talkmagic.co.uk

Hi TM Folk,
As you can see I'm pretty new round these parts. I rarely post responses but I do a lot of reading. Those days are now changing mind you and I'm really looking forward to taking part in some great in depth discussion. First of all I'm remaining anonymous because of my profession, I'm an Actor, and for now at least...I'm keeping these two sides of my performance life separate from one another. (Acting and My Illusions...the reason I use the word Illusion you will read shortly). I've just finished reading many discussion on this forum about the differences between magic and mentalism..where to draw the line..and witnessing many people seeming to get horribly offended when a magician claims to be a mentalist, anyway that's another point.
I'll introduce you to what I do. I mainly do walk-around, street busking (If am feeling adventurous) and private bookings for small groups of people - some may call it "Parlour" work. I usually perform with the following items : A pen, a few slips of card or billets, a £10 note (Or rather it's serial number), A deck of ESP cards perhaps, and a small impression pad or an impression "clipboard" if performing for a group, and my audiences personal belongings. I also use devices to stop watches - many of you will know exactly what I mean. Book tests and prediction effects are also in my repertoire. I may use a normal deck of playing cards if they are thrown at me and someone says "Use these then !!". I sometimes carry the good old ID if I'm in desperate need of an out, never really needed this yet when working. With all these items I perform mind reading routines essentially, often disguised as personality tests of psychological influence. I'm also a hypnotist and give hypnotism demonstrations if the time is right,if there is interest and if the law permits. So with that very general description of what I do what would you categorise me as ?

I usually describe myself as a "Mental Magician" and of course the usual puns follow . I do this for a number of reasons;

A) The term "mentalist" seems to come accross very serious. My performance style is very playful and I don't like to intimidate my audience.
B) Many Laymen folk don't know what a "Mentalist" is. More often than not they think its a term for someone crazy or off their rocker.
C) I don't currently perform things such as Cold reading effects, or tarot reading or fortune telling (are prediction effects fortune telling do we think?) which seems to fall into the mentalism catagory.

I think Mental Magician suits me well, I know card slights and can do basic card or coin magic..if asked. But my main act is that of a mind reader who can tell you what your thinking or what word you pick out of a book or hypnotise you if you so wish.

Whats peoples opinion on this ? Do you need Cold Reading and that more "Darker side" of Mentalism to be considered a true "Mentalist".. If you so much as touch a gimicked deck of cards are you suddenly a "Mental Magician" ? The darkest thing I have performed was on halloween - I performed Paul Brooks amazing "Dearly Departed".. an excelent effect with a great spooky reaction.

Am really interested in hearing what other people do as well.. what are you expertise?...What makes you all tick and what do you hate performing? Come chat he he

With that I bid you farewell, and if your still reading...Well Done! You have avoided my subconscious influence on you to stop reading and go to another post..if you have stopped reading then your an excellent subject.. please join me on stage

Look forward to hearing from you and hopefully make some friends

Byee x

EZ

Hello and welcome!

Interesting post, and I won;t be causing any controversy

Call yourself hat you wish - if Derren Brown called himself a magician, a mentalist, a psyhological illusionist, or even an apple-eater-with-a-spoon-er, he would still be considered great

As long as you are doing what you are being paid to do, you can call yourself anything that you want

as for what I do an expertise? I'm a performer. I do "mind-reading" and similar stuff like that. I have my first theatre stage show in march, which I am hoping will sell out.

And all in all, that's me!

Hi Beardy,
Glad you responded I've been toying with the idea of attending your show, although its a bit of a treck I would love to see it. Could you PM me details or provide a Link ? From reading alot of your posts we seem to be doing very similar stuff

I completly agree with your view here. Create your own genre, do it brilliantly and most of all entertain your audience. Thats why we do it surely? That and we love it !

EZ
x

Hey there, fun topic!

I think Mentalism doesn't have to be dark, it can be playful if you wish! Even standard card magic can be portrayed as dark if the performer wants it to so what's a name really?

I've only recently got into mentalism of any kind (thanks to a certain Reader of Minds' rather good book) after coming from card magic and I perform them in a similar sort of way, casual, laid back with a little straight-faced humour. I do that because A) I generally like performing for small groups (eg. Parlour work) and B) because that is my natural personality.

Incidentally, if I want to perform dark (and lets face it, sometimes its fun to be spooky!) I've put together a bizzarre routine with plenty of haunted decks, spinning forks and bloodied cards because there is alot of ghost stories around my home town
What did you think of Dearly Departed by the way? I might be adding that to the routine soon, but Im torn between it and a few similar effects!

I though DD was good, great response from the guy. He had the photo and envelope for a week and so was well prepped up to be shocked. I'm not a fan of the actual "secret"...I'm still looking for a more water tight method for that so any suggestions please PM me I Performed it along with a very simple Question Answer routine from Mr Corinda which gave the night a slightly Seance feeling. Light a few candles and you have a winner with Dearly depearted I would say. Its also adjustable with a bit of thinking to have a completly different theme. Workable in most settings with most audiences. Could even be comedy I suppose with a small ammount of out the box thinking.

I'm heading more and more down the dark and spooky path, but that's just me and my personal taste. It's certainly not a requirement.

Beardy mentioned Derren -- he's sometimes dark and eerie, sometimes light and playful, sometimes matter-of-fact and scientific, sometimes lump-in-the-throat moving, and you'll generally find examples of all of the above in the same show.

Not saying that most people would be able to pull off all of them in a short space of time. But they all work as "flavours".

Some effects lend themselves better to one slant or another. Max Maven's version of Bank Night ("Just Chintz") from the Nothing DVD is just plain silly, and it wouldn't be half as good played any other way.

I'm very very suprised this thread hasn't been lept on and ripped apart by those that claim mentalism can't use cards and shouldn't be looked on as magic etc. I'm sure they'll get here.

I use whatever effects i think will dazzle a spectator. Call em what you want. Someone like Blaine isn't considered a mentalist, yet watch any of his specials and there are times he comes across as one. Derren uses magical techniques yet is a mentalist.

It's all a bit fuzzy and hardly worth bickering over. I like to use cards with mental effects because cards are my thing. I adapt mental effects that need envelopes or what have yous so i can use the card box or something else i have on me. Anything to make it appear impromptu. A great mental effect you can do with cards is Dr. Fun by Paul Harris. I've been doing this a lot lately and the reactions can be amazing.

I most heartily agree, Grimshaw!

I consider myself primarily a mentalist but have no problems using cards, coins, whatever. I often like to tell people that "I don't do card tricks but I do perform some tricks using cards" this slight shift of emphasis seems to deflect away from any perceived sleights, etc and seems to suggest that I am merely using the cards as a tool for the effect.

To be honest, I find all the arguments of mentalist vs magician rather tiring!

*bites tongue at a couple of comments*

i can't help but find the original poster's language/typing familiar for some reason...hmmm....

IAIN wrote:*bites tongue at a couple of comments*

i can't help but find the original poster's language/typing familiar for some reason...hmmm....

No need to bite tongue Its a discussion. And I'm intrigued by your conspiracy theory. This is the first magic forum I have joined. I read other but as yet haven't posted. This is also my only account on Talk Magic and like I say, have only posted about ten posts. Who am I similar to?..am curious

IAIN wrote:*bites tongue at a couple of comments*

i can't help but find the original poster's language/typing familiar for some reason...hmmm....

I also thought that, however I just can't quite put a face to it, or should that be name?...

IAIN wrote:*bites tongue at a couple of comments*

I'm disappointed.

Grimshaw wrote:

IAIN wrote:*bites tongue at a couple of comments*

I'm disappointed.

I'm just confused now.

Grimshaw wrote:

IAIN wrote:*bites tongue at a couple of comments*

I'm disappointed.

eveningzoo, you just remind me of someone on here with the way they used to write that was all

grimmy old bean - lets not go there gurl'f'end...but...well..alright ...using a card case instead of envelopes...PAH!

it does make sense, just...meh...think you're missing out on stronger reactions using those envelopes...

and dont get me wrong, the majority of the mentalists i love the most...yes - genuine man love for...all use cards...canasta, berglas, koran...the list goes on...

go on...give a few nice envelopes from Rymans a try!

and the other biting was for mentioning the word "tricks" when performing mentalism...

all meant in a kind, gentle way kiss kiss

IAIN wrote:!

and the other biting was for mentioning the word "tricks" when performing mentalism...

all meant in a kind, gentle way kiss kiss

*sigh* I paused long and hard before I pressed 'Enter' on the offending post for the use that very word and then decided........

If we really think that specs don't believe we're performing some sort of 'trick' (no matter how it's presented), then I think we are seriously deluding ourselves!

Maybe I should have use the word 'effect' but, frankly, that wouldn't scan so well when you're saying it out loud!

Sean