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And here is more:

Of course, the above analysis does not answer the question posed by the title of the chapter. What is hypnosis? And in particular, what is stage hypnosis? Actually it may surprise and perhaps disappoint you that the answer is that I haven’t the slightest idea! I’m the hypnotist and even I don’t know what is going on! This confession on my part may perhaps cause you to lose confidence in me and deter you from reading further. All I can say in my defence is that I don’t think anybody else knows much about it either!

Of course, there are many theories ranging from dissociation to response expectancy. I won’t go into the precise explanations of these theories because I don’t want to give my readers a headache. Suffice it to say that many eminent psychologists have discussed it, dissected it, torn it apart, chewed it up, spat it out, put it together again, disagreed with each other and in the end we poor students of the human mind are no wiser that when we started!

My position is that if one set of learned psychologists come up with one theory and another equally learned set of psychologists come up with another diametrically opposed theory, then I’m not going to waste my time trying to figure out who is right. After all, if these educated, clever people with degrees and letters after their names can’t figure out what hypnotism is what chance have you and I got?

Actually, having said all that, I do have a theory about it-at least where stage hypnosis is concerned. I confess that I’m not a psychologist but sometimes common sense and street-smart experience count more than countless hours of experimentation in a dusty laboratory.

Here’s my theory: I don’t believe there is any such thing as hypnosis! Yes, that’s right! You read me correctly. Even though I have personally influenced thousands of people to jump up and down and act like lunatics on stage I do not believe I have ever hypnotized anyone!

Now before you throw this book away, let me tell you that I am not the only one that has come up with the theory. A lot of stage hypnotists, hypnotherapists and yes, some of the aforementioned learned psychologists also agree with me. To sum up the theory: all the university and psychology studies have been a waste of time since hypnotism doesn’t exist in the first place!

Mark, Yes you were right about the 25%/75%. Thanks also for explaining about sending people to hypnotherapy.

The extracts from your book, along with the other points in your post, have been very informative.

I will write more later, when I will have more time. I just wanted to say thank you, as you have answered some of my questions. I don't feel my views on this are too far away from yours.

Mark, I would be very interested to hear your response the article I linked. I know you said you didn't want to read their book, because the views you had suited you just fine, but there are the underlying notions, absolutely free of charge.

You'll probably just dismiss it, but the empirical evidence is in great support of their arguments (that's what makes for strong arguments you see, empirical evidence and not just speculation) and the implications of it are being put to great practical use by psychiatrists, with much success.

Since a great many psychiatrists seem madder than their patients I prefer not to place great reliance in their opinions. Indeed I often think they need to see a psychiatrist themselves and end up even madder than they were in the first place.

As for the link you put up I tried to read it but it gave me a headache and I couldn't understand a word of it. Quite frankly I haven't the patience to study and understand it. As a stage hypnotist I am happy to believe that the thing is a load of c*** (not the best). I get better results that way. Once I start to believe in the hogwash I personally will not be able to do it properly. It is purely a personal thing but if I know something is crooked I am far more comfortable and effective with it. Years of training in wickedness have made me this way.

However if I ever get time I will try and look at it again and see if I can make head or tail out of it.

However knowing the whole thing is baloney makes it far easier to deal with certain things that you are always warned about. For example the c*** (not the best) that you may not get them out of it. I know perfectly well that since they aren't "in it" in the first place I don't panic if they don't come out of it as fast as I want.

My view on things helps me with the supposed aberative reactions (or whatever the hell they are called) that are supposed to come up. Since these reactions are nothing whatever to do with the hypnosis which doesn't exist anyway and more to do with the spectator being nuts in the first place I make sure that I discourage crackpots from coming up in the first place. And on the rare occasions that someone like this even gets on the stage I spot them fairly quickly and send them back to the audience. Consequently after thousands of performances I have never once had one of these abreactive things.

Quite frankly I don't want to get involved in any state theory explanation since it could undermine my effectiveness. By knowing the thing is a load of baloney and at best the punters simply THINK they are hypnotised whereas I know perfectly well that they aren't helps me to do the thing properly from an entertainment point of view.

One advantage of having a non state theory belief system is that you can learn how to do the thing a hell of a lot faster. After all if you know that you don't really have to hypnotise anyone but only make it look as if something along those lines is happening then the whole thing becomes much easier.

It is far more advisable to be a street smart showman than a scholarly scientist on stage. You do have to be psychologist but an entirely different type to the ones you will find in the world of academia. You have to know how to handle people but then you have to know how to do that when you are doing card tricks too. Most magicians however are lousy psychologists. They know how to manipulate the props but they don't know how to manipulate the people which is far more important. And for stage hypnosis your props are human ones so if you don't know how to manipulate them you are in for a difficult experience.

And I venture to suggest that the first step in manipulating these human props is to know deep down that nothing whatever is happening to them except a combination of social compliance, self delusion, alcohol ( a little rather than a lot) exhibitionism, and good acting by the subject. All these factors are present in a hypnosis show and each good volunteer will be subject to at least one of the above factors. You can also add in the not infrequent factor of the hypnotist whispering to uncooperative subjects to play along for the sake of the show.

Once the hypnotic student gets all that in his head he will get good results from his work. If our legislators got all of the above in their heads it would help them to deal with all the calls that come from time to time for hypnosis to be banned. Since it doesn't exist anyway I don't see the point of having it banned in the first place.

some definitions of hypnosis on the Web:

A trance-like state in which a person becomes more aware and focused and is more open to suggestion.
www.stjude.org/glossary
A sleep-like state usually induced by another person in which the subject retains awareness of the presence of the hypnotist and where the subject is susceptible to heightened suggestibility. After training by a hypnotist, some migraine patients can be taught to hypnotize themselves in order to reduce stress and related symptoms.
www.achenet.org/resources/glossary.php
A therapeutic technique in which the patient is placed in a trance. This places the patient in an extremely suggestive state in which false memories can be created.
www.religioustolerance.org/gl_h.htm
An alternative state of consciousness in which the attention of an individual is focused away from the present reality and towards particular images, thoughts, perceptions, feelings, motivations, sensations, behaviours or any combination of these.
www.nature.com/nri/journal/v4/n11/gloss ... ssary.html
an altered state of consciousness induced by another person, in which one can access creativity, retrace certain inhibitions, reprogramme patterns and work with pain relief.
www.inneraccess101.com/glossary.htm
A state of heightened suggestibility.
www.deeptrancenow.com/dict_g.htm
Method used to transform a person into a trance-like state.
www.spinalnet.co.uk/EEndCom/GBCON/homep ... 5900403319
A state of altered consiousness, usually induced artificially.
www.drugstrategy.central.sa.edu.au/20_d ... _glossary/
A trance state in which you are receptive to suggestions that may help you to heal yourself.
www.bodyandmind.co.za/info_glossary.html
is a psychophysicological state induced-like sleep. It is an altered state of consciousness, characterized by a heightened sense of suggestibility and weakens critical judgment in which the subject is responsive to suggestions of the inducer, the hypnotist.
www.azmindbody.com/glossary.htm
A deep state of relaxation where an individual is more susceptible to suggestions.
allpsych.com/dictionary/dictionary2.html
a trancelike condition usually induced by another person in which the subject is in a state of altered consciousness and responds, with certain limitations, to the suggestions of the hypnotist.
towerwebproductions.com/alt-lib/occult/definitions.shtml
a trance-like state in which response to suggestions or commands is increased.
www.somersetmedicalcenter.com/15057.cfm
a state that resembles sleep but that is induced by suggestion
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
Hypnosis is a psychological state whose existence and effects are strongly debated. Some believe that it is a state under which the subject's mind becomes so suggestible that the hypnotist, the one who induces the state, can command behavior that the subject would not choose to perform in a conscious state (even behavior to be performed after the subject has left the hypnotic state, through post-hypnotic suggestion) or even behavior they would be incapable of in a conscious state, such as ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypnosis

so then... does the person begin "flapping their arms like wings and clucking like a chicken" because Mark has placed them in a state of hypnosis and he is directly influencing... to some extent controlling their actions?

OR

does the person begin "flapping their arms like wings and clucking like a chicken" because they are so overwhelmed by the adrenalin rush of being on a stage in front of a crowd and since the guy before had barked like a dog...

I'm not so sure it matters so long as the people watching have a great time, the people barking and clucking dont hurt themselves and the performer gets paid... in fact if one really could hypnostise someone, surely first on the list would be the person booking the performer, "your getting sleepy... when i click my fingers, you will wake up and double your offer..."

I have now had another cursory look at that Givens report that was linked here. It doesn't even mention hypnosis. It does chatter a lot about dreams and suchlike. However in order to dream you have to sleep. Even state theorists agree that hypnosis has nothing whatever to do with sleep.

You often see rapid eye movement on stage and that is a sign you have got a great subject. However they are not in a state of "hypnosis" They are merely in a state of kidding themselves they are in "hypnosis" which from a performer's perspective is just as good.

No. Ignore the academics and get on with the job. You will be a far more effective stage hypnotist that way and you will learn the thing a whole lot faster.

Actually, the third page refers to how their dreaming theory ties in with hypnosis, although admittedly it is a brief mention:

Joe Griffin and Ivan Tyrrell wrote:It provides the first scientific explanation for hypnosis (showing that the REM state and the state known as hypnosis are one and the same).

That is the idea which their monograph "Hypnosis and Trance States" expands upon. Once this is understood the reasons why hypnotic inductions (such as the old cliched pendulum swinging) work.

A lot of hypnotic phenomenon also becomes clear - trance logic (ala dream logic), people saying that they are unable to move (just as in REM sleep our muscles are inhibited), hallucinatory experiences. The article does not suggest that hypnosis is the same as sleeping, rather that the hypnotic state is the REM state that occurs during dream sleep.

If you do ever decide to look into their explanation of hypnosis further, their Hypnosis and Trance States and Dreaming Reality (esp. Chapter 8, 'The Waking Dream') books are the ones to go to.

Mark,

Your reply is like saying that magicians know they aren't performing real magic. Or that mentalists know they are using a centre tear. It is the whole point of suspension of belief of the AUDIENCE, not what the magician, mentalist or hypnotist believe. A perfectly good explanation.
There will always be arguments on this subject. Much the same as someone posting saying if physcics are real or not. (Lets leave that there.)

Some of my thoughts have been answered. I mentioned placebos in medicine. Although you used the word in a slightly different statement, it still rings true to what I was saying.
My question about not using/being able to use some people has also been answered. It is more a case of stagecraft built up over time, where you can identify the people you want to use.
I have always sat on the fence on this subject. After reading your thoughts, together with the total mishmash of information of definitions given by "experts", I must agree with your comments.

Except for one thing.Hypnotism isn't baloney. What is percieved as hypnotism may be, but maybe hypnotism should be described as, " the ability for someone to convince themselves or others that they are in a condition where they are open to suggestion."

I think hypnosis is real. I mean its not as extreme as other supernatural powers people claim to have. All it does is put you in a strange and peaceful state of mind. Its not like your moving things with your mind, even though i believe that is real too. But there is more of a chance that hypnosis is real is real other than other things

Somebody earlier compared hypnosis to the placebo effect -- (i.e. somebody takes a pill they believe is medication and start to get better... or they take a pill that they believe will give them a particular reaction-- and the reaction occurs.)

I find this comparison very interesting -- because the this effect works ONLY because the subject TRULY believes this pill has the ability to alter their state of being.

Therefore-- it seems plausible that if I truly believe someone can cause me to feel dizzy by simply touching my head-- I will actually become dizzy when they do touch my head.

In other words-- to me it doesn't really matter what the "trigger" is... so long as the subject honestly believes it will cue a specific response.


--Then again... maybe I'm just really hoping it's true because I'm just starting to delve into the world of hypnosis and NLP and all that interesting mentalism trickery!!

All i have to say is this....
My grandfather used to practice hypnosis, and not for a stage trick or thrill, but to understand the mind and conciousness. He hypnotized many people, who didnt get a rush from being on stage (in fact they were private sessions), and actually had horror stories of people experimenting with hypnosis and it making some subjects snap. He said it took hours to bring this one subject out of a deep trance.

having said that, i do also agree that people onstage, many times will get a rush and think that they are hypnotized, when they may not be.

by the way, he also said real hypnosis can take hours, and a few tries sometimes.

I think hypnosis is real. I think that since the subconscious will try to turn its beliefs into reality, if you can convince them that they are stuck to their chair or whatever, then their subconscious will do whatever it can to make that real to them ,in this case stopping your muscles from lifting you out of your chair, making it seem as though you are stuck.

I believe that something does go on inside a subject's mind when they are "hypnotized" because I have hypnotized a couple of people and experimented with pain control. IE- I tell them they wont feel pain, then proceed to do things that would normally cause a lot of pain (don't worry I had their consent), but they don't even flinch. Seriously, if anybody doubts the existence of hypnosis, I have no idea how this is accomplished.

Well thats my theory. I'm not an expert but Ive had some experience.

i think hypnosis is a muddy term for something we can never agree on...

i believe in suggestion, and trance-like states...i've achieved them in performances with people, all reacting to the same methods in entirely different ways...thats what i find fascinating...

which leads me to conclude that its whatever that person mind makes it...

"you will feel something along your arm soon..." but what? heat? tingling?

different people have responded differently, but to the same wording...

I have a friend currently doing a module in clinical hypnosis, and he seems to have some interesting and sensible sounding thoughts on the matter...

He basically defines hypnosis as "self-focus". He does not believe in the "you are getting sleepy, now squawk like a chicken" stuff, and his tutors (some of whom are eminent hypnotherapists) confirm that this is infact tosh. But hypnosis of therapeutic use is more like simple concentrating on your own being and psychological make-up, and using imagery to guide you. You cannot make people do things that they do not want to do, but you can help people do things they *do* want to do by getting them to think about it in a deeper way than they would unaided. After all, how many of us actually sit, close our eyes and spend half an hour or an hour focusing on our fears, expectations or vices?! The imagery is just a useful tool, but in itself is not "true"...

For instance, as a relaxation technique I learnt a few years ago to concentrate on my hand and to feel it getting heavier and heavier, as if it were made of lead. I then "feel" this weight spreading up my arm and into the rest of my body - by the end of it I am totally relaxed. My hand was not actually getting heavier, so does this mean that this is "bunkum"? No, it's a technique of relaxation and self-focus that is a useful means to an end - in otherwords, it is a mild form of "hypnosis".

I can do this to affect my muscles, so there is no reason why others can't do it to affect their thoughts in some way. A common one is making associations -we do this every day, associate a particular smell with a person etc. It's exactly the same, however under guided self-focus you can help people to make useful associations, for instance a feeling of confidence and freedom when they feel a pang of nicotine craving, or to make a feared object seem more and more ridiculous until the phobia ceases (this is a genuine method, I didn't get this out of Harry Potter! Although I suspect this is the basis for the spell thought up by Rowling). If you can reduce your fear by association, by learning to picture yourself "turning down the dial" on the "fear setting" in your "control room", well, why not? It's not that I believe you are actually turning down a real setting, but you are using that thought process to attain a real result.

The way I see it, everyone has their own framework for a bit of meditation, relaxation and "mental self improvement". Be it self-confidence classes, yoga, whatever... even religion to some degree. I'm a practicing Christian and I fully believe in God and prayer, nevertheless I'm not blind to the fact that meditating on something and focusing on something in silence holds some pyschological benefit for everyone, and I don't deny that I gain this at various points through the practice of my faith.
By and large, it isn't something that "the world" teaches us to do - we're taught to stay in the now, to focus on things around us, to constantly react to stimuli - hence things like yoga, meditation etc. can be seen as a bit weird and new agey, and religious practice is constantly under criticism - but you do a survey and I think you'll find that everyone has a hobby or practice that allows them to shut off from the world and focus on themselves. It's not selfish, it's necessary for good mental health. I see hypnosis as just one of those practices of "self-focus" available, and have no problem with people having it, as long as they don't expect someone to be able to change things drastically and easily against their will (ie. weight loss or smoking). The hypnotherapist will guide you in deep, relaxed thought about yourself and your psyche - nothing more, but also, nothing less.

Hypnotic suggestion as it applies to dramatic or bizarre demonstrations is basically like a dressing up game where, try as you might, you can't get the buttons undone. It may be with "your" consent, but it's the subconscious consenting to act, not the conscious. There are a million and one ways of achieving that.