, but there are always added factors that must be wieghed when it comes to this kind of thing.

Craig, I agree with your analysis, but I do have one comment to make regarding your jack-of-all-trades assessment. When starting out it is important for young magicians to be exposed to all of the different types of skill and performance style. I agree that at some point you need to decide which to focus on, or you become the very type of performer you are talking about. Perhaps some people just haven't found their niche yet?

Not necessarily, but ! - Some ppl have a tendency to learn faster than others, and that also goes for Magic. Some people find it easy to handle cards and other items, while others would have to practice weeks, months, yes even years for "easier" stuff. So, not a spesific talent for magic, but talent is talent, and goes for magic as it goes for other stuff.

How I see it...

Motivation plays a huge part in becoming adept at any skill or discipline.

The seeds of motivation are usually planted in very early childhood, either by the parent, child, or peers such as teachers.

The child then discovers that by learning, goals can be achieved.

Whether it be a child who becomes motivated at sport, academics, music or magic—I still think that the word 'Skill' is defined exactly correctly by dictionaries—it's something you acquire by learning.

Sure, genetically we're all different. But skill isn't stored in our genes. Some say that parenthood is a skill which is in our DNA, but in my opinion, it's something we subconsciously recognise throughout life as 'the right way to be' and just act accordingly when the time comes.

This thread may go the way of the 'creative' thread (Mr Jamez remembers this one well... ). But I think to expect that we are born magically talented is little more than an illusion.

As Craig says, some people are born with different aptitudes: a child born with a developed physique could probably become an athlete, versus a child born with an exceptional mind could become a scientist.

But I still believe that the motivational aspect accounts for what PATH these people take. I am not sure that someone born with the genetic makeup of a master athlete will ALWAYS end up that way, but because they excel at sport during schooling or growing up, perhaps they realise that this is what they are good at, ergo, enjoy it, and become motivated.

As humans, we have choices.

A racehorse bred for it's pedigreed parenting has been 'crafted' by careful selection of mother and father. This gives that horse the best possible base for training it to become a winner.

And it USUALLY follows that if a child is born into a family of well educated doctors, the child will be motivated by the success and nurturing of their parents, and get educated—possibly to become a doctor.

Wheras, it USUALLY follows that a child born into an uneducated, poverty stricken family, the child will lack motivation to become anything more.

I am not stereotyping or pigeonholing here intentionally... but I think it's a fair indication that we simply become what we WANT to be.

As with anything, becoming skilled at magic requires motivation, knowledge and dedication.

We're not 'born to perform'. I believe we are somehow moulded that way during our upbringing.

seige wrote:This thread may go the way of the 'creative' thread (Mr Jamez remembers this one well... ). But I think to expect that we are born magically talented is little more than an illusion.

Oh yes.

And it USUALLY follows that if a child is born into a family of well educated doctors, the child will be motivated by the success and nurturing of their parents, and get educated—possibly to become a doctor.

And those that don't become world class Mentalists

Mrs. Goldstien would've been much happier if Phil followed in the family bsuiness but alas, he got sucked into magic and became a Maven


Seige is correct on some of his points though, environment and personal attitude are very important;especially parental support and encouragement! Those that start down any path actually, when they are young and gain family support, tend to succeed and work from a point of confidence that those who do not get that kind of support, lack (frequently at a very devastating level).

Fact of the matter is, when a child feels genuine support and appreciation in life, they naturally move forward in life hosting a mindset that's a bit different than most -- a unique sense of confidence as well as focus that allows them to know genuine pride.

There's been a ton of studies and reports put out on this issue that I've found to be very interesting.