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For a demonstration of how powerful a gaffed deck can be, look up Henry Evans. Beautiful work, which leads me back to the mantra "It's not the cause but the effect that matters".

Heckler wrote:

Lawrence wrote:Urgh...

Care to expand on that?

I think Tomo summed it up quite nicely

Tomo wrote:"It's not the cause but the effect that matters".

If a gimmick makes something easier... use It!

Like some people have already said, I do love the smug feeling i get whenever somebody asks to look at the deck after a card trick and the look of wonder spreads across their face as they realise it is just a normal deck of cards.

My I.D does get great reactions, but i won't be 100% happy until i can master reverses so i can get the same (maybe not exactly the same, but similar) effect with a normal deck.

I'm more than happy to use gimmicks at the moment, until I can practise and hone my skills in other areas. I think everyone gets into magic wanting to do something immediately, so a gimmick helps achieve that and at the same time also helps with developing performance.

cartorious wrote: My I.D does get great reactions, but i won't be 100% happy until i can master reverses so i can get the same (maybe not exactly the same, but similar) effect with a normal deck.

What you'll realise when you've learnt to do an ID effect without an ID is the reason you should always just use an ID.
Though I do suggest you travel this path as many of us gimmick users already have!

Lawrence wrote:Though I do suggest you travel this path as many of us gimmick users already have!

And that is excellent advice, whether you reach that conclusion or not.

Heckler wrote:

Lawrence wrote:Though I do suggest you travel this path as many of us gimmick users already have!

And that is excellent advice, whether you reach that conclusion or not.

I would urge anyone to run it to completion. Just for the realisation you get at the end of it that you don't need all the stupidly complicated sleights you've just learnt. It;s a kind of Magical Zen state.
I spent years learning how to do tricks using a regular deck of cards using sleight of hand; now I know it doesn't really matter and a rough and smooth deck makes life so much easier.

Just buy Lawrence's ILC deck - I'd say it is the only gaff deck that gets the same reaction, if not bigger, than an ID!

The4thCircle wrote:There are of course some routine using gimmicks that are either never seen or get switched out for the genuine article as part of the act, so at the end the audience is never aware a gimmick was used and will assume they ARE examining everything at the end. That, in my mind, is how shells should be used. If it's ostensibly a four coin trick, and they never see more than four coins, unless they already know you used a shell, they have no reason to assume you used more than the four coins infront of them.

-Stacy

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Hello Stacy,

Just to clarify my post a little.
I'm not totally against the use of gaff cards. I have several routines which require them.
"Fairy Tale Frogs" John Guastaferro, a trick which I have just got down, & I love very much,
& "The Key Card" Mark Mason. One of the first card tricks I learned, & one which I still like to do from time to time.

Having said that, I still think people need to have a basic handling skill with cards.
I can remember when I first began, I was all fingers, & thumbs.
There are, as I am sure you are aware, many self working tricks out there using a regular deck, at a fraction of the cost of buying gaffs, &
IMHO, time & money would be better spent learning a few good self working tricks first.
I think it builds a good foundation for any future card work, gaffed or not.

I think some of the effects using gaff cards are wonderful, but I also no that many are a waste of money.

Just my thoughts, good to hear you had a good holiday.

CArlxx

To those who enjoy it when a spectator asks to see a deck and you feel all warm and fuzzy inside because you can hand them the deck and be done with it.

A) So what now they know that you are using sleight of hand and not a gimmicked deck, I fail to see the difference they have still figured out it is just a trick.
B) Your spectator is still looking at your magic like a puzzle that they are supposed to figure out.

Personally I like it when they are so entertained they don't really want to know how it is done, yes they know it is a trick but they don't care, they want to enjoy the magic.

I really like it when I hand the spectator a deck of cards to hold for a moment when I reach for a pen, and gimmicked or not they just hold the deck. They don't look at it, they don't shuffle it, they just hold it. This tells me that the deck is never even suspect. This lets me know that at least I have done that part of my job correctly.

To those who think a gimmick is doing things the easy way, I think you are wrong. The key is to use the best (which is usually the easiest) method to produce the best effect. Both will require the practice and rehersal it takes to create a reputation maker.

There is only one reason I can think of to learn a total sleight of hand ID. That reason being is you are performing in front of magicians. And it fools magicians because they will all think you are doing the Classic ID. But in the end it is the volunteer who spreads through the deck and finds the reversed card.

There are two problems with this. One, it has been done and if you are going to perform in front of magicians they have probably seen it already. Two, it is hard to do.

If you are performing the effect in front of a lay audience, and you perform well, they don't know the difference and you have now spent hours upon hours learning something that you never needed and those hours could have been put to better use.

I too believe that the ID, while wonderful an out, is also wasted as an out, it is too beautiful a piece of magic to be used as an out.

CArlight1958 wrote:Just to clarify my post a little....
... I still think people need to have a basic handling skill with cards.
I can remember when I first began, I was all fingers, & thumbs.
There are, as I am sure you are aware, many self working tricks out there using a regular deck, at a fraction of the cost of buying gaffs, & IMHO, time & money would be better spent learning a few good self working tricks first.
I think it builds a good foundation for any future card work, gaffed or not.

I couldn't agree more! I said as much in my first post on this thread, for which some people thought I was heavily anti-gimmick!

CArlight1958 wrote:Just my thoughts, good to hear you had a good holiday.

Thankyou! It really was splendid.

-Stacy

bmat wrote:There is only one reason I can think of to learn a total sleight of hand ID. That reason being is you are performing in front of magicians. And it fools magicians because they will all think you are doing the Classic ID. But in the end it is the volunteer who spreads through the deck and finds the reversed card.

You've not seen Michael Close's ID with a regular deck then?

Thanks for the advice and recommendations folks!!

Much appreciated

Honestly, if somebody asked to see the deck it's most likely not because they thought it was a trick deck or anything like that. It's more because the way you handled the deck and your attitude had a "guilty" vibe to it. Once you learn to get rid of that vibe and act like you have nothing to prove or hide, people will pick up on that and will be less likely to want to see the cards.

Or you could just perform with a regular deck of cards, have them shuffle and cut the cards and then after said effect, do a deck switch and go into a ID. They'll be freaked out because earlier on they handled the deck and everything. In fact this was one of Dai Vernon's idea's when he came up with his Color Changing Deck routine.

But in the long run, it's not the method that counts, it's the over all effect and how you handle yourself that counts. This can simply be achieved by rehearsal and lots and lots of practice, not only with the effect/gimmick but also with your body language as well.