talkmagic.co.uk

I spent a while working up a nice trick with a new sealed deck, multiple shuffles and some snappy patter to link it all together. It ends by showing that the deck is still in original order, thanks to the shuffles all being false - all very nice. However the problem is that basically I've now shown the spec that I can do loads of false shuffles. So the next trick I do that involves a shuffle "to mix the cards up" - they aren't going to believe it! Fatal flaw?

I think it really depends on your personality and presentation for instance if you are doing gambling demonstratons it would work in nice. It just depends on who you are and what you claim to do really IMO.

I'm currently working on a card cheat table routine, for which I've recieved lots of helpful advice here, but in it there are several false cuts and shuffles/controls etc. If you do a routine like that and pose it as you teaching someone somethings to watch for when say playing poker with a magician or something you should be ok but my advice would be do any tricks not for this routine before you pull out the sealed deck and then show off all your control stuff.

One way of convincing a spectator that you are really shuffling the deck is to use the out faro shuffle sequence from a deck in numerical order. About 5 shuffles through the faro sequence and the deck looks really well mixed. Show this to the spectator(s) face up as truly being shuffled, do 3 more out faros and you are back to numerical order.

This will cover your concern about spectators thinking the deck was never shuffled/not believing the deck is shuffled in your next effect.

Alternatively, if the next effect you intend to perform doesn't require you to retain any order/specific cards, why not let a spectator shuffle the deck?

Hope this helps

Bill Malone did this on TV special years ago...he started out with new deck order, shuffled, showed it to still be in new deck order....got a respsonse...and proceeded to move into the actual effect for his segment.

The key in my opinion (as it relates to your question anyway) was, that the effect that followed the display of card control was not something that involved having the spec take a card, having it returned to the deck and then having it found or revealed...doing so eliminated anyones interest in wanting to shuffle the cards for him, or using his card control abilities as an explanation for the solution to the effect.

It really depends on who you are doing the shuffling display for, in what type of setting, how you intend to follow it up, and if you are prepared to follow it up with an effect that actually allows them to shuffle....this could be a great case of using a crimp card or short card and allowing them to shuffle....still producing the desired effect and saying "see it really wasn't me that did the funny work, it must have been the cards" type of idea.

Good points - thanks guys.

flaw07 wrote:do any tricks not for this routine before you pull out the sealed deck and then show off all your control stuff.

That's a good idea.

Mikehosker wrote:Alternatively, if the next effect you intend to perform doesn't require you to retain any order/specific cards, why not let a spectator shuffle the deck?

As is that.

Remember, you don't want to point out that your shuffling is dodgy. It's not your card skill that has kept them in order - something magical has happened to reorder the cards! So you could just go on and shuffle the deck normally after the effect, chat along and move into another trick. Be brazen.

Your next effect could be a do-as-I-do type thing (which lets you bring out another pack of cards - yet more misdirection).

Yes, I guess I've made a classic mistake - because I know how the trick works I assume the specs do too. In reality some of them will be thinking the cards are back in order because of "magic powers", rather than because they've closely analysed my false shuffle technique.

It's not somthing that I'd want to do if I'm brutally honest. Of course it's all going to depend on how you present it but I just think it sounds very show offy and not all that entertaining. You're just saying to the audience look how clever I am with all my fancy, trick shuffling. It might work but I think that it needs more than just a simple, I shuffle the cards and they're still in the same order as they were before. You're also going to have to be very careful with any trick that yoiu follow this up with, because you've drawn attention to your tricky card skills, they're going to be watching your hands like a hawk. A couple of in their hands, self workers might be a good way to follow this up if you have to do it.

It's a great demonstration of card control or gambling skill, but it's not magic.

Barry

Have to agree with the last two guys - it's really a demonstration of card ability - it ain't magic. People are going to smile and say "whoa, well done, very impressive" but they they're not going to get that feeling in their gut, they're not going to think "I simply haven't a clue how that could be possible...".

I have to disagree with Ted and yourself when you suggest that people will think "it's not your card skill that's kept them in order, it's something magical." I'm really not sure they're that stupid I'm afraid! It's hard enough with card magic to get away from the skilled manipulation into proper magic even when you're *trying*, let alone when you're fairly blatant about doing a false shuffle.

This may be just the way I perceive magic and cards, but even if they burn your hands and they *don't* see anything... I don't *want* them thinking that somehow, every card is under my masterful control. Impressive as it might be, it's not magic either.

Hope this isn't too negative - this is of course just one school of thought - many people love doing card shark tricks - but IMHO they really do just come across as tricks, with very little true magic about them. I think before you pursue this routine, have a good think about what it is you want them to experience.

I've slept 6 hours in the last 48 and been to Belgium and back, so forgive me if this sounds pap and incoherent BUT

Why not turn it around so the spec's involved? Take out a fresh deck, tell them you can shuffle the cards and retain the new deck order because you're magic/brilliant/better than Blaine/God, then shuffle the deck and display it........as a thoroughly shuffled deck. Didn't work you see. You're not so good after all. BUT WAIT! You hand the deck to the spec and ask them to shuffle or mix them anyway they like in preperation for some trick you're about to do.
They do so, you take the deck back and display it and they've put it back into new deck order. So the magic happens in their hands, which is far more powerful and what makes OOTW so damn spesh.

I can think of a method off the top of my cranium, but its just an idea of a place to take the effect. Maybe i'll think some more after i get some lovely, lovely sleep.

One of the things that annoys me most at my magic club is the tyros' finger flinging all the time as they sit during the meetings. They keep surreptitiously looking around to ensure that they are noticed. To me, shuffling a fresh deck and finishing with it in its original order, is a form of self indulgence if it is done for its own sake. It just becomes juggling. "Look how clever I am". False shuffles are a wonderful asset to possess as a means of developing and fulfilling a card trick. The sucker should not know that you have the ability to control the cards in such a way and if you demonstrate that you can any further card magic is wasted. If however you go through a series of different type shuffles; the Irish, The Jewish, the Chinese etc.etc. where you are, in fact, controlling the cards in order and then do a decent trick it will surely be a wonderful bit of entertainment climaxing with a miracle. Apart from double undercuts, Zarrow and push through false shuffles, double lifts, Christ Anneman alignment, triumphs, Sy Stebbins etc.etc. I hate cards.
Mind you, they are all now doing the muscle pass. All those bruised palms when a Hang Pin Chen move is so beautiful. Oh dear, I must be getting old!