talkmagic.co.uk

There has been much debate recently (even on another TM thread) about the lack of a Welsh flag on the Union Jack. I was much taken aback by this as for years I had believed that the red cross (corner to corner not St. George's) on the white background part of the Union Jack was the Welsh flag (or at least one of their many). However it seems I am wrong.

So if that is the case, who on earth does that red corner to corner cross belong to? Some other country that is part of the union that we haven't heard of? Or is it something silly like the Channel Isles?

Personally I think the Union Jack would look rather splendid with a dragon air brushed onto it.

My thoughts on Wales are this: the only time I've had a non-paying gig (ie ripped off) was in Merthyr Tidyfil (or however it's spelt). However I have had a vision (and being psychic this happens a lot) that one day I will live in Monmouth which I believe is just over the border. Lovely part of the world, and living on the South Yorkshire/Derbyshire border I know all about lovely countryside. I've developed from a city living scooter riding soul boy into an occultist sheep worrier. That's what growing old will do to a man.

Derbyshire should have a flag, I hate that county I have my reasons. Should flattend in to a giant Tesco. All though up by the Tesco roundabout is a massive tescos. OOO psychic dini.

i went out very briefly with a girl from wrexham...never again...

i say, abolish the union jack...cos basically, we aint united...

the welsh burn down our houses and threaten the estate agents (good on 'em)

the scots just down right despise us, and cheer whoever we play in the football to beat us...

the irish..well...where do i start that political hot potato (no pun intended)

and when we were united, it was cos king whoever, had a bigger army than the other big girls blouses...

that would be my history book in fact...one pager straight from Lulu.com...pm for details!

i think the red bit you're talking about good sir, was some tommy sauce spilt on it when it went to the printers and nobody spotted it on the proofs..

The red bit for thoses who dont Know is Northern Ireland.

Did you know that "Wales" is actually anglo-saxon for "England"? True story. When the Anglo-Saxons drove the real original Englishmen out of England, they moved west into Wales. So the Welsh are really the only true ancestors of the English. Those who these days call themselves English are in fact Anglo-Saxon immigrants (and illegal ones at that). One wonders what the fascist boot boys make of this.

The Irish and the British have identical DNA profiles which shows how we are basically the same interbred race. Someone born in London has as much Irish in him as someone born in Dublin. Or something.

Being a child of the Raj it is not my concern.

themagicwand wrote:Personally I think the Union Jack would look rather splendid with a dragon air brushed onto it.

Much as I like dragons, I don't see it. Four dragon's feet stuck together, however, make quite a nice cross.



(Took a bit of work, but it was fun. Would quite like to see alternative designs.)

Careful Adrian, those dragon's feet are starting to look like something else...



Granted - not originally intended as a bad sign, but not very popular nowadays.

Ha ha that made me laugh Mr Magicwand, as I am originally from Merthyr Tydfil and it really does not surprise me that you didn't get paid!
Where abouts was your gig?

The UK flag consists of three elements: the cross of St. George (red on white) for England, the cross of St. Andrew (white diagonal on blue) for Scotland, and the so-called cross of St. Patrick (red diagonal on white) for Ireland. The original Union Jack/Union Flag adopted in 1606 was symmetrical: the red cross of St. George outlined in white overlaid on top of a St. Andrew's flag, which was blue with a white X.

Hope this helps?

If I remember my King Arthur crazy history teacher right he told me that Welsh comes from an Anglo Saxon word, which the Saxons used as an insult to the Britons, meaning foreigners (or something like that).

And the Welsh for English, Saesneg comes from some similar insult in Welsh or whatever language the Britons spoke then.

Demitri wrote:Careful Adrian, those dragon's feet are starting to look like something else...



Granted - not originally intended as a bad sign, but not very popular nowadays.

I agree there.

"No law has ever been passed making the Union Flag the national flag of the United Kingdom; rather it has become one through usage.Wales had no explicit recognition in the Union Flag because Wales,
having been annexed by Edward I of England in 1282 and following the Laws in Wales Acts 1535–1542, was legally part of the Kingdom of England and was therefore represented by the flag of England"

Wrexham’s Labour MP Ian Lucas said, on 27 November 2007 in a House of Commons debate that the Union Flag should be combined with the Welsh flag to reflect Wales’ status within the UK, and that the Red Dragon should be added to the Union Flag's red, white and blue pattern [13]. He said the Union Flag currently only represented the other three UK nations, and Culture Minister Margaret Hodge conceded that Mr Lucas had raised a valid point for debate. She said "the Government is keen to make the Union flag a positive symbol of Britishness reflecting the diversity of our country today and encouraging people to take pride in our flag". This development sparked design contests with more or less serious entries from all over the world; some of the entries incorporated red dragons

Wilkepedia.org

I have often wondered, when a welsh soldiers coffin is draped with the Union Flag - How do the Family feel about that?
Always scared to ask!!!

If the weslh flag was in the Union flag then they would only moan. I am all for giving them full indipenece meaning :

Controled boarders
Welsh will need visas to come to the uk
Self funding no more money from the rest of the uk

Same with Scotland let them places really run them seleves, None of this oh we want to run our country keep your English nose out of it, But could you please send us a few quid.

Markdini wrote:
Same with Scotland let them places really run them seleves, None of this oh we want to run our country keep your English nose out of it, But could you please send us a few quid.

Lmfao ^

themagicwand wrote:Being a child of the Raj it is not my concern.

Obviously with a surname like Morgan I have some Welsh ancestry, however it has only been traced as far west as Shropshire. On my mother's side I come from the remote Scottish Highlands. I could be more specific in both cases.

It is alleged by a dead person that my father's father's father's father's father's father (Samuel Morgan, 1766-1850) was Candlemaker to King William IV. However, we only have one of his great grandsons' word for it, and personally I've always suspected that the needs of a palace would be served by many candlemakers, each one of whom might be described metaphorically as Candlemaker to the King. Interestingly, William reigned for only seven years (1830-1837), and in 1834, mass production of candles was invented by a Joseph Morgan. No relation, however.

Obviously a candlemaker to a mere king is not as good as someone who makes candles as part of the props belonging to some grand illusionist.

Coming from across the water from you guys I can also confirm that the red diagonal cross is indeed Ireland. This was when Ireland was united and part of the UK.

Whenever Ireland was divided the original flag was scrapped to be replaced by the Tri-colour for the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland adopted a new design not unlike todays England flag.