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For some reason my last topic was locked, with no apparant reason. But I think the main critism was my lack of creativity.

My initial plan for a mentalism closer (for the stage) was to be a word prediction from a set of books, but this soon progressed to being a newspaper prediction. This was too "Derren-y" and so I need to find something else.

I would love to try a Q&A routine, but I think that it would require a large audience and I know I don't have the skill to even attempt it.



So I ask: What would make a good closer to a show that is based around psychological manipulation - without it becoming too "Derren-y"?


Tom
xx

I'm not going to give direct answers, but the ideal closer ought to tie the rest of the show together in some way, and involve a lot of people. You might want to think about scale to some extent too. What's great about mentalism is that, if you can find your way to such an effect, you can lead your audience on a path through the whole show to culminate in the tiniest of reveals in the quietest of moments. I'd go super clean, too.

You can do a Q&A routine with a small audience. I wouldn't if I were you, though, because it's not psychological manipulation.

I'll say it again.... (for the last time?)

Look into the buttertub! With a bit of lateral thinking, it will provide exactly what you want to do....

Tom - I have been a staunch defender of you in the past but I'm beginning to see why you have the ability to get people's backs up!

Sean

Sorry dear Klangster

I will look into the Butter Tub Prediction, I hope it will work, though I honestly do not know why I annoy people.

The show culminates by the way, after this "closer" effect, with the reveal of a single billet that has been hanging from a clip throughout the show. It is the name of a word that was randomly chosen by someone during an ESP routine, its a simple billet switch and the prediction is only 6" squared, but it is very powerful I think

I hope thats what you meant Mr Grue, it relates back to a much earlier event in the show, and is an extra "link".

The finale could be a confabulation routine, but it seems a bit basic and non-personal.

if only someone had the foresight to put together a series of booklets many years ago - and each booklet, or step would be on an element of mentalism...and in each, it explained how to do those 'tricks' and how to practice the methods behind them...

if only eh

seriously - i no longer get frustrated at your posts...i think you're here on a wind up, or you just dont understand what it means to study books properly...

you want the answers that others have worked hard on to find, go off and educate yourself...

How about a card manipulation routine?

Eshly wrote:though I honestly do not know why I annoy people.

Attention seeking

sponge bunnies...best closer derren ever did...

Eshly wrote: I honestly do not know why I annoy people.

I think it's because sometimes you seem to send multiple posts about the same topic - even though the answer has been provided to you on other threads.

We're not likely to give specific answers here to questions about routines for your act, because it is just that : your act. What we do here is provide you with suggestions of books, dvd's, lecture notes that you should read and adapt to your requirements.

Sometimes your posts seem to almost be asking for a particular dealer item that we would recommend that you could just buy and drop into your show. (Case in point - the thread that was locked mentioned 'Random Thoughts' specifically). That really isn't the way you should be working - you should be looking at tried and tested methods and the adapting them for your own use.

In light of what the good Mr. Grue has said about tieing the whole show together, I can't help but think that the Buttertub would be absolutely perfect for you. Yes, it will mean that you will need more than one prediction for it to work properly but I think that would be a stronger closer as you could relate it to multiple events that have happened throughout the show (Think Derren's ending of Evening Of Wonders where he revealed the bit long bit of paper). Yes, you could adapt it so that the envelope is hanging over the stage througout the entire show and not need to send it to someone before the show.

In light of your Q&A question, I'd recommend reading Osterlind's 'Very Moden Mind Reader' for a great Q&A routine.

EDIT - Hang on, didn't you tell us previously that you had the Master Prediction System? Seems like you've already got a solution....

Sean

I feel like its 2003 and people who run Encyclopedias are annoyed that Wikipedia has meant everyone can get infomation easily. Find methods shouldn't be a matter of "dues", that is for presentation and entertainment.

Ofcourse I'm not here on a wind up, or I would not. The problem I find with 13 Steps is that much of it I cannot do, for example the trick requires an assistant or so on: Here is the list of stage effects from 13 Steps that are Predictions:



A Million to One:
Not big enough for a closer, and not foolproof - could fail, so its not something I'd want to risk using as my closer.

Quadruplication:
Uses playing cards, which once again turns it more from Mentalism into "Mental Magic", which is not what a Mentalist wants. Worse, this closer follows two card effect, ESP and a dartboard prediction, so having three card effects in a row would be a bit much.

De Profundis:
If this trick works it is the single best trick in the world, but it can go wrong SO SO easily and the method could be noticed. I've never even wanted to risk performing it, because the chances of it working seem so remote. Never the less, it is brilliant; unfortunetly even if it did work, it would appear to be a copy of Derren Brown's An Evening of Wonders.

The $75,000 test:
Could actually be done, and I might consider this; but it seems to "impersonal" to use numbers. I'll have to think about this one.

Atronomical:
Uses cards, see above.

The Mentalist Four Ace Trick:
Uses cards, see above.

Card in Balloon:
This is an opener

PSI Function:
I don't want to use stooges, particularly for a closer




There is therefore actually one Prediction in 13 Steps that I could use, the others have major flaws for what i want to do - I'm not saying they are bad, I'm saying they won't fit that situation. I could predict the numbers, my only worry is it seems impersonal and too implausable - but its worth checking out.

EDIT - Hang on, didn't you tell us previously that you had the Master Prediction System? Seems like you've already got a solution....

I don't think so... I've used the RPS a lot, but not the MPS... o.O

Aaaaaaaaaaaarghh!!

DON'T Just take the routines!!! Play with them, adapt them, think about them. Why not try taking the elements you like out of a couple of routines and seeing what happens when you put them together?

Klangster1971 wrote:Aaaaaaaaaaaarghh!!

DON'T Just take the routines!!! Play with them, adapt them, think about them. Why not try taking the elements you like out of a couple of routines and seeing what happens when you put them together?

I think I shall

The perfect routine in there was making the spectator say the serial number of a bank note; but I fear the method is very shakey. If I can find another way to achieve this then it will be the perfect closer; "You know whats inside this box" sort of puzzle.


Tom
xx

Eshly wrote:I feel like its 2003 and people who run Encyclopedias are annoyed that Wikipedia has meant everyone can get infomation easily. Find methods shouldn't be a matter of "dues",

A word of warning; That statement will probably get you a lot of flack (quite rightly so) off many people on here. As much as you say that finding method shouldn't be a matter of dues, what you really mean is you can't be bothered to look and just want it served up to you on a plate.. part of the internet generation basically (I am by the way 18 so yes I'm of the same generation but I don't expect such ease of finding info). Seriously though, one of the great disadvantages of you wanting us to serve you up ready crafted and tested tidbits is that you won't pick up any of the incidental gold-dust that you would have got if you'd trawled through the books, lecutre notes and VHS/DVD's like the rest of us. Give it a try- get out there and study.. god knows how many priceless gems you'll pick up on the way!

Eshly wrote:

EDIT - Hang on, didn't you tell us previously that you had the Master Prediction System? Seems like you've already got a solution....

I don't think so... I've used the RPS a lot, but not the MPS... o.O

Sorry to say this, Tom but - these are direct quotes from you:

Dec 26 2009 - "Your talking to someone who saved up for the Master Prediction System in under a week"

Jan 5 - 2010 "I have the MPS, its worth it."

So, you've been lying to us? Or do you just get confused?

Klangster1971 wrote:

Eshly wrote:

EDIT - Hang on, didn't you tell us previously that you had the Master Prediction System? Seems like you've already got a solution....

I don't think so... I've used the RPS a lot, but not the MPS... o.O

Sorry to say this, Tom but - these are direct quotes from you:

Dec 26 2009 - "Your talking to someone who saved up for the Master Prediction System in under a week"

Jan 5 - 2010 "I have the MPS, its worth it."

So, you've been lying to us? Or do you just get confused?

Both apparantly. I don't remember saying either of those things, but then again I remember very little of anything I've ever said/did.



Appologise :s

Are you Michael Kras in disguise?? (and by the way, I like Michael very much, but I'm sure some of you will remember 'the Kras era' here on TM quite well )