talkmagic.co.uk

Hi folks,

I've got the Bazar de Magia aluminium Cups and Balls combo that comes with one gimmicked ball and cup for a chop cup routine.

Having never used a chop cup before (or cups and balls before now, for that matter) I don't know how it should work, but it seems to me that it is somewhat inconsistent.

Sometimes just turning the cup mouth-down is enough to make the ball fall out, other times it takes a decent tap of the cup to make it fall out.

I don't use it as a chop cup - yet - but if it should be more consistent (and I imagine it should be) it probably means I won't be able to use it, not reliably at least, in the future.

I wonder, is the Bazar de Magia chop cup (as in, the cups and balls one) just not very good, have I got a duff ball or what?

Any input you can give would be most appreciated. If needs be I'll get in touch with Alakazam and see about getting something sorted. For what it's worth so far, I'm delighted with them as a cups and balls set and from what I can gather, my girlfriend had no bother ordering from them. This is not a slate of either Bazar de Magia or Alakazam - just a request for some advice/input to help me decide if I should be chasing something up or not... and the less time I have to spend without my cups and balls, the happier I'll be - I'm spending rather a lot of time practising with them at the moment!

Looking forwards to your replies.

Cheers!

Count your self lucky... I got bought a generic aluminium cups and balls set and my chop doesn't work!!

Sometimes just turning the cup mouth-down is enough to make the ball fall out, other times it takes a decent tap of the cup to make it fall out

not being funny, but you are using the chopped ball every time aren't you?

Recent thread on same topic may help:
http://www.talkmagic.co.uk/ftopic33174.php

There are several "styles" and designs of Chop-Chop cups. Often, the gimmicked ball will have a thin rod in it, usually magnetized but not always. With some cups, this rod will not make the entire ball "sticky" - instead it will only be sticky at the poles. This is true for many cups, and is not necessarily a relection on the quality of the cup. It can become sure fire if you are aware, so that, for example, when you put the ball on another cup you will orient the ball properly, or, when you drop the ball in the cup, you will swish it around a wee bit until it sticks.

This was true of the original chop cup. It is also true of many of the good-quality cups in my collection. Different balls can produce different results. No matter what, you want a ball that will be fairly easy to dislodge, if you don't want to have to slam your cup down each time.

There are some performers, (including the late great Don Alan - the man who probably did the most to popularize the use of the cup), who do give it a good slam to dislodge the ball.

My advice - first see if the current ball can be manipulated in ways to easily resolve the problem. Next, try a different ball.

I would not be so quick to blame the manufacturer.

I agree with Shufton. In this case it sounds as if it's the ball that is in consistant.

Hi folks. I've been away since I posted this thread, so it's been nice to see the replies.

First thing's first, I thought I'd made it clear in my first post but it seems I might have somehow left the issue open...
I'm not blaming, complaining, moaning or slating anyone, manufacturer or retailer. This thread was intended to do no more than find out if there was something wrong or not.

Now that's said... on with the replies.


dat8962
Having read the posts on here and the thread Mandrake linked it does seem to be down to the ball and not the cup. Whether that means FAULTY or not though - I'm still not entirely sure.


Jordan C
There's no problem like that. There's definitely a magnet in there. The thing is, I don't even use it as a chop cup! I'm learning the cups and balls ungimmicked at the moment, it's just nice to have the chop cup there for if I decide to learn either a gimmicked C&B routine or a straight chop-cup one.
The main reason I posted this was to find out if there was something wrong with something in the set so I could chase it up now rather than trying to get it sorted much later in the year when I try to learn a chop cup routine and find it won't work; if indeed it won't - which is yet to be determined!


daleshrimpton
Thanks for a very funny response - intentional or otherwise it really made me laugh. I'm happy to report that yes, I was using the chopped ball every time. As I'm still not familiar enough with the set to spot it by sight, I rolled each ball over the base of the chop cup and tried the one that stuck. It sticks really quite well to the outside, less well to the inside though.


Mandrake
Thanks for the thread - I read it over in full. Maybe I need to learn to use the gimmick along with it's individual quirks, maybe it's got something wrong with it somehow. I don't know what's normal and what's faulty with chop cups though. See my response to Shufton for more on that point.


Shufton
I hadn't managed to figure out just how the ball was gimmicked. My first guess was several small magnets around the surface to get a more even stick, that seemed disproved by the "inconsistent" sticking though. I didn't consider the thin rod (magnetised or otherwise) possibility.

I'd considered your point about needing an easy to dislodge ball, I imagine it would remove some finesse and maybe give a clue to the presence/workings of the gimmick if you had to repeatedly slam the cup down to make it work.

As it stands, the ball supplied with the set does stick sometimes and not others, and from what I recall (I don't have the set to hand to try it - it's still packed in my case from the trip I just got back from) it does stick better in certain orientations.

Whether that means I just need practice, a new ball or a replacement from the retailer or manufacturer still isn't quite clear to me yet though (despite all the helpful responses so far) that's to be expected with inexperience though I think.


Thanks very much for taking the time to reply, especially to Mandrake for digging up that link and Shufton for a lengthy response. I appreciate the effort!

I might have to take it along to a magic shop (I may be visiting Tommy Cooper's reasonably soon) or to the next Manchester meetup (assuming there's another soon - I've not seen it mentioned in the Manchester thread yet) and see if someone with experience can tell me if it's faulty or just normal and something I have to learn to use properly.

If anyone else has some pearls to add to this, I look forwards to your responses.

All the best!

BigShot wrote:I might have to take it along to a magic shop (I may be visiting Tommy Cooper's reasonably soon) or to the next Manchester meetup (assuming there's another soon - I've not seen it mentioned in the Manchester thread yet) and see if someone with experience can tell me if it's faulty or just normal and something I have to learn to use properly.

I think just nobody's gotten around to naming a date yet, we've only recently met. Go ahead and name a weekend you're available There will likely be one or two people (not me) there experienced with the chop cup

Taking your cup along to a shop that sells ball sets is by far the best and most -practical way of resolving your problem.

Strange as it sounds, you can try a few sets until you get one that appears right for the cup. You tend to have to buy a set of four balls to get the chopped one and a matching regular as they are usually made and sold for a set of three cups and balls. However, you may be lucky

kolm
It's hard to say in advance - I often have to work at the weekend at shortish notice so it's better for me to see a date coming and try to be free for it than to pick a date and possibly not be able to make it. I know the difference is pretty much entirely semantic, but it feels better to miss something set up by someone else than to set something up and not be there.

As for naming a weekend - other than this coming one - pretty much any weekend, I think. It's just a matter of trying to manipulate appointment times to leave me free when the meeting is on.



dat8962
I'll be sure to bring it along when I head over to Blackpool soon... I don't know if Tommy Cooper's sell them, but I'll be in there anyway and it's not like the cup weighs much.

Would most shops be OK with someone trying out the gimmicks in that way before buying?

It's no bother getting a set of 4, as when I finally start learning to use the chop cup - it'll probably be something I bring into a C&B routine anyway so it makes sense to have a full matching set. I might even get 2 sets so I've got 4 ungimmicked balls for the C&B (I've noticed sometimes I get unlucky and put the chopped ball on the chop cup and it doesn't tip off easilly - which I think looks a bit suspect) a couple of spares and 2 chopped balls to switch in if/when there's a need - and all matching too.

If you explain your problem then I would be very surprised if any shop doesn't help you out with this by letting you try a few balls until you get the right one that you are happy with.

If they're not happy then I would take my custom elsewhere.

I've not been to the Tommy Cooper shop myself but from what I've heard you should have no problem and you'll enjoy a great service.

Thanks, Dat.
Only a quick reply as lappy is on the blink and I'm stuck in bed with something nasty (before the jokes start, I'm alone) so I'm typing from my PSP.

Will head to Cooper's as soon as I'm fit.

Will post about testing the cup and ball when at a keyboard.

Get well soon