talkmagic.co.uk

As a relative newbie to both this site and magic these are my observations and frustrations on becoming a new member.

1)Introduction. Too much importance is placed on the introduction page by some members, the stats back it up, most get less that 75 view and only a handful of replys.
I posted an introduction got only 5 replys, the fact is most members dont read them ,maybe they should but that is another matter.
There is no mention in the rules, regulations & etiquette about posting an intro,members should stop jumping on people like they have broken the rules. A reply to someones post with "post an introduction please" without anything else is seen too often.

Thinking out loud maybe more information should be asked upon joining, maybe a composory 25 words suming up there magical status should be requested, these 25 words could sit with there signature for there first 100 post or maybe six months. This would help members decide if a reply would help, or if there were infact dealing with a secret hunter / time waster.

re Post replys
The more experienced should realise that people could be on the very start of there magical journey when they join these boards, theye are going to ask silly questions, give silly replys. Taking the ***s or giving blantlenty false information just for the sake of it or to execise an ego is worthless.
Too often a pack of members will pounce on a newbie who asked what seems like a stupid question, I cant understand why they do that, either dont answer or help! dont just post for the sake of it, join a chat join if you feel the need for that.
To me it seems to some people act and think your magical talent is judged by the amount of your posts made not there content.

making TM more welcoming
Anyway I think my main point regarding new members is be more patient,think before you type, is what your about to post worth anything.

The banter adds to the enjoyment of using this forum, but maybe it should not at the expense of new members

regards
Chris


ps sorry for the grammer and spelling, I currently have noway of checking and correcting

To be honest, i only came on here to sell some dvds i had, when i was going out of magic (didnt want to carry it on) and was like oh things for sale, but then i joined relised i couldnt do that.

But from reading the site and talking to people i got back into magic, just a little thing i thourght i would share with you.

Darrel wrote:Does anyone mind if I try out my idea, if it is a borderline case?

Help and advice to newcomers is always worth doing so by all means carry on!

crispy wrote:Too much importance is placed on the introduction page

Fair observation! In fact the idea of the Intro is not only to get to know a little bit about newcomers but to try and make the point that it's a give and take Forum - this was mainly due to a rash of 'How do you do that one like David Blaine does...' and less polite postings from some newcomers. The Intro first idea was intended to slow things down a bit and see if people were willing to join in rather than expect answers etc.right from the start. However there are ways of asking and there are better ways of asking and, as mentoned above, we don't always get things 100% right.

With regard to responses to Intros, most of them are an understandble 'Welcome to TM' or similar and it can become very repetitive at times. For this reason there are occasions where only a few responses are made.

All in all, we still need to work at being TM and I guess it will be a never ending process. With as much help from members as possible !

As a newcomer ...

The majority of people here seem to be accomplished magicians and the ethos of the board is, quite rightly, around not giving away the tricks of the trade.

The newcomers are overawed, baffled or just curious. That's natural and they may have difficulty expressing it in a way that won't give rise to offence, especially if they're younger.

And, being here in a forum with many accomplished magicians, there's not really a space for beginners to discuss the joy of mastering the f*&*&^ in-jog and not getting spotted

(Oh, that avatar's not me, BTW, it's my younger son, just in case anyone's wondering about the erudtion of a 7yr old.)

All excellent points. In fact there are a lot of fumbling amateurs here as well (yours truly being one of them!) so we seem to be catering for a broad cross section of skills and abilities. Thanks for clearing up the bit about the Avatar, I thought we'd encountered a child prodigy and was looking forward to his sell-out World Tour!

Haviland wrote:
And, being here in a forum with many accomplished magicians

id just like to point out that most of us are UNaccomplished magi... there are some pros on the forum but id say most of us are hobbyists of varying skill levels.

Yup. I'm definitely a hobbyist, in it for thrills and giggles and because magic is a fascinating intellectual challenge.

A minor observation re: the apparent 'belittling' of new members...

This forum contains some very articulate, literate and confident posters. In fact, I would say that due to the quality of some of the posts on here, that this particular forum rates as a more 'intellectually approachable' forum.

However... due to the sometimes harsh responses to new posts, a lot of what is said by members to newcomers can be misinterpreted as sarcasm.

For instance—Mark Lewis... the man's sense of humour and general conversational style is extremely offputting at first, but this is just his character. Once you understand him, he's a fountain of knowledge and assistance, and a thoroughly nice bloke.

I think it is the aspect of understanding someone's conversational style which may be causing the problems. However, this is not a justification for others to join in and grind newcomers into the ground.

I guess the psychology behind this could be that newcomers who are more likely to fit in here will hopefully understand the nature of early responses, and conversely, those who are just after a free secret or revelation will not persist.

As an analytical observation... I've just returned from my honeymoon, and the resort I stayed at in Cuba was full mainly of other couples with which I just could not get on with whatsoever. However, when I found people with the same bizarre sense of humour and character as myself, I found it easier to converse with them—even though perhaps they weren't from the same age group or mindset. I found this rather odd, as I found myself drawn into conversations with people I could relate to or took an instant shine to, and yet at the same time, when someone attempted to make conversation with me whom I didn't take the same shine to, I simply gave one syllable replies in the hope they'd leave me alone.

What I *think* I am trying to say is that TalkMagic seems to be a like-minded community. We're all pretty much on a wavelength, and when someone arrives who appears not to fit in, our subconscious messages in postings and comments are perhaps a sort of territory-marking exercise?
Perhaps in our own little ways, we're being defensive?

Perhaps it is human nature? It's a barrier which goes up which basically in a nutshell seems to suggest "I cannot be bothered with you, go away".

Although, that isn't always the intended interpretation.

I agree with the suggestion that we should all attempt to be a little more patient with newcomers, and perhaps follow the 'innocent until proven guilty' rule wherever we can.

I think that sometimes people do jump at the chance to have a go at newcomers. Sometimes it is warranted but then again there are times when the newcomers requests/questions etc are misinterpreted (sp?) and from the responses given, they feel pushed out and not welcome. Maybe the solution is to give newcomers at least a little room for initial mistakes and give them the benefit of the doubt before making them feel unwanted.

PS. Welcome back Seige! Hope you had a good time!

seige wrote:... a lot of good stuff...

I've been using a conferencing system (CIX) for many years. The problem for newcomers is always being "overawed" by the old guard and being put off, and the for the old guard being bored / dulled by the same questions and / or topics coming up again and again.

I suspect it's always going to be the way with established communities - but new blood is needed from time to time or everything will stagnate.

As well as keeping the sarkiness under wraps, surely there's a responsibility on newbies to read the rules before posting. I think a lot of the negative responses are aimed at people who clearly can't be bothered or think they're for everyone else. Either way, they're probably down to a perceived lack of respect for a little part of cyberspace and a passtime into which people put significant effort.

Tomo wrote:As well as keeping the sarkiness under wraps, surely there's a responsibility on newbies to read the rules before posting. I think a lot of the negative responses are aimed at people who clearly can't be bothered or think they're for everyone else. Either way, they're probably down to a perceived lack of respect for a little part of cyberspace and a passtime into which people put significant effort.

Ahem...

"Never read the instructions." - Paul Daniels.



But, yeah, I agree, I browsed the forum and it's FAQs for a while before I signed up.

Haviland wrote:Ahem...

"Never read the instructions." - Paul Daniels.

He He! Yeah, you're right. I wondered how long it'd be...

Seriously, though, that's advice from the sainted Mr. D about making an effect your own, not an ideal for living in an online community.

EDIT: Either I'm getting old, or this keyboard is more knackered than I am - edited for missed letters...

Enthusiasm in younger people can mean they jump straight in. All I'm saying is to give people a gentle reminder, without having about a dozen posts of sarcastic comments. I have been guilty of this. Yes, it is because of the same things happening all the time. If someone just comes on and has 4 posts of pure spam, we don't want them. What is the point of replying though. Was it Julius Ceaser who said " I came, I spammed, I left"? They don't stay around to check the posts, they are too busy finding the next site.
Just leave a post letting people know you have PM'd a Mod to let them know. If someone asks how to do an effect, PM them, post a reply to that effect. Lets educate them, if they are willing. They may be used to exposure forums. We need to let them know that we can be helpful in actually taking an effect and giving the performance of their lives.

How about next time someone asks how to do a effect you tell them where they can find it but stress that they have to be willing to pay for it if they want to know how its done