talkmagic.co.uk

Thankyou all very much for your replies and your efforts.
as for my attitude well I'm truly sorry If I have offended anyone.
Everything that has been written has been very informative. To all those that answered my questions thankyou very much, especiallt ID you have been most helpfull.
But I still have not got to the crux of my question.
The question is, and this is how I should have put it right at the beginning of this post.

Should I leave a group if it is only one person who is the problem.
If the answer is no then how do I deal with the more tricky heckler without offending him or making him feel stupid.

thanks.

P.S Michael Jay, sorry dude I git a little carried away. Thanks for making the effort. The reason I got so annoyed is that is seems to me like you have highlighted all the problems (which is good) but not offered any advice on how to rectify them.

Soho wrote:But I still have not got to the crux of my question.
The question is, and this is how I should have put it right at the beginning of this post.

Let me re-phrase my initial post because it seems to be invisible in its current form.

Let the guy see you're not a threat before you do anything else.

what tomo said...

you could also make him the focus of attention, do something that makes him the utter star of that effect...nothing to do with you...something he can later call bragging rights over...

"oh yeah...dont forget i did a,b or c..."

Out of This World is always a killer effect, and its practically hands off for you, plenty of tension and "moments"...if you havent got that, research and find it...

Tomo, I'm not sure how i missed that bit of advice but that's exactly what I was looking for. Isn't it weird after hearing the answer to the question it seems so obvious and yet I had never thought of that. thankyou very much.

...without magicians the world would be a sad place. There woudl be one less avenue for our imagination to be channeled into. One less avenue for laughter, release, tension, suspence, fear, happiness, berwilderment and many other feelings.
Without magicians those childhood memories of a coin being produced from behind your ear. (If you don't have one of those I feel sorry for you.) We would not have that one last wonder. Everyone knows how telly works, knows how the phone and internet works, knows how to paint, but they do not know how to do magic, people don't just hate magic they hate it for a reason, one which stems back, perhaps most likley, they do not like the unexplained. Magic is one of the great questions which will continue to evolve and challenge the imaginations of theose who are magicians thoes who are'nt those who are interested and those who are not.
So I think magicians are important.

Well, that's a very romantic way of looking at it. Now, if you'll kindly step into the real world for just a moment...

I didn't say that magicians weren't important. There is certainly a time and a place for everything under the sun. What I said is that in the general scheme of things that magicians don't amount to a hill of beans. Doctors are necessary, undertakers are necessary, garbage men are necessary - magicians are not. Learn to see yourself as part of the cosmos, rather than being the center of them.

Last night I was performing at an oopening night for a new pizza express in Southampton (Very Posh) and I was most definatley on form.

See, I do what's called "reading between the lines." What I read, in this opening statement of yours, is that you were paid to be there and that, being opening night, the place was probably quite busy. I further assume that the place was packed in your opening by statements like: "This set the whole room up in expectancy and the applause just kept getting louder and the reactions more exaggerated which is great."

You need to learn to read between the lines, too. My post was rife with very important ideas. Unfortunately, you took it at face value - you read it, but you didn't digest it.

A small appology because I believe that I did not make myself clear. The group wants to be entertained, they want to see my magic with excited yeses and clapping and jumping up and down. Exept the one boyfriend.

But that isn't what you said. I was going by your original statement, which specifically was: "This had an effect on the whole group and soon they were all turning hostile toward me."

They were ALL turning hostile against you. All.

Time to walk away, whether you like it or not. All you're doing at this point is alienating these people, you are NOT entertaining them.

Did you ever stop to consider that when these people went to that pizza joint, they went to enjoy each other's company and no other reason? Well, other than to eat? They didn't call and ask if there was a magician on staff, they just wanted to eat.

And here you come along and decide that they are going to see some magic. It doesn't matter what THEY want, you are going to show them some magic whether they like it or not. You are the center of the cosmos and they are there for your entertainment.

Here's the bad news...

In their world, you don't exist. Their world is the center of the universe to them.

If the entire group is enjoying my magic and then he starts to screw it up, why shouldn't he be the one to leave. Why should he be the one to ruin all of the spectators fun by making me leave? Surley majority rules.

First, this isn't a democracy - it is a group of people that went out to eat and had magic thrust upon them.

Second, you are the one who screwed it up for him, not vice-versa. He went out to eat with his friends and some geek came along to do something that he found tastless. And, he didn't ruin ALL the spectator's fun, he maybe ruined three peoples fun - there is a room filled with other people who will be more receptive to your act. That is where you belong, not bothering folks who don't want to see your magic.

And, you know what? Those folks ain't going to die because they didn't get to see you make a card jump to the top of your deck. They ain't losing sleep tonight over it. It meant nothing then and it means nothing now. Do you think that they are sitting alone in the dark, rocking back and forth, saying to themselves, "I didn't get to see the magician, I didn't get to see the magician, I didn't get to see the magician?"

Those people forgot about you 10 seconds after you left. If they never see another magician as long as they live, they won't have lost a thing. Not a thing. But if their local garbage service quit serving them, they'd notice it in less than a week. Especially in the summer time.

I feel in a win lose situation because he has confronted me in an open and unwelcoming manner. His goal now is to see me off. Now when I am entertaining a group who is wanting me to entertain them, such as the group in question then surley you can see that I am losing the satisfaction of getting them to smile and laugh. the opportuninty to try that new trick out, the opportunity top try and show that one difficult person that magic is just som harmless fun.

If he was unwelcoming, then you were NOT welcomed. Again, they didn't come to see the magician, they came to eat. You have no right to thrust yourself upon them. No right. Wonder why they don't like magicians? Maybe it's because magicians think that they have some God given right to show them magic, whether they want it or not.

As far as trying your new stuff out, etc., you have an entire room full of people. Read that again - an entire room full of people. You've not lost your opportunity to do those things. You just became obsessed with forcing your magic on that one group and look what it got you.

They did NOT go to a pizza joint to see a magician. I just can't say this enough times, because you don't quite seem to pick up that fact.

Regarding "ASFer" well, Rob Laughter used the term and I immediately posted with "ASFer?" A question. I have no idea what it is, that's why I questioned it.

Anyway, not everyone wants to see magic. That's life. Get over it.

Mike.

Perfect example of precisely what I'm talking about:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2YkGaBWE2c&NR

Soho wrote:Tomo, I'm not sure how i missed that bit of advice but that's exactly what I was looking for. Isn't it weird after hearing the answer to the question it seems so obvious and yet I had never thought of that. thankyou very much.

No problem. I love performing for very beautiful women, but the more beautiful they are the larger and more Neanterthal the bloke stood next to them always seems to be.

Always the case. I remember this one beefy bloke was getting mad because his girl was really getting off on the magic.

He kept asking me to do holy moly again as that was the one that really blew him and I knew he was looking for a way to catch me out. Of course I kept making excuses for not being able to repeat it. He got quite agressive in the end ( verbally ) so I asked him to come with me to the bar to get some drinks. When we got there I told him I dont normally repeat effects but I would on this occasion as he seemed so keen. I also told him I have shown this version of the same effect to precious few people. So I did the complicated handling of holy moly, a different effect entirely ( and obviously so I didnt have to place anything in his hands.. obviously he would have 'pre-looked' ) and I guess it made him feel special as he witnessed something I wouldnt show to anyone else.

From that moment on, he was very enthusiastic and sang my praises for the rest of the performance.

I think i mentioned before on here once i think i must of done magic with someone, only to upset their other half (who i did't know existed) and the got beaten up outside.. could of been for other reasons though haha

I've found that there's another really good way to become accepted by someone who is otherwise making things difficult for you. If after a few tricks there is one guy who keeps giving you a hard time, but the rest of the group is having fun, simply say: "I can tell that [spec's name] isn't having much fun, so I'll leave". If everyone else is enjoying themselves, you'll get them saying to the trouble maker things like "Now see what you've done! Why do you have to be like that?" and those kinds of things. That way the difficult spec will allow you to come back because you have been able to put pressure on him to be quiet.