talkmagic.co.uk

Last week I did two slots in an open=air event.

The sound was naff but I managed to overcome that by shouting (although that makes doing magic more difficult and is different from the conditions in which you practice).

There were 350+ people out there with a large passing trade as well. One of the tricks went down because the heat had made two parts stick together but I maganed to overcome this too by telling the audience they wouldn't enjoy that trick and moving on quickly. Many thought that it was part of the act as it made my helper from the crowd look like she'd had a part to play in it not working.

All in all, I went out there, did the stuff and the patter was fluid enough to be changed and used without problem for both sets. BUT

How do you persuade event organisers that magic is not a 'kid's slot'?

The stuff I did - vanishing coke bottle - change bag - die box, crystal silk and dream bag (dumped at start of second set) went well and the act wasn't aimed at kids and tyet I still can't convince them that magic is an adult (and all-age therefore) entertainment.

Any suggestions or am I alone in my experience?

Vic

Some of the effects you have there are very much reconised as kids effects.
In many cases however magic is pretty much always associated with kids.
As an example I was working a restaurant last week with my partner and he had just done a load of hard core sleight of hand stuff for a table when I walked past. He introduced me since they had expressed an interest in hiring us for a wedding. He told them we did different kinds of magic with myself doing more of the mind magic. The response was that maybe he should do the kids and I should do the adults at their wedding.
Bear in mind he had just spent 15 minutes entertaining a table of adults with magic that was far from kids magic.

So my suggestion
1. Change effects like a change bag and Die Box these are kids effects.
2. Accept that you are fighting a stereo type.

I havent been fortunate enough yet to be able to perform live but I do still feel I can offer a suggestion.

There are tricks out there that have or can be adapted to have an ADULT theme, something risque etc. By perhaps demonstrating some of your more adult material to an event organiser this would aid in proving your point.

The problem is that I didn't tell them what the tricks were in the first place (they didn't ask and the message fitted with what I used).

The material wasn't kids material in the main (Change bag was especially worked out for children) and the selection was finalised by me after I had been billed in running order as being in the middle of both kids slots.

I had a handcuff and mail bag escape set for the second set (which was to be an adult tragetted piece) but abandonded this after reading order.

The problem is that evenm when I first discussed the content and ideas - the people involved were fixed in their thinking that magic was a kid's thing!

Frustrating isn't it!

But it's part of the learning curve for me as I've been doing magic in church service settings for about five years (where I make it what I want and there's no pigeon holes available as far as others are concerned.

Vic

Jordan,

Thanks for comments (all input is useful whether you've done it or not!).

The problem here was that I was doing the stuff in a Church Celebration in a public place and of therefore in this scenario risque would not have been acceptable.

The message associated with the stuff was not children's stuff and to have presented it in a purely theological setting would have been outside the scope of many, The fact is though, what makes a diebox a kids trick? After all, the adults raise an eyebrow and think to themselves "I know how this is done!' and yet they always ask the question "O.K, where did the die go?"

There is much that appeals to the child in all of us (this is called magic) and I have seen the same tricks used in adult and children's settings and it works. I think that we have a danger with magic of thinking that an 'adult' contenet is required to render something adult and an immature or childish approach is needed (i.e. slapstick and visiual comedy - one of the mainstays of Bavarian adult humour!!!) for kids.

Thanks for the comments . . . keep them coming.

Are others fighting this battle to get magic recognised as an across the board art form I wonder. I have watched lots of Tommy Cooper and his stuff is age insensitive in that it appeals (and works) with a broad spectrum of ages.

Thanks again,

Vic

I feel that a mixture of slightly risque/adult material and visual slapstick works well with all. Ok some are going to always say that magic is for kids and all I can say to them is thank god I'm not them because they have clearly lost the point to life. We are here to enjoy and learn, to enthral and be enthralled etc so if someone regards an art form as just for kids then they must be living lives that are way too serious.

i turn up perform and don't realy think about wether people see it as kids magic or not i mix prop based magic with close up magic as the show dictates i don't uasualy work with a microphone prefering shoots none verbal style unless I'm in a close up situation and when i do, i bring along a pair of headset radio mikes and jack into there system (one of each frequency red/green).
most often I'm providing the disco music as well so the setup is different i find i get a wide range of bookings which would siggest I'm not being typecast

i guess its my performance style that makes it universal and my grounding in cold reading / nlp which gives me the edge.

I personally don't do kids magic...not that I don't like kids, just couldn't eat a whole one.....the old jokes are the best!

Seriously though, I therefore pitch my advertising towards that, my yellow pages advert etc

However, I still get people phoning me to do kids magic....I just tell them that I am not a kids magician, I say that I specalise in corporate magic, private parties, wedding receptions and fetes open days etc, I also state that although I say I am an adult entertainer I am not blue....I cater for an adult audience but can entertain audiences from older teenagers up.

I also specalise in close-up and although I have done stage work I am not comfortable doing it, I love performing close-up.....I feel that it is important to ask the booker what audience you are expected to perform to and then decide if you want to take the booking....

If I was told that it was mostly children, I would state that I am not a childrens performer and I wouldn't take the booking I would pass it on to some of my friends who are childrens entertainers.

This is a very similar approach to the one that I take and for very much the same the same reasons.

Adults are more manageable and do as they're told

That's a good approach for, having seen silisosidge in Tamworth doing a kid's party, there is a skill in terms of patter, production and trick selection that it outside my scope and also, sadly, probably outside who I am.

The problem is that everything these days is reduced to a functional level and I think that Magic is as much (if not more) who you are rather than what you do. The one comes from the other and I'm sure there must be horror stories of people who have gone to a venue to find that they are the follow-up to 'Mr Bubbles and his magic balloons (if there is such a person - sorry - made it up really ) whilst they saw themselves as Derren Brown's lookalike.

You can tell them but they don't seem to (want to?) hear.

Vic

Vic wrote:

I think that Magic is as much (if not more) who you are rather than what you do.

I'd agree with this and there are plenty out there who are trying to copy the likes of Blane and Brown. Whatever tricks you perform I think that it's important, no vital to be yourself.

A magician without personality is just some person who does tricks. By being yourself and injecting the extremer ends of your probably crazy personality you become a showman!!

The problem I have is with magicians who have no personality, no patter and bore you with their lecture style approach to magic is this. . .

I don't want facts - I want to be entertained, confused, frustrated and amazed. I know it's a trick and even though I might know how it's done, the misdirection, the person I'm engaging with and the flair captivate me.

I often find myself corenerd by someone who knows the machanical actions of a trick, they show me the trick, then another, then another - I had a chap come up to me at a club I visited down south and he not only cornered me, showing me trick after trick, but then informed me that he could do over a hundred different tricks. Pity he couldn't make himself disapear

I think it was Maskelyne who was approached by a man who told him that he knew a large number of tricks only to be met with the response "Oh really, I only know about ten!" How I understand what he was trying to communicate

(probably got it wrong, but essentially correct I think)

Vic

vic_vdb wrote:I think it was Maskelyne who was approached by a man who told him that he knew a large number of tricks only to be met with the response "Oh really, I only know about ten!" How I understand what he was trying to communicate

(probably got it wrong, but essentially correct I think)

Vic

Essentially correct....however the quote you refer to is in the preface of RRTCM....

It states.....

Many years ago David Devant, the great English conjurer, was approached by an acquaintance new to sleitht-of-hand with cards. " Mr Devant, said this young man, "I know three hundred tricks with cards. How many do you know?" Devant glanced at the youth quizzicaly. " I should say," the magician responded dryly, " that I now about eight."

Devant was making a point with which all professional magicians are familiar. To perform card tricks entertainingly you must not only know how the tricks are done, but how to do them. There is a vast difference between the two, and if proof were needed, one need only watch the same feat performed by a novice and by an expert performer.

As I said essentially correct....but the point is the same.....

I think it's important to know when to stop....It's very easy I think, when you are new to magic or maybe new to performing to real people, if you get a good audience or find a group that likes your magic to stick with them....when in reality you must move on and get the job done or essentially know when to stop and put the tricks or cards away.

Here you must wait until you are asked to show more and then and only then can you think about showing one or two more.

I've seen it happen, and I have also been asked by bookers to "go on, go round the tables once more" when I have maybe been round them twice. I tell them, no sorry, you must trust me on this, but people can get magiced out, they will get to the stage where they can have too much magic, most people want to get on with their conversations and their general interacitons with the others in the group they are with.....they might end up saying.....That magician was good but he bored the @ss off us in the end as we couldn't get rid of him!!!

Thank you for that Jack.

I knew I'd seen it somewhere. Thank you for setting the record straight.

Vic