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I can do the downs palm, however, the coins always flash whenever I do them. For example, I do it with my right hand, as I'm right handed. Bobo's says to do it with the left, but nither works for me. Whenever I try to do the upwards tossing motion, the coin is flashed. I'm guessing it also seems a bit unnatural to turn my hand around 180 degrees to flash the coin. I just need a technique to do it better. Someone here mentioned to make a closed fist when it is being brought down, and palm it there. Still, it's in plain sight. Reading a book on magic and making sense of it is very difficult for me. What level do you suggest I'd be at? I don't have a webcam (Didn't get one for my birthday) and I'm saving my money for a trip to Japan.

I also think it would be extremely helpful for any coin sleight of hand experts to describe their method of the Downs Palm.

Thanks for the help.

I'm certainly no sleight of hand expert, and I don't use downs much, but as I understand it, what you should be trying to do is limit its angliness by always making sure that the plane made by your thumb and index finger is in line with your spectators line of sight.

When you have to show the front angle of the hand, you can connect your finger and thumb briefly as if pinching something, which covers the front view. It is pretty angly though.

If using it to make coins appear, you may be better off reaching with your clean hand first, and "missing" grabbing the coin - thus taking the heat off your palming hand which can then produce the coin.

You could also try using less shiny coins - if you don't need the shininess for retention type effects, or try dropping the coin into the fist to produce it (literally make a fist around the coin, then open the fist) - it will look less like a clean fingertip-type production, but shouldn't flash.

You probably know this already, but I'm not sure what else to suggest.

Accidently quote.

I've been doing a bit more research on Downs' palm, and it seems that there are references to two different methods - lower Downs', and upper Downs'. (Arthur Buckley refers to them in "Principles and Deceptions" as first and second method).

Lower Downs' palm (Buckley reference - first method) is the position you get when placing a coin (or stack of coins) between the middle and ring finger, and curling the fingers in to the crotch of the thumb.

Upper Downs' palm (second method) is the position you get into by placing a coin between index and middle fingers, and curling them in. This is the version detailed in Bobo, and the one I had assumed was "standard" Downs' palm.

They have different angle considerations, for example the upper Downs' palm is more likely to flash over the back of the hand. Also you may find one is more comfortable than the other, especially for the production.

It may be worth practicing each, and trying out which is more comfortable and less angly for a particular effect.

cheers,
steve

Steverino wrote:I've been doing a bit more research on Downs' palm, and it seems that there are references to two different methods - lower Downs', and upper Downs'. (Arthur Buckley refers to them in "Principles and Deceptions" as first and second method).

Lower Downs' palm (Buckley reference - first method) is the position you get when placing a coin (or stack of coins) between the middle and ring finger, and curling the fingers in to the crotch of the thumb.

Upper Downs' palm (second method) is the position you get into by placing a coin between index and middle fingers, and curling them in. This is the version detailed in Bobo, and the one I had assumed was "standard" Downs' palm.

They have different angle considerations, for example the upper Downs' palm is more likely to flash over the back of the hand. Also you may find one is more comfortable than the other, especially for the production.

It may be worth practicing each, and trying out which is more comfortable and less angly for a particular effect.

cheers,
steve

Interesting. I didn't know about the first method. I can't seem to do it yet, I'm used to using Bobo's method. I'll try it.

For the click pass, is there anyway I can back thumb palm the coin (and curl the right hand into a fist) without flashing the coin?

Not sure, but probably if you practice it enough.

When I try it, I find it difficult to get into position quickly enough withough fumbling, and making it obvious that something is going on.
If it helps, it seems to be easier to get into Downs' (upper) from that position, or standard thumb palm.

Now if only I could get my tenkai to consistently not flash. Getting in and out of it's no problem, but turning the hand around without flashing is very hit and miss.