talkmagic.co.uk

Hi everyone, since alot of people noticed my old retention vanish wasn't very well done (it doesn't look like when you really put a ball in the hand) I studied Jay Noblezana's retention vanish in the DVD SPONGE.

I think it's much better. I used the 2 different retention vanishes in this video for comparision. I'm still practicing it and I need to get the timing down better (Timing meaning the fingers 'scoop' the ball away about halfway as the fingers are closing around it so it's not shown)

Tell me what you think.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vMK71QcR7o

you at work ??

2nd one was better

FRK wrote:you at work ??

2nd one was better

Naw, not at work. Just my house

Wow, the people here are nice compared elsewhere...

..Here's what a magician told me on another forum:

"Wow I didn't even direct that at your performance. I was advising you about a habit many beginners get into. Here is some more free advice. Whis is what you are asking for right? FREE advice? Us to teach you for NOTHING?

Grow a thicker skin!

Oh and also while we are "helpnig for nothing", would you rather I was just saying things like "Yep looked great really impressive" when it is not that at all? Would you rather find out on a message board that your hands look in the first video almost as if you develop instant polio?

Or is this a lesson you would be more comfortable learning in front of some people while you are doing the routine poorly and they say something like, "It is in your other hand", "You never put it in the hand."?

The "blinker" advice is the best advice you will get belive me. Just learn how to take advice with a bit more of a thick skin.

Sorry but I don't give the truth with novicane.
"

2nd one without a doubt It was smoother and decieving.

Trickyfied wrote:2nd one without a doubt It was smoother and decieving.

Wow, so it IS better! Thank you so much Trickyfied!
I want to become a professional at sponges, that is my dream. The second vanish uses Jay Noblezana's retention vanish from the DVD called SPONGE. Great stuff there, but it's mainly for beginners. I really want to become good with sponges.

All I have to do now is keep practicing it and practice on my timing. (Stealing the ball as the other fingers are closing about halfway)

Thanks again
best regards
kevin

Yeah, again, have to go with the second one. It just seems more natural.

im definitely no expert at sponge magic but the second one was a lot more natural and more convincing though the first one was good, it looked as if something was going on and if i knew you were going to do a retention id spot out the first one but surely u havent been caught by a layman doing the first have you?

Now that you're working on the mechanics, Kevin, you also need to focus on presentation. The two are not exclusive; you can't have one without the other.

Going back to the original routine you posted, another suggestion I have that I didn't think about at the time would be to create a logical disconnect between the first ball vanishing, then re-appearing in the other hand. Especially on YouTube, you can rewind and punk 12-year-olds can watch over and over to see what happened and when it happened.

Derren Brown, I believe, has a great example in his book. Picture this:

You pick up a coin from the table, put it in your hand, and it disappears. The audience is invited to think, "well, he never really put it in his hand."

Or...

You pick up a coin from the table, gesture with it, then put it in your hand and it disappears. A little stronger--they're more likely to be convinced the coin was there.

Or...

You pick up a coin from the table, gesture with it, and put it in your hand. A little bit of drama and you open your hand to reveal... that it's still there. Something went wrong. You set the coin down and pick up another one from the table, gesture with it, then put it in your hand--exactly the same way. A little more drama and you open your hand to reveal an empty palm. Shocking.

-------------------------------

So the logical disconnect in this case is the first "mistake." When you mimic the actions you took the first time, the audience is now conditioned to believe the coin is indeed in your palm. It's really sitting happily in your servante. Also, gesturing with a coin that's really not even there can be stronger than you think. You pretend to show it briskly but casually at your fingertips, then place the non-existent coin in your hand before showing the hand that picked up the coin empty. The "magic" is done, but to the audience, it hasn't started. They still think there's a coin in your hand.

It's important to look at things from an audience's perspective. As I've told you on AIM, it's easy to become deluded in your own greatness. You're watching that video thinking, "wow, my retention vanish really has gotten better." The audience doesn't care how good your retention vanish is. They just see those right-hand fingers twitch a little bit and think, "what just happened there?" They rewind your YouTube video and say, "Would you look at that? He didn't really put the ball there after all."

So think about it: how can you apply the coin anecdote to your sponge ball routine? I'm interested in reading your reply

Ciao,
Rob

Personally I thought they were both fine. As long as you can do a reasonable vanish (& you do) you can then build a routine. Sponge ball magic is really more about about timing, misdirection & entertainment.

I think my sponge ball vanishes are probably worse than yours but the routine I do gets one of the strongest reactions, with gasps, laughter & oohs & ahhs (especially from the women). As long as you hold your empty hand like it's holding something, look at it, tap it, point to it & believe yourself that there is a ball there and get your timing right it will be no problem.....but build yourself a routine (I use a variation on the one in Mark Wilson's complete course)

Kevin Cann wrote:I think my ball vanishes are probably worse than yours but the routine I do gets one of the strongest reactions, with gasps, laughter & oohs & ahhs (especially from the women). As long as you hold your empty hand like it's holding something, look at it, tap it, point to it & believe yourself that there is a ball there and get your timing right it will be no problem.....but build yourself a routine (I use a variation on the one in Mark Wilson's complete course)

straight to the innuendo bingo thread

Beard, How many times do we have to tell you - you can't misquote people and post it on the innuendo bingo thread. It simply isnt done.

You can't just make it look like "My balls have vanished". Tut tut Beard, You should know better.

The second was very good and completely worked for me. To me it look better than the ones performed by Jay on his ear-plug DVI (but I suppose he is not a sponge ball specialist). I would very much like to include sponge balls on my repertoire. Maybe you can provide us with more details of your views of various sponge balls DVDs available on the market. It would be nice to hear the opinion from a (future) specialist.

There is a DVD put out by the IMS (Tony Hassini), which includes Gary Darwin's Retention Vanishes. Gary really goes through all the mechanics of a great retention vanish. He covers Sponge Balls, Thimbles, Cigarettes and other objects. You might be able to search one of these out at your favorite auction site.

I liked the second vanish best...there is more openess than the first vanish. Keep practicing, it will pay off!

Um, I am gonna look like an idiot if I say I didn't see a difference between them? I also thought the handling was rough on both.