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Hi Guys,

Criss Angel - Hellstromism

Not sure why I sat through this (never realised how annoying he really is)

Anyway he claimed that he's been mastering the art of Hellstromism (Muscle Reading) for years bla bla bla.

Makes a bet with this car lot owner that he can find a set of keys (for a $100k Dodge Viper hidden by owner in a random car of approx 100). I think he had 30 mins, If he finds them he keeps the car, If he doesn't he has to pay $100k.

I should explain he was locked in a room before the owner hides the keys.

Criss then claims just by reading the guys muscles (through a piece of cloth held by owner and Criss) he will locate the hidden keys.

He is evetually led by the owner (hmm) to the car, finds the keys and bags himself a new Dodge Viper.

Now I am a bit of a synic when it comes to 'Muscle Reading' (and Criss Angel) anyway but is anyone else inclined to believe that he was more likely signalled by someone who maybe knew where the keys were hidden rather than using his skill of Hellstromism.

Did he really just steal it?

If I remember correctly, Angel had Banachek as one of his advisers. As such, it's very possible he got some hands-on training with one of the best before working on the show. That said, because it's TV, he probably used a different method.

Muscle reading does work though; the ideomotor response is legit.

I would agree that muscle reading does work although I've only ever utilized it on a small scale. It probably is the case though that what was told on tv is far different to what transpired in real life. I get the feeling that a fair few of Mr. Angels illutions nowadays are simply set ups and that the actual magical skill went out the window a while back. It is common knowledge though that people like these tv faces actually have well known and famous advisors behind the scenes so who really knows. In the end, love him or hate him, he's got you questioning how it actually happened so imagin how the average Joe would feel. I'd say that even if you feel like he's not being honest he's done the job of fooling people.

Saying that I'm still not a fan of his as he seems to be the insperation for these youtube kids with their freshly brought 'E' tricks.

I have to wonder if it's more likely that he was able to read the dealer and find the key on a 4 acre plot...
...or that that it's a complete set-up by a guy well known for using an audience entirely made up of stooges, employing camera tricks, cuts and so on.

Derren Brown finds keys hidden in venice (i think) - real muscle reading
Criss Angel finds keys hidden in car lot - faked lol


Some people's ideomoter responses are stronger than others and some people can almost tug you in the right direction without realising it.

Angel hasnt done himself any favours by doing obviously faked stuff and using stooges but i think this is do-able

I think that when some one like Derren Brown does something like this though it's a little different, I mean it could all be staged in a similar way but if you compare the two magicains, Derren has the personality of someone who would practice over and over to aquire such a skill, where as Chris doesn't seem the type. Derren paints and seems to have a slight obsessive personality and willingness to absorb any and all infomation, again Chris does not. So, I would be more inclined to believe one over the other although I still wouldn't rule out the possibility that both are accomplished by some means other than muscle reading. They are magicians after all so nothing is as it seems.

Yeah i agree,

Cant remember what season of mind freak it was (when he had a beard) so 5 i think, he did 2 episodes that were back to basic and just about slight of hand, card tricks, TT's etc to prove he could do that stuff as well and they were amazing !

If only he stuck to stuff like that instead of flying about lol

Yes. I don't really watch him but of course have seen some of his stuff. He can do what I'd call regular magic and so that what makes me more annoyed with his big effects. To me they just seem very plastic, you know, tacky and fake. I know he's not really walking on water, but I like to think that really good magic would even have magicians caught up in the moment rather than having part of their minds trying to work it out. This might just be a magicians point of view but some of my favourtie pieces of magic I just find myself watching as though I'm just a spectator again and only after I go back into magician mode. A good example would be Teller's Shadows. I could think of verious ways in which that could be acomplished, but when I watched that for the first time I wasn't thinking of any of those.

For me it was Tellers misers dream on fool us (derren says in his book that trick turned him back to a amazed kid while watching it)

I dont like the big effects either and are so obviously fake even to layman (floating, walking on water) i dont know why he does them.

I admire big illutions even though they're not something I would see myself doing, however I feel that unless they're performed really well they often seem to have the air about them that it's the prop rather than the magician doing the effect. The idea that anyone could go up there, take five minutes being told the instructions and do exactly the same thing.

Many thanks for all the responses

Taking all into account I''ve decided he stole it (the car).

I don't think anyone will persuade me to believe otherwise, thinking about it now I've never really seen him demonstrate any 'skill' at all i.e. card manipulation, sleights of hand, or a routine that involves him performing a sleight or move multiple times such as an ACR etc.

That's fine and all, magic is displayed and communicated in many different ways, I'm not saying you have to be a cardician or sleight of hand expert to be considered a magician but the fact that Criss is neither of those things tells me he isn't the type of person to take the time to learn, practice and master the skills required in order to demonstrate them.

This leads me to believe that if he hasn't studied card magic or sleights to the same extent as say, Dai Vernon or Daryl, then he probably hasn't studied mentalism or hellstromism to the same extent as someone like Derren Brown in order to accomplish such a feat (locating the key).
He must of studied the 'How to be a Pop / MTV culture Magician' book. He only seems to use gimmicks/props for close up rather than technical ability, his bigger illusions e.g. Climbing through a glass window, obviously use stooges and his 'Grand Illusions' well don't get me started on them.

I suppose the point I'm trying to make is that Criss doesn't claim or demonstrate to be either a card magician, sleight expert , mentalist exclusively but I believe to be able to achieve what he did with finding the key to the Dodge in the manner he claims you would have to be either incredibly lucky or intensively studied, well practised and a true master of the art, in my opinion he is neither.

Well as was said earlier, apparently he did do some bits on a series where he actually did smaller more close up effects. I've not seen this as I don't exactly set my tv to record his shows, but if this is the case then he must have some ability. I would say that on a whole he's not at all an especially good magician, he's just perfect for marketing by the tv companies. He is known for his use of editing and stooges so yes I'd think twice about his big illutions as well as the points I've already given.

Anyway all in all I'd just say he's an average magician, not someone who will go down in history such as Cardini, Vernon, Elmsley and probably people like Derren, Lennart Green, Guy Hollingworth, ect...

As for the car he apparently won or stole. I'm sure it's a set up as no one is really going to steal a car, especially in the land where people has successfully sued Cigarette companies for getting cancer from smoking. It has set up written all over it.

For anyone thats bothered its season 4 and the 2 "good" episodes are called 'up close' and 'in your face'.

Thanks Jon.

I'm no fan of his style, but I'll watch those episodes just so I've seen (what I assume to be) him at his best.

I watched the series before he started doing things that made me feel like I was watching a cartoon.

It is possible to pull off flying and other such things in a way that doesn't make you look overly silly and stupid. David Copperfield flew during one of his shows and it looked great. it was subtle and it wasn't over the top and he wasn't screaming at the top of his lungs while he did it. He acted like a normal bloke would if they had the power to fly (sort of). Also Copperfield tends to mix close up stuff with his big stage stuff and often times he does minor things as well.

The main problem with Criss Angel is that it's been pointed out by literally everybody that he has SFX and stooges, a lot of the effects he's done were things that you would NEED a stooge for, or a big set up.