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I have been looking around for ultracinese recently and I have spotted some fakes on ebay. I would never buy a trick which was a copy but it got me thinking.Is magic overpriced?If someone in China is able to copy the ultracinese gimmick and sell it for 1/10 of the price then are we being ripped off?I realise that some of the money goes to the creator but still.

What do you guys think?

A knock off wouldn't work if they weren't cheaper.

Well, the fake Ultracinese's are in fact modified "Butt Plugs", so that's enough reason for me to buy the genuine one!

Mark Waddington wrote:Well, the fake Ultracinese's are in fact modified "Butt Plugs", so that's enough reason for me to buy the genuine one!

This is quite possibly the funniest thing that I have ever read.

I have a genuine Ultracinese bought two weeks ago from World Magic Store that's had a couple of hours practice use.

Boxed with all of the bits and pieces and the WMS accompanying DVD.

If you're interested in making me a decent offer then I'd consider parting with it.

dat8962 wrote:I have a genuine Ultracinese bought two weeks ago from World Magic Store that's had a couple of hours practice use.

Boxed with all of the bits and pieces and the WMS accompanying DVD.

If you're interested in making me a decent offer then I'd consider parting with it.

May I ask why your selling it?

it's not something that suits me for a variety of reasons. It was definately a CUPS purchase.

I'm not sure whether to sell or to persevere with it.

magicollie wrote:I have been looking around for ultracinese recently and I have spotted some fakes on ebay. I would never buy a trick which was a copy but it got me thinking.Is magic overpriced?If someone in China is able to copy the ultracinese gimmick and sell it for 1/10 of the price then are we being ripped off?I realise that some of the money goes to the creator but still.

What do you guys think?

I think that if you genuinely don't know the answer to this question, then you should not be involved in magic at any level. And if you are trolling then you should do so elsewhere.

One example of why you miss the point: someone comes up with a brilliant switch technique that is invisible but easy to perform. They sell it for £30, even though it only uses pieces of regular paper. They are selling the technique/idea/gimmick, not the paper. Someone else buys the instructions and sells the idea on for £10. Can you *honestly* not see what is wrong with that, and why the £10 deal is not value for money but rather will prevent further commercial releases of good ideas?

Ted wrote:

magicollie wrote:I have been looking around for ultracinese recently and I have spotted some fakes on ebay. I would never buy a trick which was a copy but it got me thinking.Is magic overpriced?If someone in China is able to copy the ultracinese gimmick and sell it for 1/10 of the price then are we being ripped off?I realise that some of the money goes to the creator but still.

What do you guys think?

I think that if you genuinely don't know the answer to this question, then you should not be involved in magic at any level. And if you are trolling then you should do so elsewhere.

One example of why you miss the point: someone comes up with a brilliant switch technique that is invisible but easy to perform. They sell it for £30, even though it only uses pieces of regular paper. They are selling the technique/idea/gimmick, not the paper. Someone else buys the instructions and sells the idea on for £10. Can you *honestly* not see what is wrong with that, and why the £10 deal is not value for money but rather will prevent further commercial releases of good ideas?

Your missing what im saying completely.I was saying that the fact that people can make exact copy of the items (Even thought I think its terrible) and sell it at such a lower price then the genuine item is over-charging us a bit.This is not my view its just a thought.

And what Ted is trying to convey is that you are not paying for the gimmick but the idea behind the gimmick.

It would be like ripping off anybodies idea however most other ideas are patented. It's a catch 22 with magic because once you patent the idea it becomes publicly available.

i get you - but i dont agree....

you're not only paying for the product, you're paying the person for their creativity, thoughts, trial and error...that kinda thing, you dont HAVE to buy it afterall...

and also, when things cost a little more - all chinese cheating manufacturers aside, the secret is protected a little more amongst those that DO buy the proper product...because you've paid a decent price, you want to protect its secret more...

magicollie wrote:I have been looking around for ultracinese recently and I have spotted some fakes on ebay. I would never buy a trick which was a copy but it got me thinking.Is magic overpriced?If someone in China is able to copy the ultracinese gimmick and sell it for 1/10 of the price then are we being ripped off?I realise that some of the money goes to the creator but still.

What do you guys think?

The only person being ripped off is the originator of the effect! Just because someone can copy an idea and sell it cheaper doesn't mean it's ethical and it certainly doesn't guarantee same quality - you get what you pay for.

IAIN wrote:i get you - but i dont agree....

you're not only paying for the product, you're paying the person for their creativity, thoughts, trial and error...that kinda thing, you dont HAVE to buy it afterall...

and also, when things cost a little more - all chinese cheating manufacturers aside, the secret is protected a little more amongst those that DO buy the proper product...because you've paid a decent price, you want to protect its secret more...

Great point,thank you very much.I agree with you.

No-one has mentioned development costs. (ok maybe Iain as Trial and error)

One item I have been working on for nearly two years has cost several hundred pounds in development.

I know a lot of people also make several prototypes before sale that they send to playtesters.

It all adds up and at the end of the day ensures the product you buy has been tested by various peeps (:p), in various settings and with materials that will last.

Harris wrote:No-one has mentioned development costs. (ok maybe Iain as Trial and error)

One item I have been working on for nearly two years has cost several hundred pounds in development.

I know a lot of people also make several prototypes before sale that they send to playtesters.

It all adds up and at the end of the day ensures the product you buy has been tested by various peeps (:p), in various settings and with materials that will last.

I never thought it would cost that much and take that long!wow!I love the bit of street lingo you through in there,thanks for your comment.