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Hello everyone. I was just wondering if anyone knew of a good book or even DVD with good ways to force words. I know some NLP and such but I was looking for some good ideas of suggesting people to chose a specific word or maybe number. I know the basic stuff but the problem is, they are becoming to well known or obvious. Any ideas? Thanks!

I can recommend Theodore Anneman`s 202 ways of forcing. It will definitely help with ways to force words and numbers.

Although none of it in a modern sense. Mostly with aids, like billets etc.
I don`t know what might help, if you want to do it without aids i.e verbally

They are less obvious and well-known than you think, i did a simple colour force, using the counting letters thing to four people, and only onee questioned it.

Derren Brown has a few verbal forces, but you may already know about them. Check out his book 'Pure Effect', his DVD Devils Picturebook, or the Derren Brown Lecture (although its only a very brief part of this). He forces 3 Diamonds, 4 Hearts, Queen Hearts, Jack Spades all without any card handling.

Ok, here's the question:

When is it a force and when is it a suggestion?

Using a Svengali deck for example will guarrantee the card you want, but using NLP or other linguistic methods may not work (even sometimes for Derren) so to me that is not a force in the strictest sense of the word.

Discuss...

Roland wrote:Ok, here's the question:

When is it a force and when is it a suggestion?

Using a Svengali deck for example will guarrantee the card you want, but using NLP or other linguistic methods may not work (even sometimes for Derren) so to me that is not a force in the strictest sense of the word.

Discuss...

True, there is a chance it wont work. But if you've seen the Devils Picturebook the forces he uses are pretty solid, and he says hismelf that they work 90% of the time. You're not really suggesting a card to them, rather you're quite blatantly telling them which card but doing it in such an off hand manner that they dont notice. Its not as subtle as it seems!

I would say a force and a suggestion would be about the same thing. Sure suggestion doesn't always work, but neither do forces. For instance the classic force can be quite difficult for some to pull of. And really good 'suggestionists' can pull off the 'subliminial' card force (you know the one derren does with the hands) a majority of the time. I hit at about 90% with it unless I am just in a bad run or something.

I would say that a force is a class of its own and suggestion is a subclass.

1011

Paul Green has a video called "Classic Force". Definately worth looking into, as it covers various "outs" also. As far as I am aware, it's one of the most comprehensive teaching aids with regards the classic force..

Let's face it, if everyone could classic force, there'd be no need for other, slight more dubious looking (sometimes) forces...

That said, I can't classic force to save my life! Hehe..

~Sym~

I'll try something that's is kinda like a force:


Think of an author


"I want you to think of something elze..." (<---say what you see even if you think I spelt it wrong)

(don't question why I am saying it this is a way of forcing. It's kind of hit and miss)


Anyone know what author I wanted you to think about?

er... no.

Any mentalists want to give us a real example?

Was it Roald Dahl? George Orwell? Charles Dickens?

Orson Wells

There are plenty of examples of card verbal forces, just try and come up with some of your own. One I've use before for the 2H, with a good success rate is to ask them to think of a card but 'I dont want you to think too hard about it - whatever pops in to your head'. With appropriate mis-pronunciation and hand signs to emphasise words subconsciously you have 'I want you to think TWO HEART about it - whatever pops in TWO HEART'. Obviously you dont say heart so blatanlty, just subtly mispronounce your words. Gesture to emphasise them too. Generally works ok for me, but cant guarantee it would work for everyone!

I get it now - doesn't really work when it's typed out. Is that how you reckon Derren Brown did it, David?

Reviewing that last statement, it doesn't really work. Full stop.

I think derren brown would be quite interested to know that the "someone elsez" doesnt work. Seeing as how its part of his working act.

Considering the fact that "something elze" was typed, and not "someone elze," and also the fact that it's typed to a computer screen instead of said aloud in a performance situation, I'm sure he'd agree with me that "something elze" doesn't work.

And is it really part of his working act? I don't remember it as part of his tour this year. It was on one of his TV shows. But only one.

Maybe I'm even wrong about it not working.

Or maybe the point I was making is that you can't just type out a verbal force (spot the use of the word verbal there - it needs to be spoken), incorrectly, on an internet forum and expect it to work - it won't.