talkmagic.co.uk

Most people won't read this thread

Most of the ones that do won't bother to follow this link http://www.antinomymagic.com/swiss.htm

Most of the ones that follow it won't bother to read it all because it will take a little bit of time.

Anyone that does read it will be very glad they did. If you're fortunate enough to be new to magic and have an open mind you might just be diverted from a thankless and expensive course. Take a look...

Did i read it? - Check

Did i follow the Link? - Check

Did i read it? - Double Check!

That is a very fantastic piece of work written there. Some of the stuff in there i read i started thinking to myself 'Thank god i read that'

I think it should be used as a guide for the beginners of magic

That is very interesting read. I didnt think I would read it all but I did some of the points he brings up are extrememly good ones. Some I don't agree with but others are very true.

Thanks for posting that up here, I wonder what Ellusionist has to say about it!

There's certainly a lot of bile in there!

I agree with the idea that Ellusionist is, shall we say, servicing a market of naive kids with deep pockets who want to achieve "cool" without any effort.

What I don't agree with is the idea that only the people mentioned are making a living from street magic. Derren Brown, for instance, has never been a street performer. He was a table worker nee hypnotist, and would have to take a break from putting together his TV series (another one of which starts next Friday), and from touring his award winning stage show to piddle about on the pavement for coins. And Mr Swiss doesn't seem to have heard of Dynamo who did, to the best of my knowledge, really did come up from the streets using magic as a way to avoid beatings.

I have never bought from Ellusionist as they appear to me to be aimed at the "yoof" market, the post-Blaine magic generation.
Although I don't doubt that some of the stuff they sell may be good, I prefer to source my material from older sources and update it.
If an effect can stand the test of time, surely it's a winner?

Aye you have to take it with a smidgeon of salt, like pretty much everything else, but all in all I agree. It's a pity most of the people who would benefit most from it will never read it, by the way mad props go out to Markdini for alerting me to it.

Maybe one of the mods could make a sticky with this link in for beginners to magic...All the beginners who join here would get a little better info on the whole area.

Very interesting article -- As you can see by the amount of posts i've made... I'm pretty new to the world of magic. I like to think of myself as slightly above that "post blaine era" youtube revealing pre-pubescent wannabe who will lose interest in the whole thing by next week...
...but I'm sure there are plenty of people on this forum who would lump me into such a category...

That being said-- I want to mention the whole ellusionist/brad christian thing from the article. It is clear to me why he drives so many magicians nuts. I understand that he is not the best magician- though he portrays himself as such. I know that he repackages and markets tricks into single-click downloads at 200% markup... and on and on...

BUT-- all those negative aspects aside-- those single click downloads allowed me to easily turn my interest into a hobby.

*no i never bought one... i looked around on limewire for a little while and downloaded a bunch for free... don't tell brad*

NOW- by no means is ellusionist my only resource. After learning the very basic principles he teaches... I went out and got books-- looked up information online.. joined this forum...

so I believe it's a great place for beginners to start. Big deal if he's ripping people off- everyone who is legitimately in the magic community knows that's NOT the place to go for accurate information, low prices, new tricks... etc.

Interesting read

Very true what is being said about ellusionist, a generation spawned on the back of amateur hobbyist David Blaine and not so talented Mr Christian's output of c*** (not the best)... ( I know, I bought them ) is not really going to make anyone really improve and succeed.

I started off with ellusionist last May. I knew about 10 effects before I stumbled accross this site in August. A month or so browsing before I joined here, I got a wealth of knowledge I have never come accross. So on came Bobo, Royal Road, Card College, Art of Astonishment, Banacheck, Annemman and Michael Ammar to some degree, and Im so much better off for it.

The information included in books as these or the DVD's of telented, recognised individuals is far superior.

Ellusionist never really taught me things like routining, stringing effects together.. didnt really go into detail about storylines... so you wind up starting off with '' pick a card '' or '' wanna see some magic ''

I would never start off like that now. Its all about getting into a conversation with people and the magic becomes part of that conversation, as if to demonstrate something you have been talking about so that the spectator by that point is emotionally involved.

Brads idea of getting a spec involved is simply having them insert their card into the deck

I only really buy things from Ellusionist due to CUPS but im really relishing the older material I am acquiring, the works of Dai Vernon, Alex Emsley, Erdnase andthe like. Thats where the real magic lies.

Very interesting reading, and a very good way to market a link with a long text. I guess you got a lot of people actually reading it.

So let me get this straight;

He sells a video which teaches the pass, but the in routine you learn, you actually show the spectators how to do the pass?

So what's the point in learning the pass then?

That's very good that...I even dripped mustard on my t-shirt whilst eating a sarnie and didn't notice.

That's a great article. I really do agree. In particular that about the recycling of tricks, i.e. getting an old effect that can be found in many classic magic books and selling it with a fancy instruction video for 30 pounds, when the book which contains 50 other effects would have cost 6.99 or whatever. But having said that, I agree about the rest as well. Thanks for posting it!

beeno wrote:So let me get this straight;

He sells a video which teaches the pass, but the in routine you learn, you actually show the spectators how to do the pass?

So what's the point in learning the pass then?

yes.. heactually TEACHES them how to do it, and explains that that is how a cardis controlled to the top... and for what? for a poxy move he calls the 'one handed pass'.. that , get this.. ISNT a pass!!

He claims that this one handed pass had magicians fooled worldwide.. bull..only the 12 yr old 'pupils' he offloads his c*** (not the best) to!!

This is I.D on his bad side...grrrr hes like a tiger