talkmagic.co.uk

karl wrote:I my new topic, I just want to hear poeple about this new idea, and I very clear say at the begining of my note, that I dont what this to look as an advertise
http://www.talkmagic.co.uk/ftopic21155.php

so what exactly does it look like then? seriously, people who apologise before doing something they perhaps shouldn't do are worse than people who just DO IT!

"I'm sorry to say this, I dont mean to be rude, don't take this the wrong way but..."

having working pros here is a wonderful thing. we can learn so much from people who REALLY work magic. I hope Karl re considers, but whatever his issues, I hope he can lighten up a little, Freddie's comments weren't that big a deal.

themagicwand wrote:My twopence worth (not that it's worth anything, but anyhoo)...
Reading between the lines, Karl (never heard of him personally) came on here to promote himself and his products. It didn't quite work out how he'd imagined it would, so he got a strop on and has left in a huff. End of. Oh well. No loss.

Karl was kind enough to send me a private email this evening explaining to me how world renowned he actually is. I hereby stand corrected and will know better in future.

Young people with an attitude like that you take as just a phase and the first flush of over confident exitement. But someone of Karl's age...

I still feel he was far more immature and insulting to me than I was to him and if something someone said offended me deeply I would PM them and say so. Not that anything offends me.

This is a good forum with some great minds on here. Many of us have things to promote, including myself, but choose not to. Those that have good products pay for advertising as it's the done thing.

Surely if you were that world famous, you wouldn't have to tell anyone you were famous?
Surely famous, by the very nature of the word, means that you are well known, yet few had heard of him till he came bursting onto this forum with his block-capitalled, self-congratulatory, ill-advised attempt at PR.

I couldn't imagine Blaine, Brown, Daniels or the ghost of Harlan Tarbell behaving in such a way and if your products are good then people will talk about them for you. There are people on here that have written some great books and created some great effects and additions to the world of magic, but they don't have to write their own reviews, paying customers have done that.

Yes, my sense of humour can be strange sometimes, particularly to those from overseas, but that's how I am and I never set out to deliberately offend anyone. I had the decency to apologise to the chap and say we got off on the wrong foot after he posted a thread insulting me, so overpriced watch effects or not, I'm more civil than he is. My offer of a handshake was spurned and he just degenerated into petty, vulgar insults which I won't lower myself to respond to.

The fact I saw through his veneer of "advice" and realised that he came here intending to get some free advertising for his products and said so is really what rattled his cage. It may well be him advertising the designer shoes for all I know, same tactics.

If someone is professional it doesn't mean that any foul behaviour should be tolerated. It shocked me how so many people lined up to lick his boots just because he's produced a few effects and comes up on a Google search. These people should be ashamed of themselves.

You very well know that i have bein constantly harras by this LORD (?) guy for days.
I will appreciate if you can place a note in the forum concerning this mat

I was asked to post this by e-mail so am doing so, I'm not taking any sides on this one as there has been miscomunication on both sides.

I just recv'd an email from Karl to the address on my web site... Karl sent me details of a PM between him and Paul Bell (I hv no idea why) AND he sent me 7 MB of attachments...

Clearly, like so many people who say "they're" leaving... he hasn't left and remains sniffing around trying to get the attention of those who'll bite.

Karl, PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME ANYMORE PERSONAL EMAILS, PARTICULARLY WITH ATTACHMENTS. IF YOU CHOOSE TO LEAVE TALK MAGIC, THEN GO IN PEACE. IF YOU CHOOSE TO STAY, THEN I HOPE YOU ENJOY YOUR STAY AND THANKS IN ADVANCE FOR ANY CONTRIBUTION YOU MAKE... BUT PLEASE DONT DISCUSS YOUR DEPARTURE FOR MONTHS... JUST DO IT.

What is Karl's stage name? Anybody know?

It really is Karl Bravosky - as far as we know. That's the name used in many of the links he's sent and also on the Hank Lee site where his watch is/was on sale.

I shall have to check him out. There is no need for him to send me attachments however.

I am very wary of jumping all over him since a similar situation erupted in a similar group. Anton Zellmann was innocently and quietly making suggestions and people were jumping up and down in great indignation over things that weren't in the slightest bit offensive. Their egos couldn't take what he was saying even though he was being perfectly polite. When I pointed out to everyone that this was a legendary trade show magician and mentalist who once signed a million dollar trade show contract it made no difference and they continued to harangue him just because he was telling them how to increase their fees. They had never heard of Anton and this is often the case with successful professional performers who don't have the time to go to magic clubs or conventions.

I am not saying Karl is in the same league. He may be or he may not be. I am merely saying we should think before we speak just in case he is.

The problem seems to be that Karl is considered by many to be using the forum to advertise his wares, which is contrary to TM policy (rule number 2, in fact).

He's also been quite nasty in some of his responses, and has apparently bombarded certain forum members with e-mails and forwarded private messages.

That's a world away from an experienced magician being told he doesn't know anything about how to increase your income from performing.

If Paul Daniels came on here and posted lots of threads promoting himself and his products, in capitals, would that be OK, just because he's a famous magician? I am, however, pretty sure that Mr Daniels would try to observe the forum's rules.

themagicwand wrote:Karl was kind enough to send me a private email this evening explaining to me how world renowned he actually is. I hereby stand corrected and will know better in future.

Karl also very kindly followed up this email with another email listing various products of his that he thought I might like to purchase. Sadly they are out of my price range, but I do thank Karl for introducing me to the impressive range of goods that he currently has for sale.