talkmagic.co.uk

Reading my old magazines,I come across a article in "Magic" magazine by David Kaye (SillyBilly) in which he conducts a survey with other kids entertainers,one of the questions was,"How many effects do you perform in your (1hr) show",and the average answer was....6!!...I was surprised by this,as I feel that just 6 effects in a hour,the booker is being cheated,I perform 3 effects in the FIRST 5 MINUTES (Appearing straw/bottle from silks....one of the silks being a rose to silk/and Airborne) and all this is before I go into the main portion of my show...
I dislike these Magicians that state they can get 20 minutes from this routine,or that routine,YOU ARE BOOKED AS A MAGICIAN,DO AS MUCH MAGIC AS POSSIBLE!!!...What do others think?

Chubby Harris wrote:I dislike these Magicians that state they can get 20 minutes from this routine,or that routine,YOU ARE BOOKED AS A MAGICIAN,DO AS MUCH MAGIC AS POSSIBLE!!!...What do others think?

What I think is that you are indeed booked to do as much magic as possible.

This is not necessarily the same as doing as many tricks as possible.

However, for kids' shows, the two could be pretty much interchangeable. I don't do them, so can't comment specifically.

I'd say that you are booked to entertain kids with magic as the vehicle, they will not remember how many tricks you did, just whether the kids had a great time or not. If you can do one trick for an hour and thoroughly entertain everyone, then good luck to you, mind you can't see that being very likely but hopefully the point is clear.

The key to being a performer of ANY kind is to entertain. A magician at a children's show, as said by Toad, is there to entertain the children—no mean feat—by use of magical methods.

I have seen children's performers drag single effects (sponge ball routines, for example) out for as long as they NEED... i.e. the performer can gauge when the children are getting bored, and then move on to something else to grab their attention. It's the skill and quality of the performer to be receptive to their audience, and I think that children's magicians/entertainers are absolute heroes in this respect.

Children have a very short attention span—and once stimulated by something, it's better to perpetuate rather than terminate. Ergo, I feel that cramming a much in as possible is a waste of time. Bear in mind that a child will marvel at the more subtle things such as repetition, comedy and 'sucker' effects. Don't get me wrong, I think a children's entertainer should 'come prepared', and have a lot in their repertoire—but unlike a structured adult performance, the children's entertainer is much more likely to go with the flow and have a much more ad-lib performance.

Children generally aren't the paying customer, and most parents will judge the quality of a performance on how well the kids were kept entertained. If this means 'Mr Majjik' turning up and doing sponge rabbits for an hour whilst keeping 20 kids reeling around the floor in laughter, then they have surely fulfilled their contract.

Therefore, said performer has given value for money.

Conversely, a performer booked for an adult show is expected to deliver more for the money. Adult's brains can work in 'lag', and their capacity for more input on an intellectual level is much higher. Add to this the fact that adults take a lot more to become 'stimulated' and you will agree that the more you can fit in, the more they will feel that they have been delivered value for money.

Value for money
All said and done, a performer is generally a running a business, with their act being their product. It is far more economical and sensible as a businessperson to have a smaller, tighter show to carry round, surely?

Value for money from a magician isn't about how much can be crammed into a short space of time, IMHO. It's the quality that counts.

Quality over quantity. That's the bottom line in this discussion. If you feel the NEED to cram so many effects into your routine, then you are probably working far too hard and worrying about it far too much.

(This is simply an opinion, I am NOT a children's entertainer)

Some people are missing the point,I am not saying the show should be BAM,BAM,BAM,as this would be just as boring,but I do believe in giving value for money,would a parent say to another,"We paid him X amount of money,and all he did was X amount of tricks,I will not be booking him again"
I certainly do NOT perform in the above style,yet I do believe in giving value for money!!!!

is he refering to tricks, or Routines?
I have that MMagic at home, so may well look it up tonight if i get the chance..
.

okey dokey let me put my thinking cap on, wait wile i blow the dust off it.

erm ok then:-
stamp book (clouring book) 5mins including stamp vanish.
cut and restored rope 4mins
slideing die box 10 mins with byplay and sucker ending.
milky die 10mins easily.
run rabbit run 10mins jumbo find the rabbit ending.
sponge routine 5mins
misers dream 5mins jumbo ending
close up table stuff 5mins-1hour.

7 tricks 59 mins sounds about right to me.

Without going into my full kids show breakdown,within THE FIRST 5 MINUTES,I perform appearing Straw,into bottle from Silks,into Airborne....
3 effects before I have even really started!!!!

Do you find that parents rate you on the number of tricks you do rather than how well you entertained the kids?

I have no experience of either performing kids magic or of being a parent, but I think that however many tricks you performed that I would be grateful if any kids in my charge were kept entertained for an hour.

I suppose if you enjoy performing a number of effects and it isn't confusing for your audience to go through that many then it really doesn't matter as long as entertainment occurs. Out of interest, you say you do these three in your opening but how many tricks do you perform during the main part of your act?

Without going into my full kids show breakdown,within THE FIRST 5 MINUTES,I perform appearing Straw,into bottle from Silks,into Airborne....
3 effects before I have even really started!!!!

you said this in your first post, could you expand on this statement please.

i should point out that I'm rarely employed as a magician I'm mostly hired as an entertainer so therefore my tricks are expanded with patter and annecdotes and form only part of a bigger story.

when i do an outdoor army / navy day in a tent then i would go through my whole set as listed above in under 10 mins for the passing croud.

so i'd have to say horses for courses as i think on both occsassions i give value for money.

I do not perform yet (paid to perform) however I believe that there are many different types of performances.

In a kid's show, the performer is there to entertain the kids with magic. If the quality of the perfomances is good, the kids will probably think WOW! and even wouldnt' really be keeping count of the number of tricks. The importance of a kid's show is to keep the kids laughing and entertained almost constantly! Never let them not be a part of the show!

For adult performances, I don't like stage routines. I'm more into mellow settings. It would be sitting down with a couple of friends or in a fancy bar (when I'm older) and start talking a bit. Then perform a few tricks mainly with more patter! With kids, you don't need much patter as they probably won't understand the main jist of what you're saying. With adults or teens, they'll understand and this vastly improves your tricks with your day to day conversational skills with your magic!

StEvEbO!

I think some of you guys have gone a little bit off the mark with this,I am NOT saying that the kids entertainer has to perform 101 tricks in a hour,and no I don't feel that either the kids orthe parents are sitting there counting the number of tricks I do,however,I do believe that you should be performing more than just 6 tricks in a whole hour.
Alot of guys will and have disagreed with me,and this is just my own personal view,if I was a parent paying for example £100 + for a kids performer,and all he did was half a dozen tricks,no matter how much the kids laughed or clapped,I would want abit more for my money.
In his excellent book "Big laughs forlittle people" Samuel Patrick Smith writes that too many childrens entertainers,fill their show with silly patter and pad it out,and not alot of Magic is going on,he states that within a 30 to 40 minute show, (Not a hour) that you should be doing between 8 to 12
tricks.In the Jack Delvin Video "Children are Magic",he states that alot of kids entertainers perform what he calls "Silly Sausage" Magic,where in fact,no Magic is really happening at all,and goes on to say,that you should try and make your show "Disney like",full of excitement,and lots of colour,and this is indeed what I aim for with my own show...

Chubby Harris wrote:Alot of guys will and have disagreed with me,and this is just my own personal view,if I was a parent paying for example £100 + for a kids performer,and all he did was half a dozen tricks,no matter how much the kids laughed or clapped,I would want abit more for my money.

I disagree here, actually. The point of hiring an entertainer is to entertain!. The parents don't mind how many different effects are done, the point is to amuse the kids and keep them occupied for an hour or so. If you can do this with one spongeball routine, IMHO that's OK.

You will probably have to have several effects though, as I doubt that there is any performer on earth who could keep kids entertained for an hour with one trick!

Kati

Sorry Kati,but I am going to stand my ground on this one.......
Amazing how many PMs I have had backing me up,come on doing just 2-3 effects in a hours show,and expecting the booker to be fine about it?,lets get real guys....I don't think so!!!!!......

Chubby Harris wrote:Sorry Kati,but I am going to stand my ground on this one.......
Amazing how many PMs I have had backing me up...

Also, if you're awash with PMs, why are people not supporting your idea in the thread?

...come on doing just 2-3 effects in a hours show,and expecting the booker to be fine about it?,lets get real guys....I don't think so!!!!!......

Hey, lighten up!

As an observation, if I were to hire Derren Brown for my one hour after wedding party, and he did 3 effects, I would be MORE than happy because I would KNOW that my hour had been entertaining!

We're all just airing opinions here—nobody is suggesting what is right or wrong. But, a PERFORMANCE is different for each and every PERFORMER... it's all to do with your overall delivery.

Who cares if you get 3, 10 or 100 effects an hour? I'd rather have an hour's worth of good solid entertainment with 3 effects than a boring waste of an hour crammed to the hilt with quick-fire effects.

But that's just me. And some of the best kid's show's I've seen (at holiday parks, nephew's birthdays etc) are the simplest ones. In fact, on one occasion, I remember a comedy magic clown who's whole show consisted of nothing more than a very long audience participation 'Professor's Nightmare' routine and superb audience participation version of a sponge ball routine. 2 routines, about an 3/4 hour.
And let me just say, the kids were begging the guy not to go. And to a parent, that is priceless.

Please, let's not turn this to an argument. Opinions count, just accept that everyone is different.