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by **KingOfNynex2003** » Jan 30th, '10, 12:31

I've been doing card magic for nearly 3 years now and I also started doing a little mentalism sometime last year (Powerball 60 and Universal Impression) and I just decided that I want to get into coin magic as well because I've said when I get good paying gigs for a while (like 2-4 years or something like that) I'd like to get Dean Dill's Explosion and I don't want to just have that single coin effect in my show so I would like to get started in coin magic now so when I eventually start getting paying gigs I'll have a full repetoire of stuff that I can do and not have to be dependant on doing nothing but card magic.

So anyways I know most (most likely all) of the coin magicians on here will tell me to get Bobo's book and I've already got it in PDF form but I can't understand what he's saying in that book because I have always been a visual learner and I need to see what I'm supposed to do if I want to learn anything. So books for me aren't a good way to learn so this is what I was planning on buying when I start learning coin magic:

In The Beginning There Were Coins by Jay Noblezada
Revolutionary Coin Magic Volume 1 by Jay Sankey
Metamorphosis by Mark Mason and Wayne Dobson
Mirage Coin Set by Craig Petty
Scotch & Soda
Coinvexed 2.0 by David Penn and possibly the conversion kit but if it's used solely for the original coinvexed then I'll probably bypass that one entirely also if anyone thinks I should get the original Coinvexed instead of the new one let me know
Revolutionary Coin Magic Volume 2 by Jay Sankey
Here by Ben Seidman
and then finally Sick by Ponta The Smith

now I'm not going to buy all of those at once I was thinking of getting the first 6 of them and then I'll be set for a while of learning and after I've got good at the stuff from those effects I'd move onto the more advanced stuff.

I know what most of you are going to say and you don't have to worry about me just going through all of them at once and then practice them for 1 day and then go out and perform all of them as badly as I could. I actually take my time and give all of my effects that I learn their full attention they deserve until I could pretty much do the stuff in my sleep.

The only problem is some of the effects in those DVD's require to use Half Dollars and Silver Dollars and in Canada the only coins we have are in order:
Pennies
Nickels
Dimes
Quarters
Loonies ($1)
Toonies ($2)
and the biggest is the Toonie the only problem is that a Toonie is a fair bit smaller than a Half Dollar and a Silver Dollar so if anybody knows where I can buy some Un-Gimmicked Half Dollars and Silver Dollars and also the same size Chinese coins for fairly cheap I would be really grateful and I'll need 4 of each of them. Hope to hear from somebody soon.

Sincerely,

KingOfNynex2003

by **dat8962** » Jan 30th, '10, 13:18

Forget all of the above. If you're a visual learner then by not get the Bobo DVD set?

Learn all of the sleights with whatever coins you have available and then you can start to script your own routines.

by **IanKendall** » Jan 30th, '10, 14:01

I would echo that. Most of your shopping list is far too advanced for a beginner.

There are a few visual sources out there, but in the interests of unashamed and somewhat biased opinion, you might want to have a quick look at this thread

Take care, Ian

by **flashman** » Jan 30th, '10, 20:09

I'm ashamed to say I own most of your list - bought most of them when I was starting in coin magic ("all the gear - no idea", as they say...)

Thankfully I also purchased the Modern Coin Magic 3DVD set mentioned by dat. It's great, especially when used in conjunction with Bobo's book. Three years on, I'm still working through it.

I can also heartily recommend Ian Kendall's Basic Coin Magic (as modestly mentioned above). You get an awful lot for very little money - and all the basics are explained in painstaking detail.

As for coins - a quick search of ebay will turn up a host of half dollars, english pennies and the like.

by **bmat** » Jan 30th, '10, 22:24

It is easy to get both English Pennies and half dollars in Canada. Where in Canada are you? Secondly if you are using ungaffed coins Twonies are just as easy to use as half dollars. While some of the effects use silver dollars most do not require the use of them, it was just the common coin at the time of printing or the performers personal preferance. Most magic shops in Canada sell American coins. If you are near a border you can simply cross into the states and go to a bank and get the required coins, however silver dollars can be tricky at a bank.

Try flea markets, coin shops, and antique stores usually carry coins, Sears used to have a coin and stamp department not sure if they still do or not.

If you are insistant on video get Micheal Ammar coin magic series. Very clearly explained. A great place to start.

by **KingOfNynex2003** » Jan 31st, '10, 11:13

dat8962 wrote:Forget all of the above. If you're a visual learner then by not get the Bobo DVD set?

Learn all of the sleights with whatever coins you have available and then you can start to script your own routines.

Thanks for the suggestions and I actually tried finding those DVD's but for some reason they're sold out everywhere I've been to (MJM Penguin and a few other sites) I don't mind learning from other stuff but I wasn't planning on getting all of them right away I was planning on getting these to begin with and basically work from ITBTWC upto the harder stuff on Revolutionary Coin Magic. So this is my updated list here and remember I can only buy magic once per year so I have to get enough stuff to last me for an entire year otherwise I'll get bored with it really quickly:

In the Beginning There Were Coins
Jay Sankey's Revolutionary Coin Magic
Mirage Coin Set by Craig Petty
Metamorphosis by Wayne Dobson and Mark Mason
Scotch & Soda, Dime & Penny, ChinaTown Half (World Greatest Magic) by L&L Publishing
Coinvexed 2.0 by David Penn
Ammar Complete Intro To Coin Magic
and Miracle Chip by Mark Mason and JB Magic.

So basically I would start with ITBTWC then move onto Ammar Completely Intro To Coin Magic then Scotch & Soda then Metamorphosis then Mirage then either Miracle Chip or Coinvexed 2.0 and then finally go into Jay Sankey's Revolutionary Coin Magic and I'd give all of them the attention they deserve and until I can do them in my sleep.

I'm not like one of those people that only does a little bit of practice and then says, "Hey I'm good at it now I'll try this on somebody and see how it plays out." I actually spend the time to make all of my effects look as good as they can so I can wow audiences and I'm a fairly fast learner when it comes to most things but I still do the best I can with all the things I learn.

by **KingOfNynex2003** » Jan 31st, '10, 11:27

bmat wrote:It is easy to get both English Pennies and half dollars in Canada. Where in Canada are you? I live in BC Secondly if you are using ungaffed coins Twonies are just as easy to use as half dollars. I know but from Ammar's DVD it pretty much requires me to use Half and Silver Dollars and that's the main reason I want to get them so I'll be able to practice those routines.While some of the effects use silver dollars most do not require the use of them, it was just the common coin at the time of printing or the performers personal preferance. Most magic shops in Canada sell American coins. Unfortunately the one in my area (it's the only one within 200 miles of me) doesn't and won't get me any American or Chinese coins for some reason. If you are near a border you can simply cross into the states and go to a bank and get the required coins, however silver dollars can be tricky at a bank.

Try flea markets, coin shops, and antique stores usually carry coins, Sears used to have a coin and stamp department not sure if they still do or not.

If you are insistant on video get Micheal Ammar coin magic series. Very clearly explained. A great place to start. Yeah I was planning on getting that actually.

I thank you for your help and all the info you gave me and I hope that I can actually find a place that sells those Bobo DVD's somewhere that won't take about a month for me to get over here.

by **dat8962** » Jan 31st, '10, 13:22

As said earlier and despite your revised list - I think that you'll be wasting a LOT of money.

You will find a lot of repetition on those DVD's and will come away with far less knowledge that getting the Modern coin magic DVD's.

Forget buying from Penguin and other magic wholesalers. If you contact a decent magic store and peak to the proproetor then 9 times out of 10 they will order one in for you and this only takes a few days if their wholesealer has it in stock.

As for a friendly word of advice, if you ask for advice and it's provided by the members, particularly those who are experienced magicians then you really should consider this closely otherwise they will stop giving it.

Your post reads as if you've made your mind up about what you're going to buy and in the main, you're going to stick with it no matter what.

by **KingOfNynex2003** » Jan 31st, '10, 13:49

dat8962 wrote:As said earlier and despite your revised list - I think that you'll be wasting a LOT of money.

You will find a lot of repetition on those DVD's and will come away with far less knowledge that getting the Modern coin magic DVD's.

Forget buying from Penguin and other magic wholesalers. If you contact a decent magic store and peak to the proproetor then 9 times out of 10 they will order one in for you and this only takes a few days if their wholesealer has it in stock.

As for a friendly word of advice, if you ask for advice and it's provided by the members, particularly those who are experienced magicians then you really should consider this closely otherwise they will stop giving it.

Your post reads as if you've made your mind up about what you're going to buy and in the main, you're going to stick with it no matter what.

I actually priced everything out and it turns out that if I shop from Penguin I'll be saving about $150 if I bought them from different websites and about $220 if I bought it from my local magic shop and that's not including the other non coin effects I'm planning on buying as well. Also have you seen Jay Noblezada's and Jay Sankey's and Michael Ammar's DVD's? They have a lot of stuff in them this is a complete list of all the stuff taught in Jay Noblezada's DVD:

Essentials

Palms:
Classic
Finger
Thumb
Edge Grip

Vanishes:
Puts
Classic Vanish
Finger Palm Vanish
Thumb Palm Vanish
Slide Vanish

Takes:
Take Vanish
French Drop
Pro Bonus: Retention Vanish
Appearances
Push Out
Wipe Clean
Shuttle Pass
Subtleties
Ramsey Subtlety
Malini Subtlety

Tricks:
Coin From Thin Air
Cranium Vanish
Coin Through Hand
Coin Through Table
Tenkai Pennies
Coin From Pen Cap
Strike Vanish
Edge Grip
Coin Through Pocket

Routines:
One Coin Routine
Coins Across
Copper/Silver Transpo "You and Me"
Three Coin Routine
Pro Tips
Breaking the wrist
Coordination of Actions
Under foot vanish / recovery
Wipe Clean
Coin Roll

And this is a list of the stuff taught in Michael Ammar's DVD:

Fingerpalm
Classic Palm
Thumbpalm
Getting into Thumbpalm
Back Thumbpalm
Downs Palm
The Back Clip
Finger Clip
Deep Back Clip
A Sure Bet
The Phone Home Pen
Double Your Money
Completely Gone!
What's That In Your Ear
Coin from Tie
Tricky Trousers
Natural Lay of the Hand
Simple Take
Simple Put
Schneider Vanish
Le Tourniquet
Reverse French Drop
Classic Fake Transfer
The Slide Vanish
Friction Palm
Spider Vanish
Silver Dollar to Quarters
Half Dollar to 5 Dimes
Coin Thru Table
Simple Coins Across
Misdirection
The Magic Wand
Revolve Load
Thumbpalm Load
Sonic Squeeze
Copper/Silver Transposition
Produce and Complete Vanish
Timing
Coin to Key
Gone!
1 Minute Coin Vanish
The Thieves, Sheep and the Barn

Unfortunately Jay Sankey doesn't list all of the stuff in his DVD but it says this:

You'll learn literally dozens of innovative techniques including:
The Capricorn Change
The Warm-Up Production
The Newton Drop
The Himber Sankey Count
The Spiderman Vanish
The Pancake Toss
The Flying Shuttle Pass
The Two Fisted Vanish
The B.P. Ditch
The Waterwheel Production
and many more
You'll also learn 35 full-length coin routines including:
Ups and Downs - Jay's revolutionary "coin through the table" effect
Blackstack Production - Astonishing bare-handed production of 8 coins!
Copper/Silver/Sankey - Over 15 years in Jay's professional repertoire
The Television Bend - As performed by Jay on national television
Nest Egg - An extremely clever "nest in boxes" effect
Push-Button - A 4 coins and card case Sankey classic
Mr. Clean Coins Across - The "new age" routine that started it all
Underwraps - An ideal impromptu bar trick
Plastic Surgery - A borrowed coin travels down the length of a straw!
Penny Ante - Eye-popping penetration of a marked coin through a Ziploc bag!
No Jacket Required - "Open Travelers" with coins!
The K.I.S.S. Transpo - An honest-to-goodness impromptu killer
and over 20 more!

Jay even shares insightful tips on the Classic Palm, Retention Vanish, Click Pass, Palm-to-Palm Change, Thumb Palm, Himber Vanish and Tenkai Pinch

What You Get

Dozens of innovative techniques!
35 FULL-LENGTH coin routines!
The ability to entertain - anytime, anywhere - with just the coins in your pocket.

So even with those 3 DVD's I'll be getting a lot of stuff from them and I'm not exactly going to be shortchanged on most of the stuff because they teach pretty much all of the best sleights and routines you can do with coins the only thing I don't see in it is the Bobo Switch or the Bobo Coin Vanish but this stuff isn't necessary for the routines/effects I'd probably be learning and if it is they'll probably teach it in the DVD just in case somebody doesn't know it already.

I'm not trying to be dificult but you guys are saying that Jay Sankey and Jay Nobelzada and Michael Ammar aren't good teachers to start learning from and I know for a fact that every single one of them are great teachers because I've learned many different effects and routines from each and everyone of them.

by **Peter Marucci** » Jan 31st, '10, 15:15

Any decent, bricks and mortar magic shps should have the ungimmicked coins you seek.
I see you include Scotch and Soda in your repertoire.
Why?
The loaded shell feels and sounds like nothing so much as a magic prop!
E-mail me and I'll send you my ungimmicked handling, that appeared in my column in the Linking Ring magazine some years back.

by **IanKendall** » Jan 31st, '10, 16:56

In magic there's teaching and there's teaching. Ask yourself just how much detail can be on the DVDs when you are cramming fifty techniques into two hours.

You have obviously made up your mind, so I also have to ask - why did you ask for advice here? Rather than spend 200 dollars or more on all these, get one beginner item, either from Jay or Mike or someone, and work on that. _Then_ get something else and work on that.

Not that you'll pay any attention to this advice, either.

Take care, Ian

by **KingOfNynex2003** » Jan 31st, '10, 23:58

Peter Marucci wrote:Any decent, bricks and mortar magic shps should have the ungimmicked coins you seek.
I see you include Scotch and Soda in your repertoire.
Why? I just want to see what it's like and if it fits my style or not.

The loaded shell feels and sounds like nothing so much as a magic prop!
E-mail me and I'll send you my ungimmicked handling, that appeared in my column in the Linking Ring magazine some years back. Is the handling of it easy enough for a somewhat beginner in coin magic? The only things I've done with coins are these things:
Sinful Coin In Soda Can
Muscle Pass with a poker chip
Factory Sealed from Ellusionist
Bullet Coin In Bottle from Ellusionist
Muscle Bend from True Astonishments
and some simple coin vanishes. Also do you think you'd be able to put it on video and show what I'd supposed to do? I can't for the life of me figure out what people are saying when I'm trying to learn from a book or reading something.

by **KingOfNynex2003** » Feb 1st, '10, 00:18

IanKendall wrote:In magic there's teaching and there's teaching. Ask yourself just how much detail can be on the DVDs when you are cramming fifty techniques into two hours. Well with JN's DVD there's 35 things in there and it's 155 minutes so it does teach those things fairly in detail and it's the same with Revolutionary Coin Magic but I won't start learning from that until I've got good at the stuff in JN's and MA's DVD's because I've heard there's some advanced material in that DVD.

You have obviously made up your mind, so I also have to ask - why did you ask for advice here? I had this going on 3 other magic forums other than here and that stuff is what most of the people have said I should get I posted them all at the exact same time so I didn't know what until I posted at that moment. Rather than spend 200 dollars or more on all these, get one beginner item, either from Jay or Mike or someone, and work on that. _Then_ get something else and work on that. I can only buy magic once per year so I want to have stuff that will last me for at least a year maybe even 2 years that's the only reason I'm buying all this stuff.

Not that you'll pay any attention to this advice, either.

Take care, Ian

by **dat8962** » Feb 1st, '10, 01:22

Then just go out and buy it all. It doesn't appear to matter what our opinion is anyway.

There's little point in trying to help you anymore on this thread as you've leterally thrown away the advice given by some great magicians in Ian and Peter who both have a wealth of experience.

Goodbye and good luck.

by **.robb.** » Feb 1st, '10, 03:27

Throwing away advice is worse than throwing away money. If you continue with your plan you'll be doing both.

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planning on starting coin magic in June or July of 2010

planning on starting coin magic in June or July of 2010

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