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If it wasnt for Mr Lewis i wouldnt be using the deck now. And after you shown al the cards to be all the same I have never seen some one or have some one go oi show me your cards. Another thing about Mr Lewis is that we share a first name too.

There is no stronger card trick than the svengali deck PROVIDING you show the cards to be all different and then all the same again! The people freak out when you do that!

I completely disagree!! And I am even talking about using the sengali deck correctly!!

First you show all cards are different. This can even be done by springing the cards from one hand to the other. When the cards are shown to be the same, it can be done extremely convincing by springing them accross the table so they fall down all face up accross the table with all cards being the same card. (the opposite display is possible with a "reversed" svengali deck).

From what you write it is not clear that this is how you perform the display with the svengali deck. It is NOT how beginners usually do it, however let us first clarify what we talk about. The springing display is in my view the correct handeling and is endeed quite magical.

However to suggest this is the strogest you can do with a deck of cards is simply NOT correct. It will often get a strong reaction, but strongest reaction is not always the same as strongest magic.

In fact a "reverse" svengali deck where the cards can be sprung accross the table and all cards very convincingly are displayed as different can be the precursor for much more magical effects. One spectator might select a card randomly and the other spectator stop at a card etc. And all handeling happens in the hand of the spectators!!

There are many other effects that also are stronger than displaying the cards as different and then displaying them as the same, but I do not wish to discuss them here.

I understand Soren's concern and I can assure him that it is quite wrong. However he is not MARK LEWIS and I am so the fact that he has it wrong is perfectly understandable.

Well, then I am in good company!! I am pretty sure that Dai Vernon on his revalations videos discuss this issue together with Gary Quellet, Steve Freeman and Michael Ammar and they all share the view I have stated. As far as I recall they all take the view that its a mistake to display all cards as the same. I might be wrong on the source, however there are more that 20 hours of videos so I am sorry I cannot be more specific with the reference.

Max Maven is essentially using a svengali deck in some of his efffects on his Mentalism DVDs/Videos. If Max Maven shortly after having performed an effect with the "Mind's Eye Deck" (Max Maven Vol 1) continue the display some of this decks svengali properties, not only would he be ruining an excellent mind reading effect, but also have reduced the magical level of the performance.

Of course if performing for a bunch of half drunk spectators in the local pub, it might get a stronger reaction if all cards are shown to be the same, however Max Maven is Max Maven and Mark Lewis is Mark Levis.

To show all cards being the different and then showing that they are all the same is in my view NOT the primary use of a svengali deck. If however one decides to go down the (dubious) route of doing this, it is important to least take the time and learn to do it the "professional way" springing the cards accross the table.

I don't know what you mean by "springing" the deck across the table. Do speak plainly, old chap. No point coming from Oxford if you do not speak Oxford English you know.

Of course you have a foreign name. That of course may have something to do with it.

As for Dai Vernon, I wasn't aware that he was yapping about the svengali deck on his videos but he is wrong nevertheless. He didn't work for laymen much and in any event he didn't know as much about the deck as I do. Since I have done it 50 times a day for 40 years I would think that would be patently obvious.

As for the other incompetents you mention they know as much about entertaining people as I do about the care and breeding of Japanese butterflies. At least Vernon had a personality. His cohorts on that video have the personality of dial tones.

As for Max Maven he is one of the worst performers I have ever seen in my life. Besides he made rude remarks about Her Majesty the Queen when performing recently in Toronto. Not cricket old chap.

I SPREAD the cards across the table, my boy. I do not "spring" them. If what you mean by "spring" you actually mean "spread" then you probably learned it from a source who learned it from ME. Nobody did it this way until I came along and told the world about it.

As for performing in "local pubs" in my capacity as a psychic reverend I do not approve of the devil's buttermilk and do not frequent establishments that provide that sort of thing. I therefore do not perform in public houses or other dens of depravity.

I can assure you that if Max Maven and any of the other incompetents you mention were to perform anything they like with the svengali deck for laymen and I were to follow with my routine where I show the cards to be all the same and all different repeatedly I will get a far stronger reaction than they will. I guarantee it.

As to the supposed disadvantage of them thinking you are using a trick deck it doesn't seem to have occured to you that you WANT them to think you are using a trick deck. I shall let you figure out why. You seem to like intellectual exercises.

datazing,

saying to your spectators, "as you can see this is just a normal deck of cards" simply draws attention to the fact they may not be. it's like doing a DL and saying "as you can see i only have one card here..." not a good idea. that's my opinion on this... i suggest one doesn't say that kind of thing. on the other hand, a Svengali is quite unique because part of the "trick" is, you DO have a trick deck... and now you "DONT", hang on... you do again...

talking specifically about Svengali, of course we do have a Svengali specialist amongst us so if you really do want to get the most from your Svengali deck, i would be doing some serious massaging of his ego since his knowledge on this subject appears tip top. Mark someone... his name escapes me at the moment but if i think of it i will let you know.

of course, he would never stoop to such commercial levels to mention his book... leave that to his friend Brad. but i would suggest you take a look at the link below just the same... may be helpful.

http://marklewisentertainment.com/html/magicians.html

I have been teasing Soren and in a rare fit of compassion I have decided not to any more. I did not realise he was from Denmark and one must be kind to foreigners. However this dispensation naturally cannot apply to Australians for obvious reasons.

However I still maintain my stand on the svengali deck. There are ways of overcoming the objections that magicians make about using them in the proper manner -that is showing them to be all different then all the same again.

You can of course do effects that don't do this and nobody is stopping you. In fact I have detailed a few in my wondrous book on the subject. And of course for these particular tricks you can't eventually show that there are many identical cards in the deck otherwise you will give the game away.

However these tricks are used in exceptional situations and for the most part if you are going to do that kind of stuff you may as well use a regular deck if you can.

Nevertheless the card changing effect is very strong indeed and NOTHING you can do with a svengali deck will top it. And you CAN have them examined. There are ways to do this. First and most obvious you can switch the deck. If you go this route you should encourage suspicion that it is a trick deck. I even say before commencing the routine "This is a trick deck of cards that I purchased from a magic shop".

After the switch (and there are several in my book) you continue a kind of svengali routine using double lifts, top changes and the hindu shuffle so that they still think you are using duplicate cards but can't figure out how they become normal again. Then leave the deck on the table and they will grab for them trying to figure out what is wrong with them. They will of course find nothing.

That is one way. Of course 95% of the time I don't even bother switching the deck. As a bright poster above noted nobody asks anyway to examine the cards unless you are performing in an impromptu unpaid situation. At trade shows for example I always use the svengali deck since it has almost been invented by God so that company sales messages can be tied in very easily. And I STILL use the line about it being a trick deck I purchased in a magic shop and I don't have them examined either.

Even if people think it is a trick deck they will still be mystified and not know how it works. Proof of this is the fact that svengali salesmen mystify people with it all the time and it is obvious that they are selling a trick deck otherwise why would they be behind a counter or pitch table?

Since my routine has obviously skilful and flourishy handling the audience will credit me rather than the deck for what is going on.

On the surprisingly rare occasion someone says that they have a deck like this at home you say "don't tell anyone" This will take the wind out of their sales and shut them up and the remark will pass over the heads of the audience. This will not be any problem for an experienced performer.

If you cannot be bothered switching the deck and someone asks to examine them you can actually let them do so. However you first say "I am going to make half the deck aces and half the deck normal by magic. Abracadabra. Now have a look for yourself." They can look to their hearts content and all they will find are loads of aces or whatever your key card actually is. They won't find the short cards because they won't be looking for them.

I do not recommend the above procedure in a formal paid performance because it slows the show. However for impromptu work there is no problem.

The effect is a knockout. Have a look at what Bill Nagler said on my website link that was posted from Australia. He did it for people in his office (presumably laymen) and they freaked out at the effect.

In my book I tell the story of how I used to show gangsters card tricks in a night club on a regular basis when they would come in. I finally ran out of tricks with a regular deck after a few months of constantly performing for them and in desperation showed them my svengali deck routine. They shouted and laughed with great glee and the club owner told me that the gangsters thought this was the best trick I had ever shown them.

Magicians have always underestimated the svengali deck and have looked down on it as a beginner's toy or merely for forcing purposes. Sometimes they are bright enough to use it for a specific effect that cannot be done with a regular deck and leave it's use at that.

My routine has changed all that and Ron Macmillan was right when he once said to me "magicians can do all that fancy stuff with a regular deck and yet there is nothing that will beat a svengali deck performed to laymen" And Ron was an expert on the svengali deck. He built his business on it in the early days and he used a routine where he showed the deck to be identical and then not.

I urge the young man from Denmark to actually try out my routine on LAYMEN before judging it. I once sold it years ago to a chap in Denmark named Bengt Bennson. He raved about it to me in a letter. I don't know what happened to this fellow and I have never been in touch with him since. It must have been about 30 years ago. Perhaps Soren knows of him.

It is a confidence thing, do yo find you hold a gimicked deck clocse to your chest or inwards a little? peole can pick up on these little subtle things subconsiously and without them knowing why they will think your using a "funny deck!"
Take for example, its a bold example, but if keep your hand closed when your doing a coin trick or any other, peoples minds and natural thinking will think you have something in it even if you dont.
So on a subtle level you may be giving off signals that you are affraid somone will realise your using a funny deck!

I guess its just one of those things that come with time practice and confiidence.

In the meantime id suggest learning a few tricks with a clean deck, with maybe one duplicate, a short card or some subtle things to help you!

good luck!

Me and my stupid brain completely forgot to PM Soren . So I'll just post a quick patter that I use (not the exact patter as I want you to make up some things on your own.

I show all the cards different and then have them pick their card.

I have them stick it right back from where they got it, square up the deck, showing my hand freely to be holding no breaks. I cut the deck 3 times and snap my fingers and then reveal their card on top (snapping of the fingers is very important as you will see later).

I do this 1-2 more times until I see that they have absolutely had enough with all of this (not that I get repetitive, but because they get sick of feeling stupid ). (Remember to always show the cards different BEFORE snapping).

Now I get into the MAIN part of the point of the svengali deck. I have them take their card from the top, I cut the deck, have them place it in the cut, and then close the deck and place it on the table. I state that there is no way at all that I can make their card rise to the top except by pure magic. I snap my fingers and reveal the top card to be their card. I now say that I did do this by pure magic and that me cutting the deck all of those times was just to fool you and that whenever I snap my fingers, I turn the whole deck into your card. I can now pull out your card from wherever (I then place their card back, cut the deck, reveal their card to be on top of the deck again, and do that one or two more times...NOT snapping my fingers). I then state that whenever I would like to show you however that all of the cards are in fact different, all I have to do is snap my fingers one more time....(I show the cards all different at this point). I then repeat that part of the trick a few times. and then either walk away if I am doing that as a stand alone (happened to me only once and that was just because of a lack of time do to any other tricks) or perform a quick deck switch or move put the deck away and move onto another trick that is not deck oriented only to return to a "clean" deck.

Hope that helped a little,
~David

Thanks for your explanation.... Also thanks to Mark Lewis for having decided to taking off his boxing gloves. Talking about boxing gloves, if someone should decide to do a card trick blindfolded, in a straight jacket and wearing boxing gloves I suggest that he use a svengali deck. It should be possible to utilise some of this decks key features even when tied up like that. I would however refrain from doing more serious stuff with a proper deck of cards.

More seriously, it is certainly possible to do some very strong effects using the svengali deck. However what you do have of course to fit and support the rest of your act. Some effects are definitely ruined by exposing the use of a gimmiced deck.

A mental effect where one spectator selects a card, another call out a number x (between 1-52) while a third spectator count x (or x+1) card down in a svengali deck is for example a somewhat slow, but very magical effect.
The effect is to slow and boring for my taste, but if presented with lit candles in the right mystical atmosphere, there is no doubt the such an effect - if done propertly - might touch people very deeply.

Now this hypothetical mental effect (i introduced for the sake of the argument) is not a very entertaining effect, however the effect is in my view MUCH MORE magical than some of the standard stuff most of us do for pure entertainment. The fast standard stuff gets fast and loud reactions, but this does not mean that it is more magical than the more serios and heavy stuff.

The slower but more serious magic might (if presented with skill and in an artistic fashion) create a much stronger long term reaction in people. I am sure - from the reviews it has got - that Mark Lewis's magic is first class and that it is both very high on magic and entertainment. I do however not believe that showing that all cards are the same creates the strongest magic possible with a svengali deck. I am sure it can create a great and loud responce from the spectators, but if people experience real magic they often stop laughing (we laugh when we feel superior) and begin to shiver instead (we shiver when we feel treatened)!

Anyway I am looking forward to reading Mark's book. It got incredible good reviews from magicians I think very highly of.....

In Toronto where I live there is utterly no need to make people "shiver". It is so cold here in the winter that people shiver automatically. I therefore am quite happy to make them laugh and gasp instead. As they will if you show the deck to be identical and then no longer identical. And they can examine them too if you believe in that sort of thing. I want the reaction NOW not at some mystical point in the future when I will probably be dead anyway.

It is true that "after the show" talk is very powerful and I encourage that as well. However I use other material for that such as Out of This World which tends to get stunned silence while what they have just witnessed fully sinks in. Naturally I use a regular deck for that although I once invented a trick deck based on the svengali that did the same thing.

One of the advantages of getting them to laugh and gasp out loud instead of "shivering" is that it sets up a chain reaction and everything you do from that point will get this laughing and gasping response. You just need to get it started. It is like getting a boxer on the ropes. You pummell him and then you capitalise on it by pummelling him more.

Get that initial laughter, gasping and everyone saying how fantastic you are and then keep up the pressure. You need to get that chain reaction going. The trouble is with making people "shiver" is that you may tend to put them to sleep as well. Mentalists are somewhat prone to this.

Let me tell you a story about the svengali deck which I recited in my wondrous book. It will illustrate the power of showing the deck to be all the same and then all different again.

Years ago I had a rather odd fan base of various hoodlums and gangsters who frequented various London nightclubs that I performed at. They used to invite me to their table and I would do card tricks for them. They used to discuss quite openly in front of me who they had shot that week and which bank they had robbed along with which cops they had bribed to ignore all their wickedness.

Officers from Scotland Yard would come in and sit in one corner of the room and the gangsters would sit in the other corner each group being aware of the other. I didn't feel comfortable sitting with all these wicked people especially with the scrutiny from the other corner. And in addition to all this I didn't want to know particularly who their next murder victim was going to be. However they were a very good audience so I put up with it.

After several months of this I ran out of card tricks and tried not to show them any more but they were very insistent. I happened to have a svengali deck with me but was reluctant to show it to them for the very same reasons that Soren outlined. I couldn't have been more wrong. I was forced into performing the routine and it created a sensation! It got stronger reaction than all the tricks I had shown them in the preceding few months. The shouts that came up when all the cards changed was tremendous! It attracted a lot of attention from the other tables including the Scotland Yard one.

Afterwards the night club owner told me that the "boys" informed him that the svengali deck routine was the best thing I had ever shown them. This was 40 years ago and it is exactly the same routine described in my wondrous book.

Nobody "shivered" They just reacted. I don't think any performer doing a "shivering" trick would have had half the reaction I got just by making the deck change.

Mind you it has to be part of a professional routine and you have to know what you are doing. No good just taking the deck out of your pocket and then only making the cards change. It has to be a bit more sophisticated than that.

The svengali deck is underestimated by magicians and since they don't have experience in getting audiences to react they will tend to say as if in a pre ordained mantra "you must NEVER show the deck to be all the same". They are WRONG. They haven't tried it so they don't know. Pure myth. Try it my way and see.

Can this be left completely dirty...

Rather than trying to show the deck clean at the end of a routine has/does anyone swapped in a 1xforce deck?

I like the idea of "Well you had no chance at all as all the cards were Ace of Hearts" (even though they have clearly seen them to be indifferent)

...and now they are... and CAN be inspected.

or maybe the 9 of clubs... just for a "where did all the aces go?" angle

The only gimmicked decks I use are the Haunted and ID and occasionally gimmcked cards. (fakes)
In the main though, I use normal cards and what I find best is to do a few with these which allow the spec to have them in their hands or shuffle, etc and effects where I run through the cards in front of them so they can actually SEE they are normal cards.
After all this I place the deck in my pocket and say: "Actually, I'll show you one more..." and out comes the ID which looks just like the same pack of blue Bikes they have just handled and seen close up.
Using effects where they handle or look at the deck is practically letting them examine it without making it obvious, so, if by the odd chance (which I've never had) they ask if they are normal cards you can state that of course they are as they have held them, looked through them etc for the last half hour.

It's probably best to practice these gimmicked tricks at home in front of a mirror to gain confidence. Once that's built up, it will shine through in your performances and no one will question your awesome powers as a card magician.

I always respond, "Oh! So you're one of thoooose people! Are you now going to point out that there is no such thing as REAL magic? Yes, you're right, it's just a trick, you're very smart. I bet you were the kid that ran around in kindergarten trying to convince everyone there was no Santa Claus until you made the other kids cry. Tell me, do you ever get tired of outsmarting yourself out of everything fun and wonderful in life? Isn't there a church or synagoge somewhere you could be outside heckling"

::awkward silence::

"So, are you going to show me the cards?"

"NO!!!!"

I find that in the case of people who are extremely persistent in rifling through your deck, a nice "Go f*** yourself" is pretty effective.

I always try to start and finish my routines clean, introduce and get rid of any gimmickes during the routine. People are most likely to ask to see the cards either right at the start or right at the end of a routine, if you're clean at these points then you've got nothing to worry about.

A lot comes down to your handling of the specs, appear open, friendly, fair and honest and you'll very rarely have anyone asking to see the cards. Act secretive and appear to be hiding something and you're more likely to get the problem.