talkmagic.co.uk

Hi there!

I have been working on the top palm for a card for a few days, but because I have very small hands, I can't hold the card with just three fingers - I need all four and even then it's close. This means that my hand looks really strange when I'm holding a card, and it's obvious (well, to me anyway) that there's something fishy going on.

Should I just wait and see if my hands grow , am I doing something wrong, or should I just forget the top palm and work on a cop instead?

Kati

Kati - I'm no expert, but have read many times that the size of the hands is irrelevant in sleights. I'm sure that there must be a minimal hand size though. For instance (a hypothetical situation), if there were a super intelligent 5-year old who had been able to learn the mechanics of the classic pass, G***e, B*** *a***, T** ***m etc., I doubt that (s)he would be able to do it competently, even with Bridge rather than Poker cards. I know that misdirection & patter are vitally important in a performance but if they were eliminated or minimised by performing for a video clip, I suspect that the youngster would perform significantly worse than an expert cardician.

This hypothetical situation may provoke a heated exchange of comments from those more experienced than I am. I think the overall comment will be along the lines of "practice, practice, practice" but we'll see.

Lay a card on your hand. If there is a position in which the card does not overlap then your hand is big enough.

You say you can't hold the card with just three fingers, I would suggest that three is two too many! When classic palming a card I hold it with pressure from the pad of my little finger and my hand at the base of my thumb on the opposite diagonal. The other fingers come into contact with the card for sure, but they are olny curled loosly in a natural position.

nickj wrote:You say you can't hold the card with just three fingers, I would suggest that three is two too many! When classic palming a card I hold it with pressure from the pad of my little finger and my hand at the base of my thumb on the opposite diagonal. The other fingers come into contact with the card for sure, but they are olny curled loosly in a natural position.

Ah...that may be it as I have been using all four fingers pressing the card against the base of my hand. I see what you mean using the pinky - it's going to take getting used to but it is much easier to hold.

JuanTheMan wrote:G***e, B*** *a***, T** ***m

This reminds me of a column by Groucho Marx when he talked about the censor. The end finally denera*ed in*o a me*s ** b*a*k l*ne* *n* *t g*t v**y h**d ** **********...



Kati

There are also other types of palms you can utilise. Luckily I am blessed with ridiculously long fingers, so haven't really looked into these. Andy nyman mentions one he uses, because he has the same problem as you, on his dvd get nyman. And sitting here at work the name is on the tip of my tongue. I am sure someone here will be able to put a name to it. A small amount of research will probably find it. Sorry I can't be of any/more help.

nickj wrote:When classic palming a card I hold it with pressure from the pad of my little finger and my hand at the base of my thumb on the opposite diagonal. The other fingers come into contact with the card for sure, but they are only curled loosly in a natural position.

Yes, that's what I do, but if I let my index, middle and ring fingers relax, they separate slightly and the card can be seen. I try to hold my fingers together but in a slightly flexed position. I feel that it's unnatural and tense and, when I see it in a mirror, it looks odd to me. I've been caught out a few times. I guess it's down to practice.

katrielalex wrote:This reminds me of a column by Groucho Marx when he talked about the censor. The end finally denera*ed in*o a me*s ** b*a*k l*ne* *n* *t g*t v**y h**d ** **********...

LOL

There was a magician whos name escapes me right now, he is mentioned in David Blaines book Mysterious Stranger, who had very small hands yet he was a master of card magic. Obviously he would have suffered from similar problems but do you know what he also became a master of....? Misdirection!!! Thru mastery of both sleights and misdirection he was able to conceal any awkward card handling moments that arose from his small hands!

The magician with very small hands was Max Malini I believe. It is said that his misdirection was so good that he could successfully palm cards even though his hands were no bigger than the average 5 year olds. Although I am not sure whether this is one of those tales that has become somewhat exagerated, it definitely highlights the point with all sleights - misdirection is more important that super quick fancy fingerwork.
G

JuanTheMan wrote:Yes, that's what I do, but if I let my index, middle and ring fingers relax, they separate slightly and the card can be seen. I try to hold my fingers together but in a slightly flexed position. I feel that it's unnatural and tense and, when I see it in a mirror, it looks odd to me. I've been caught out a few times. I guess it's down to practice.
LOL

You're not doing it far wrong by the sounds of things- you should let your fingers relax and dont look tense. Yes, if you look carefully, you will see the card through the fingers, but if you keep your hand moving then noone will notice it. If you need to keep it concealed for a long time, simply hold your hand in a position where the gaps cant be seen (ie angle it). A lot of it comes down to confidence -the more natural you look, the less suspicion you will arouse. This of course goes hand in hand with the misdirection...