talkmagic.co.uk

hi guys.
i've recently been training my classic force. not on the public...but on close friends and family. i think the classic force is great, and would make alot of my tricks were a forced card is need much more effective-instead of riffling through the pack.
however, the classic force works for me about 5 out of 10 at the moment. i've been practicing for about 2 weeks now. not along time i know. but do any of you have a come back from a classic force gone wrong...or any tips on how to make sure the spec choose the forced card?

secondly.
next year I'm going to start on my first magic video
i want it to be a mix of effects, not just card effects or escape effects. what (none card) effects would you guys recommend. and roughly how long should the video be? because i have not got a performance video..yet. so i woudn't know.

thanks for everything in advance

Well basically you just have to have another trick ready to perform if they don't pick the force card. The classic force is completely no risk. If you are getting the force 50% of the time after two weeks then that is very good.

Also don't worry too much about getting the occasional thing 'wrong'. The spectators will not know most of the time anyway.

I sometimes have problems with the classic force as people try to be tricky and pick the top card or something to that effect. I prefer a riffle force or something that is basically 100% under your control.

First of all I do not think you can practice the classic force on friends! From my experience friends behave quite different than strangers in a live performance.

In fact R Giobbis write in Volume 1 page 222 in the card college, that:

"You first thought might be to practice on your spouse or a close friend. But, such well meaning helpers are practically useless for learning the classic force, as they don't react naturally"

Giobbis, discuss various "outs" for the classic force that would allow you to practice the force under real performing conditions.

He also has an interesting section on the psycology behind the force.

Soren Riis wrote:"You first thought might be to practice on your spouse or a close friend. But, such well meaning helpers are practically useless for learning the classic force, as they don't react naturally"

That has been my experience. IMHO, the best way to proactice the classice force is use it for every trick you do (when appropriate) that does NOT require the force. Then if you hit you know you hit, and if you miss you learn from it and continue on with the originally planned effect. By practicing when you don't need the force to work you will be more relaxed and you will get it down more quickly.

Kolisar wrote:That has been my experience. IMHO, the best way to proactice the classice force is use it for every trick you do (when appropriate) that does NOT require the force. Then if you hit you know you hit, and if you miss you learn from it and continue on with the originally planned effect. By practicing when you don't need the force to work you will be more relaxed and you will get it down more quickly.

that sounds like a plan batman.

if you are one away, you can then use it as a key

When you do a 'Pick a card trick' always Classic Force. If its not taken use any of the various methods to bring it to the top and then reveal it in the dozens of well known and published methods available in all basic card books. If it works, you have a miracle, if not, no one is any the wiser and you still find their card.

It takes the pressure off you doing the Classic and you will get better at doing it. Its the only way to practice it, with back up.

I've got a few of thoughts about the classic force, other than the fact that I'm rubbish at it (although unpracticed).

Assuming a miss ...

1) You can always get them to pick another and use equivoque

2) You can get them to take the left and right cards also and use equivoque

3) If you miss by one, you've got a key card for another trick

4) You can always break into another trick

Last week I practiced this force by this method:

I used a guy I knew but not too well. I just told him to pick any 10 cards. I got a break and just classic forced 10 random cards.. it worked 8/10 times which I was well happy with.. I do this now to one person each day..

with the 10 random cards go into any packet trick or just have them insert the cards on at a time into different parts of tghe deck and using controls and cuts reveal them all however you like.

I think this is good as it really helps you understand the behaviour of different kinds of people..

works me me anyhow

I find the classic force quite hard, as does any, but i think the best way to practise, as some here have pointed out, is to do the force when you DONT need to, that way, if they pick it, great and do a miracle such as have a silk with the card in your pocket or whatever, however, if they don't, never mind and continue with whatever effect it is u were doing.
As for your performance vid, i recommend coin tricks such as 4 coins to a glass or a raven vanish. I recommend J.B.Bobo's Modern Coin magic if you're looking for some ideas.

I'm having to stop practising my Classic Force on my other half - every time she picks the right card, it's as though I hold a little party with only me invited! It's such a buzz to execute it.

By the way, I've only started attempting the classic force since seeing Paul Daniels perform it at the Ipswich Magical Society Convention - he explained how he does it, then proceeded to demonstrate by laying on his back, head hanging off the edge of the stage, and forcing a card on someone - how's that for a camera angle!?

Does he do it much differently to the way it's described in classic literature?

This thread may be of interest:
http://www.talkmagic.co.uk/ftopic11864.php&highlight=

He glimpses the bottom card of the deck, cuts it to the centre, holding a break below it, then forces it - the fingers underneath the fanned/spread deck touchign the card to be forced - he explains that doing it this way not only can you see what you're forcing, you can also feel it with your fingers, taking away the necessity of having to look at all.

I'd never had any luck with this until I tried it his way. It might well be the same way it's taught somewhere, but this it works for me. Very well.