talkmagic.co.uk

Some very interesting points there ID!! Just by coincidence I picked up David Blaine's first ever DVD on street magic a while ago on sale. He was speaking about his love of one on one street magic. He said that its more personal and can interact with the audience. He went on to say that he doesn't like these magicians that are big scale and extravagant but prefers real magic.

I was impressed with the DVD and couldn't help but wonder if David Blaine should watch it himself and remember his roots.

I hope I didn't go to of topic but it got me thinking about why some magicians tend to forget their past and go for the bigger is better approach. When it should be magic that is impressive as apposed to the scale.

Exactly!!

Blaines words were '' You see these magicians and they use props that get bigger and bigger!! Whens it going to end??''

Hmm I dont know David.. you tell me!! I hear a lot '' Can you do that card through window one?? My response '' Ive not seend that one.. then 5 minutes later do KAOS on them!!

My first impression of Criss was '' Man this guy is full of himself!! His tricks are mere camera trickery and nothing seemed real!!'' I didnt like this guy at all!! Nothning to do with my experience.. Criss is not that big over here

Yes, ID - you make a few nice points in your thread, but my problem stems from the fact that this (I feel unwarranted) attack on people like Criss Angel is almost never thrust upon someone like, say - Cyril Takayama.

90% of Cyril's effects couldn't be replicated by the average magician due to expensive props - and yet he is the darling of the younger people involved in the arts. The argument should be all-encompassing - not just against the people you don't like. Bear in mind, ID - I'm not pointing you out as doing such things - I'm just making a point in the face of your comments.

My respect for Criss Angel stems from the very roots you champion. He is an accomplished sleight of hand expert, as well as a world-class illusionist. I've seen his close up work and even without the big-budget effects, I've found him astonishing.

Yes, I agree that his persona can turn people off - and it did the same for me at first with the Mindfreak series. However, there has been a noticeable departure from this to a style and approach that seems more like him being himself. I think the series has benefitted from it. I'm also looking forward to the new season. Jay Sankey coming on board makes me think he's making the return that many people are calling for (I don't recall Sankey being one for massive scale illusions) - and I'm excited to see where Criss Angel is going to go with it.

As for dilution of your magic - this is a double-edged sword. Yes - this kind of thing can come up, and does. But can any close up worker say they've never heard "can you do that effect that Copperfield....etc, etc."? Probably not. The "big names" can always have a detrimental impact on the average performer. But, I'm sorry - that's not Angel, Blaine or Copperfields' problem. It's yours. If you get that question and have no response in some way - then perhaps you're in the wrong business, my friend. I adhere to a quote from Jay Sankey....

They've seen Blaine. They've seen Copperfield. But they've never seen YOU.

That's huge. And it's incredibly true.

Just recently I was asked if I could vanish myself from the top of a groups' table in the middle of a restaurant, and one woman even said "just like Criss Angel did". After a little by-play and dodging, I did a variation of Sisti's Mixed symbols using 5 playing cards. A near self working CARD TRICK - and at the end, was told by each person there it was the greatest thing they'd ever seen. That reaction not even 2 minutes after they wanted me to be Criss Angel.

So perhaps the next time you get that kind of request - instead of letting your blood boil, show them what YOU can do. Trust me - they'll forget they ever asked if you could walk on water.

By the way, Demitri, it doesn't appear that you will get your camera trickery proof ...

Demitri wrote:However, there has been a noticeable departure from this to a style and approach that seems more like him being himself. I think the series has benefitted from it. I'm also looking forward to the new season. Jay Sankey coming on board makes me think he's making the return that many people are calling for (I don't recall Sankey being one for massive scale illusions) - and I'm excited to see where Criss Angel is going to go with it.

True true

I did actually forget about Sankey coming on board.. Im a big fan of Jay. ( although I actually despised his style at first too )

Hhmm.. thinking about it.. Ive not seen any of criss angels close up material.. and maybe I word incorrectly.. its his style I do not personally favour. And Im not one to be impressed by grand scale illusions.. NOT FOR THE FACT that Im asked how they are done.. why indeed, there is much that I do not know.. I have been asked the workings of a particular card trick that I do not kow and my responses have to be the same. I am happy with my progress.


I suppose my argument is slightly hypocritical. I too ''fool'' people on a much smaller scale. I guess my comments should just lie with the fact that its his style I dont like. In much the same way as I think David Blaine is dry.. although it was through his shows I became somewhat interested. Though I didnt look into taking it up, I was mesmorised by the things he did.. even then I didnt like his personality but loved the effects, so I always pay homeage to that.

I too have a few Mindfreak episodes.. and although I dont like his style.. I do respect him inside.. I guess.. a little bit.. enough to keep commenting in these threads and I will certainly be one to keep an eye out now Jay is on board..

how quickly I turn..

I'm glad Demitri mentioned Criss Angel being an accomplished sleight of hand expert and its a shame nobody ever mentions that - in fact one of my favourite Criss Angel routines doesn't involve any stooges or camera trickery (the poker chip routine in the party episode)
Now I know how he did the first two moves but I have no idea how he got the chip in the glass with the pack of cards on top of it. The teleporting coins from one fist to another is another example of his sleight of hand skills - anyone can figure it out but its so quick its virtually undetectable.

there are many different types of magic. there are catergories, sub-catergories and even sub-sub-catergories.

many of us forget, that ALL magicians started somewhere, and that is nearly 100% down and dirty with the small effects, whether it's a stripper, just a deck or some sponge balls.

over years styles develop and the magician starts to have ideas of his/her own (like myself).

criss angel-like everybody here-probably started with something like a deck of cards. he didn't start by walking on water or floating.

the matrix! it's an epic film. Neo falls from the top of a skyscraper and slams into the ground, only to be bounced back up and survive. Neo also dodges many many bullets being shot from a gun by one of the agents-all in slow motion. camera and computer trickery. we forget all the engineers that have gone behind it and simply remmeber Neo dodginy hell loads of bullets. should we slate it-because of how the effect has been made? it's essentially the same thing as criss does in SOME of his effects. he is using technology to entertain the viewers at home.

stage magic. a lot of assisstants are used and sometimes the assisstant is made out to be and incoent audience member we do not slate them. why should we slate criss if he uses stooges and such every now and then?

criss's style might not appeal to you but he's obviously doing something right to be as famous and well off as he is. like my thread about dynamo yay or nay, i picked out some bad things out about him, but he's met people like snoop dog and recently one of my fav actors will smith, he must be doing something right, but since then i have bought his dvd and i enjoy his style alot now .

when it boils down to it, we shouldn't dis people on their way of approaching and presenting magic. just because they don't bust a swet doing some hardcore card control doesn't mean they are fake.

i quite like criss. i thought his leveitation form building to building made GREAT TV, but if i saw it live, it would of probably been a different story, but am i bothered? nawh!

I suppose my argument is slightly hypocritical. I too ''fool'' people on a much smaller scale. I guess my comments should just lie with the fact that its his style I dont like.

To each his own; it's magic that binds us together.

Courtesy of www.magicweek.co.uk:

7.3.07
Criss Angel Mindfreak
9pm on Wednesday 7th March (30 minutes) on ITV4.
Burned Alive. "Self-styled extreme entertainer Criss Angel is on a quest to bring magic to the lives of his audience in a series of amazing feats that challenge the traditional concepts of magic and illusion. Here he confronts people's natural fear by literally playing with fire."

8.3.07
Las Vegas
8pm on Thursday 8th March (1 hour) on TV3.
Bold, Beautiful, and Blue. Series 3, episode 8. "A necklace with a priceless gemstone, the Star of Kashmir, is on show at the Montecito. Monica decides that it is not to be protected by bulletproof glass, since it's too beautiful. Monica shuts down the security system to secretly try on the sapphire, but when the cameras are turned on afterwards the sapphire is gone. Danny and Mike try to find the sapphire before show time, while Ed still does not want to come back. Meanwhile, magician Criss Angel roams the casino floor doing magic tricks."

8.3.07
Criss Angel Mindfreak
10pm on Thursday 8th March (30 minutes) on ITV4.
Levitation. "Self-styled extreme entertainer Criss Angel is on a quest to bring magic to the lives of his audience in a series of amazing feats that challenge the traditional concepts of magic and illusion. Here he demonstrates the art of levitation."

Yes, ID - you make a few nice points in your thread, but my problem stems from the fact that this (I feel unwarranted) attack on people like Criss Angel is almost never thrust upon someone like, say - Cyril Takayama.

Maybe because Cyril does not hire actors to get reaction like Criss did in Voodoo Doll trick and Walks Through Glass trick?

90% of Cyril's effects couldn't be replicated by the average magician due to expensive props - and yet he is the darling of the younger people involved in the arts. The argument should be all-encompassing - not just against the people you don't like. Bear in mind, ID - I'm not pointing you out as doing such things - I'm just making a point in the face of your comments.

I agree Cyrils often use props in his tricks but certainly not 90%. Many of his magic can be done without expensive props. In fact Cyril's magic has inspired many people(including Criss Angel)

Here are some examples:

Cyril's Сigarette trick
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0G9yENOSOQ
same trick by another person
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1uQelmhDak

Cyril's Airplane
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krLZX38BtDE
same trick by another person
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGKPUbZ2yKI

Cyril's Shadow Magic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ib4Xi7qj4bY
same trick by another person
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3HaeVyO45A

My respect for Criss Angel stems from the very roots you champion. He is an accomplished sleight of hand expert, as well as a world-class illusionist. I've seen his close up work and even without the big-budget effects, I've found him astonishing.

The only problem is that he rarely perform them. He is more focus on the unrealistic tricks which certainly do not inspire people.

Mandrake wrote:Courtesy of www.magicweek.co.uk:

7.3.07
Criss Angel Mindfreak
9pm on Wednesday 7th March (30 minutes) on ITV4.
Burned Alive. "Self-styled extreme entertainer Criss Angel is on a quest to bring magic to the lives of his audience in a series of amazing feats that challenge the traditional concepts of magic and illusion. Here he confronts people's natural fear by literally playing with fire."

8.3.07
Las Vegas
8pm on Thursday 8th March (1 hour) on TV3.
Bold, Beautiful, and Blue. Series 3, episode 8. "A necklace with a priceless gemstone, the Star of Kashmir, is on show at the Montecito. Monica decides that it is not to be protected by bulletproof glass, since it's too beautiful. Monica shuts down the security system to secretly try on the sapphire, but when the cameras are turned on afterwards the sapphire is gone. Danny and Mike try to find the sapphire before show time, while Ed still does not want to come back. Meanwhile, magician Criss Angel roams the casino floor doing magic tricks."

8.3.07
Criss Angel Mindfreak
10pm on Thursday 8th March (30 minutes) on ITV4.
Levitation. "Self-styled extreme entertainer Criss Angel is on a quest to bring magic to the lives of his audience in a series of amazing feats that challenge the traditional concepts of magic and illusion. Here he demonstrates the art of levitation."

I think magic week might have made a mistake since I checked the programme guide on sky and it said it was the building float and walking on water episodes which are series 2. Also what number is TV3 on?

OKBUN - you missed my point entirely. Yes, I exaggerated with the 90% - but my argument is valid. If people are going to blast Angel for using expensive set-ups and the like - Cyril HAS TO BE taken to task for being guilty of the same thing.

If you don't think any of Cyril's performances take place in heavily controlled environments - then I'm afraid very little of what I say will make a dent. If you think he's never used a stooge - then you're just not paying attention.

But that means little to me. I happen to enjoy Cyril's work.

Just as a bit of information - Cyril didn't create any of the effects you linked to. I feel that needs to be made clear.

I'm assuming that TV3 is ITV3 - I'll be checking the listings magazine tonight!

I thought the same but upon researching it on the net I found out that TV3 is a irish channel which shows itv and channel 4 shows. I went through all the channels on sky last night and found TV2 but couldn't find TV3. All these extra digital channels confuse me sometime.