talkmagic.co.uk

Firstly, please forgive me for what i feel may be an intrusion as I am not a magician, illusionist, or anything of the sort. Well, not exactly anyway. What I do do, is lighting, and special effects for a local theare group.

The reason for my visit to your forum is purely to pick the minds of those who create illusions on a regular basis.

Our next production is 'A Christmas Carol' - Yes you know the one! Scrooge , tiny tim etc. Our problem lies with the ghosts.

For example -

The now familiar gust of wind blows up around Scrooge. As he looks up at the ghost of yet to come, its form shrinks and collapses into the curtains around scrooges bed.

This is one of the harder ones im trying to get my head around.

The scene is this_

Ghost - dressed in black robes - no humanly features visible (just general head and shoulders shape)

The bed will be a four poster with typical curtains around.

The back drop will be black tabs (curtains)

Quite Dim / moody lighting

note - we are performing this on a large stage in a 600 capacity theatre.

Smoke lighting etc all available. no trapdoors or wires for flying people!

Its a basic disapearing trick which may seem (or i hope will seem) simple to most of you. We just want this effect to be like "how did they do that?"
Some other effects ive seen are just so obvious!

I mean we can play around with this as much as we like. It hasnt got to be just like the script. just as long as it looks good.

Thought comes to mind - has anyone seen the Phantom of the opera? the final scene?

Obviously i respect your secrets and dont expect anyone to reveal anything on a public forum or even to me, but if you do want to help me, please please please reply or e-mail me at drewwelham@btinternet.com if you'd rather.

Thanks in advance.

Drew

P.S there are other illusions to id like to acheive in this producion but thought id throw this one out first! - sorry for the long post!

Have PM'd you..

where are you based?

what is your budget?

and do you have set plans available?

Im in essex, england.

Budget it kinda tight as only a small group. But have access to all sorts at the theatre and have lots of stuff in storage in the way of set / costumes

are you using an ordinary 4 poster, or will you be building it from scratch?

also, is the bed central on stage, or can it be placed to one side, at an angle?
Im thinking you could have a mirror mask, between one of the rear posts, and the back flat, allowing the actor within the spirit's costume to make their escape, whilst the costume, is hung on the post, becomming part of the curtains.

see, a couple of years ago, i worked out that the right way of doing the spirits, was to have them projected on huge, moveable screens built within the set.

Pepper's Ghost might do the job. More info at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepper's_ghost (sorry - the URL thing doesn't seem to work with that link, so you'll have to select everything from 'http' to 'ghost', copy and paste it into your browser address bar).

good thought regarding the mirror mask. the bed can be made (and probably will be) specially for this production. it can be placed anywhere on the stage. The set will be minimalistic, to allow for ease and fluidity between scenes. Dont really want to use projections as the actors cant interact greatly with them.

Also if its worth noting. The actor will probably be wearing some sort of head/shoulder gear as the figure will be about 7ft tall. this may help as the 'outline' of the figure can remain while the actor exits. But what to do with the head gear for the reveal? i.e if scrooge was to pull away at the robe to reveal nothing?

yeah looked at peppers ghost. would need a very large mirror as not enough scenery to disguise it! If we had a box set it would work but as we not using any permanent set/scenery. would be hard to to me thinks.

Thanks tho!

Droopy wrote:yeah looked at peppers ghost. would need a very large mirror as not enough scenery to disguise it! If we had a box set it would work but as we not using any permanent set/scenery. would be hard to to me thinks.

My understanding is that ordinary clear glass will work, which means you don't need to disguise it.

Also consider where the ghost will be. You could have it lying on the ground behind the bed, with a smaller piece of glass angled corrected. That way you don't need such a large sheet.

Thanks for your reply!

my concern is that the ghost is on the stage for quite a quile proir to the disapearance (although you never see any flesh) moving around the stage with scrooge before he disapears. So yes - there does need to be an actor inside!

please look at this for an idea of what the ghost will look like

http://www.cedmagic.com/featured/christ ... uture.html

Image wouldnt attach for some reason

T

as you are using a basic black box set, you can use black flats where you would normaly use a mirror.

what you have to do, is place a number of items nearby that reflect light, for example the white sheets on scrooges bed and some curtains, or a table which has a white vase on it.

small items like this lit well, act like dazzle lights in black art theatre, and help hide the black flat.

try to avoid uv, because it interfears with all the other colours on stage.

just relly on tightly focused lighting, to create pools of darkness where you want, with reds lighting the area of the black flat.( could this be light from a fireplace?)

by teh way dont dress the ghost in black. use grey instead, otherwise teh audience will never see it .

Ted wrote:

Droopy wrote:yeah looked at peppers ghost. would need a very large mirror as not enough scenery to disguise it! If we had a box set it would work but as we not using any permanent set/scenery. would be hard to to me thinks.

My understanding is that ordinary clear glass will work, which means you don't need to disguise it.

Also consider where the ghost will be. You could have it lying on the ground behind the bed, with a smaller piece of glass angled corrected. That way you don't need such a large sheet.

you do have to disguise it Ted. the edges of the pane must be hidden.

some good ideas there chaps - thanks alot!

another little effect which has been keeping me awake at night is the door knocker scene. dont know if youve seen it on TV or elsewhere.

Its where scrooge sees the face of jacob marley where the door knocker should be.

So basically we will have a door - custom built, with some sort of knocker that will change into a face momentarily and then back into the knocker.

Other productions have just had the knocker on a swivel with a face stuck on the back. good for the school play but not very wow for my liking!

Ive thought about using projections here but apart from distances being an issue i dont think it will work convincingly. this is the first ghost/spirit we see so needs to work well.

Dont know if im kinda getting away from magic and illusion with this one but will put it o you anyway - see if you have any ideas.

-oh yeah, scrooge does go thru the door so needs to be functional!

no.


the door has a hole cut in it, big enough for an actor to push their face though.( NOT their head, just the face)
this hole is covered with lycra, and then painted up pto look like a door knocker.

when you want the magic to happen, an actor, pushes his face against the back of the lycra, and the deformed face appears in front.

or, instead of an actors face, have someone push a plastic face mask against the lycra, as teh dialogue is spoken off stage.